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Old 12-01-2013, 06:52 AM
 
Location: By the sea, by the sea, by the beautiful sea
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Quote:
Originally Posted by sleepless in Bham View Post
Nick Saban was playing for the win, which wasnt a bad call because Bama couldnt stop the Auburn rushing attack. Who was to say that they could stop Auburn in overtime?. Losing this game falls on our kicking game which was pathetic at best.
The defense allowed Auburn to be tied late in the 4th quarter, that's not the kicking game's fault. It's not unusual for a game between two equal teams to be decided on one huge play, that's just the way it is.
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Old 12-01-2013, 08:18 AM
 
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Quote:
Originally Posted by CHIP72 View Post
I thought Nick Saban's decision to try a field goal on that last play was extraordinarily stupid, considering Alabama had struggled with its kicking game all game. Alabama should have just tried a Hail Mary pass or settled for overtime in that spot, and I'm not just saying that in hindsight - I was saying Alabama's decision was stupid before the play even occurred due to the possibility of a blocked kick or a missed kick returned for a touchdown.
Yes, it was a stupid move. Also, trying to run up the middle when you only lacked one yard getting a first down was stupid. The same play had just failed, and we did it again. It makes you wonder what Saban was thinking. Ugh. Roll Tide anyway, but we did not deserve that game, and Auburn did.
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Old 12-01-2013, 10:51 AM
 
6,349 posts, read 8,394,085 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by CHIP72 View Post
With the problems Alabama had in the kicking game against Auburn, there was a decent chance the FG attempt gets blocked. If that happens, there was a chance the blocked kick gets returned for a touchdown.

Here's the real way to look at that final play from Alabama's point of view - do you have a better chance of completing a Hail Mary pass from the Auburn 40 yard line, or do you have a better chance of making a 57 yard FG (a FG length even NFL kickers make less than half the time) with your backup, freshman kicker who has attempted two field goals all season (and has a career long of 20 yards) AND you've had problems in the kicking game all night, including a blocked kick on your last FG attempt? With the problems Alabama was having in its kicking game, I think the Hail Mary pass has a better chance of being successful. More importantly, a Hail Mary pass has a lower chance of something disastrous happening for Alabama - Auburn probably rushes only 3 or 4 guys, and the odds of a sack, fumble, and return for a touchdown in that situation, or having the Hail Mary pass intercepted and returned for a touchdown, are very, very low, definitely much lower IMO than a blocked FG on a very long attempt or a missed FG returned for a touchdown. If you're Alabama, you want to eliminate the disastrous play scenario from consideration and go to overtime if you can't complete (what would have been in either the Hail Mary or FG attempt scenario) a very low percentage play to win the game.
I have to disagree. Hail Marys get picked all the time. Much more than Field goals get blocked.

You are condemning someone off things that almost never happen. It is easy to be an armchair coach after the game and go, "they shoulda done this." However during the game the possibility is so remote it wasnt worth it. Saban was playing conservative football, which is what most coaches would have done. 56 yards is not impossible for field goal, although it is hard. 99.9% of the time the other team wont even get the ball and when they do it is rare to return it for a TD. So it was a longshot but if you do make it you win the game. Most couches would have done the exact same thing. Had they made it nobody would be talking about how risky this was because let's face it a long FG is usually not risky.
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Old 12-01-2013, 12:40 PM
 
Location: Silver Spring, MD/Washington DC
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Hail Mary passes may often get intercepted, but when was the last time you saw a Hail Mary pass get intercepted and returned for a touchdown? I don't think I've ever seen that happen, and I've watched NFL and college football games for 30+ (!) years now. I have seen field goal attempts that are short get returned for touchdowns however.

The bottom line is that Nick Saban was an absolute moron for trying a play that had a chance of ending in disaster for Alabama. And I'm not saying that in hindsight - when the game was occurring I thought attempting the field goal was extremely stupid.
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Old 12-01-2013, 12:54 PM
 
Location: Parts Unknown, Northern California
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Quote:
Originally Posted by CHIP72 View Post
Hail Mary passes may often get intercepted, but when was the last time you saw a Hail Mary pass get intercepted and returned for a touchdown? I don't think I've ever seen that happen, and I've watched NFL and college football games for 30+ (!) years now. I have seen field goal attempts that are short get returned for touchdowns however.

The bottom line is that Nick Saban was an absolute moron for trying a play that had a chance of ending in disaster for Alabama.
What you have seen or not seen is anecdotal. Unless you have some data which has tracked field goals returned for touchdowns and compared that rate to hail Mary interceptions returned for touchdowns, you are not in any position to state which is the more risky play. Further, even if you determined that the field goal attempt was more risky, the data might show that it is an extremely low risk.

Consequently you are not in a position to call the coach a moron for making a decision which you are evaluating only with the hindsight that this particular time, it backfired. I suspect that if the field goal try had been good and Alabama had prevailed in the game, you would not be on this forum writing about what a fool he was for trying so risky a play.
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Old 12-01-2013, 12:57 PM
 
Location: Metro Birmingham, AL
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Im wondering where was Kenyon Drake, the more explosive running back for Bama in the second half?. He wasnt injured.
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Old 12-01-2013, 01:15 PM
 
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One of the best games ever deserves one of the best pieces of sports writing ever. To wit:

The 2013 Iron Bowl: Auburn should be dead, because we watched it die - SBNation.com
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Old 12-01-2013, 05:05 PM
 
6,349 posts, read 8,394,085 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by CHIP72 View Post
Hail Mary passes may often get intercepted, but when was the last time you saw a Hail Mary pass get intercepted and returned for a touchdown? I don't think I've ever seen that happen, and I've watched NFL and college football games for 30+ (!) years now. I have seen field goal attempts that are short get returned for touchdowns however.

The bottom line is that Nick Saban was an absolute moron for trying a play that had a chance of ending in disaster for Alabama. And I'm not saying that in hindsight - when the game was occurring I thought attempting the field goal was extremely stupid.
When was the last time you saw someone kick a short field goal and saw it returned for a TD? I believe this was the first time I have ever seen that, although I have very rarely seen someone block a FG and run it for a TD. However, I have seen hail mary's get picked and returned for a TD on a number of occasions much more than I saw field goals result in a TD.

Secondly at 56 yards a field goal is much more likely to score than a hail mary.
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Old 12-01-2013, 05:12 PM
 
6,349 posts, read 8,394,085 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Grandstander View Post
What you have seen or not seen is anecdotal. Unless you have some data which has tracked field goals returned for touchdowns and compared that rate to hail Mary interceptions returned for touchdowns, you are not in any position to state which is the more risky play. Further, even if you determined that the field goal attempt was more risky, the data might show that it is an extremely low risk.

Consequently you are not in a position to call the coach a moron for making a decision which you are evaluating only with the hindsight that this particular time, it backfired. I suspect that if the field goal try had been good and Alabama had prevailed in the game, you would not be on this forum writing about what a fool he was for trying so risky a play.
Well to be fair I am not using statistics either. However, I agree with you that Saban did nothing wrong. With 1 second left a field goal is a better decision IMO at 56 yards when the game is tied. While they are hard to make it is definitely possible and 56 yard field goals happen all the time and they are hard to block. A hail mary might get them a first but with 1 second they needed to score, the chances of that happening are probably very small. Furthermore they can be picked easily.

I do suspect that if they went with a hail mary and Auburn got it and scored the same people would be complaining that he should have went with a field goal. Either one is a longshot but with one second the chance of Auburn getting the ball and scoring is very very low with either. Most of the time you would either score and win the game or not make it and go into overtime. I dont think, and other people seem to agree, that Saban did anything reckless or risky. The reason everyone is so impressed is because what happened was so unlikely it is incredible. This is a history book finish.

It was just an amazing play by Auburn. I imagine even Alabama fans have to give them kudos for that.
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Old 12-01-2013, 06:03 PM
 
Location: Birmingham
11,787 posts, read 13,366,809 times
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Ha yeah right. They should fire Saban for some freak lucky play that cost them the game when they had ample opportunity to put them away earlier. It never should have came down to that and by letting them hang around to that point made me realize the probablity was high that Bama would lose.

No. Saban is an awesome coach and sometimes BS just happens. Ive seen more NCs in the past four years then some fans of other teams have seen in their whole lives. I can live with that.

Im still curious as to why Malzahn declined the pre game interview with Wolfson. I of course knew hed have no trouble finding a camera after Auburn had.won.
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