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Old 12-04-2017, 08:30 AM
 
Location: Crooklyn, New York
28,305 posts, read 26,308,417 times
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Surprised no one has mentioned the atrocious playcalling at the end of the B1G championship game.

Wisconsin got called for holding, which made it 1st and 20. They lost possession on a 4th and 20. How does that happen? They called a screen pass on 3rd and 20, which was dropped, but that's a 1st or 2nd down play, not a 3rd down play.

That type of playcalling should cost you a job. Everyone here has probably watched enough football to know that you run some type of draw or quick pass play to get back yardage after a penalty. Wisconsin even had a timeout left. That was awful.

 
Old 12-04-2017, 08:38 AM
 
Location: Crooklyn, New York
28,305 posts, read 26,308,417 times
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Final plays at the end of the game.

1st and 20 - Incomplete Pass outside the hashes

2nd and 20 - Incomplete pass, DB makes a good hit and jars the ball loose

3rd and 20 - Screen pass thrown behind receiver that likely would have resulted in a loss anyway

4th and 20 - Interception


https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=UHFdZ8gtEEg
 
Old 12-04-2017, 08:55 AM
 
9,447 posts, read 7,128,216 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by MinivanDriver View Post
Yep. Last year, they somehow finagled their way in over Penn State, then totally wet the bed losing to Clemson 31-3. Don't you know that was in the back of the mind of the committee?

31-0.


And, my opinion, I put that more on the coaching staff. That month-long layoff.. Some teams just can't keep the passion up through that.


Everyone can say that there's no way it would happen again, but I don't think many people thought Clemson would blow out Miami again, either.





Quote:
Originally Posted by BajanYankee View Post
Final plays at the end of the game.

1st and 20 - Incomplete Pass outside the hashes

2nd and 20 - Incomplete pass, DB makes a good hit and jars the ball loose

3rd and 20 - Screen pass thrown behind receiver that likely would have resulted in a loss anyway

4th and 20 - Interception

Yeah.. I was putting it more on the QB there, but, you have a point.. He looked lost on that final possession. I was mainly watching the Clemson game for some reason (It was basically over at halftime, but you didn't KNOW it was over until the 3rd) so I didn't see the whole game. The Wisconsin offense looked totally overmatched from when I started watching, which was with 5 minutes to go. I'm just not sure whether it was the playcalling or what was available. When you see 4 straight incompletions like that.. I was thinking he was going to checkdown receivers, other than that last pass, which was 10 yards past the intended target, who was pretty well covered, but.. What you gonna do? Throw it away on 4th down?


The throws he made on that drive were just bad from what I recall (All the games are merging together at this point, so, hopefully I'm not confusing two) but I think the 1st down pass was behind the receiver and nearly picked off?



My opinion, i'm putting it more on the QB than the playcalls, but.. I won't argue that hard with you. Maybe it was big game jitters.. I haven't seen Wisconsin play this year other than highlights.
 
Old 12-04-2017, 09:06 AM
 
Location: Crooklyn, New York
28,305 posts, read 26,308,417 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Labonte18 View Post
Everyone can say that there's no way it would happen again, but I don't think many people thought Clemson would blow out Miami again, either.
Clemson is way better than them this year even without Watson.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Labonte18 View Post
My opinion, i'm putting it more on the QB than the playcalls, but.. I won't argue that hard with you. Maybe it was big game jitters.. I haven't seen Wisconsin play this year other than highlights.
The problem was that they were all very long throws. Not in a vertical sense, but in the sense that they were still vertical passes being thrown from the opposite hash mark to the sideline. Sure, that's a cinch for Aaron Rodgers, but that's not a play you can expect a college QB to consistently make in clutchtime.

The smart thing to do would have been to call a draw on 1st and 20 to gain 5-7 yards. Ideally, you'd get about 7-8, but any positive gain would have been better than no gain. The idea is to make your 4th down manageable: 4th and 5, 4th and 7, 4th and 9. Even 4th and 15 would have been better. I put that one on the playcaller 100% because the goal in that situation is to go with the plays that have the highest probability of yielding positive yardage. Those plays weren't called.
 
Old 12-04-2017, 10:08 AM
 
2,841 posts, read 1,785,417 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by BajanYankee View Post
Surprised no one has mentioned the atrocious playcalling at the end of the B1G championship game.

Wisconsin got called for holding, which made it 1st and 20. They lost possession on a 4th and 20. How does that happen? They called a screen pass on 3rd and 20, which was dropped, but that's a 1st or 2nd down play, not a 3rd down play.

That type of playcalling should cost you a job. Everyone here has probably watched enough football to know that you run some type of draw or quick pass play to get back yardage after a penalty. Wisconsin even had a timeout left. That was awful.
They couldn't run the ball on Ohio State. They couldn't make throws down the field.


If I'm a Badger fan I'm upset by not making the TE more of the focal point on seam routes up the field and not utilizing the jet sweep more. Both are plays that even if they don't work they keep safeties and defensive ends honest.


Wisconsin burned OSU last year with the Jet sweep. I saw ONE jet sweep. At the very least you get 3-4 yards and you keep the D ends honest by making the them protect and seal their ends and maybe that opens the inside run more.


I thought Wisconsin correctly scouted OSU. The OSU D brings twists and stunts and blitzes, they have LBs that are weaker than most teams in coverage. The screen was the correct call but poorly executed. Other screens worked decently well, although Jerome Baker made a huge tackle on one that looked to be set-up perfectly.


I thought it was apparent that OSU D schemed well and had more talent with the OSU D vs. Wisconsin O matchup- having that it is hard for things to work. Schiano had a great game in the face of a lot of distraction/adversity this week.


Wisconsin Offense is not geared for 1st and 20 no matter the call no matter the opponent and 1st and 20 for OSU team is right in their wheel house.
 
Old 12-04-2017, 10:47 AM
 
Location: Crooklyn, New York
28,305 posts, read 26,308,417 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by eastcoastbias View Post
They couldn't run the ball on Ohio State. They couldn't make throws down the field.
Wisconsin Offense is not geared for 1st and 20 no matter the call no matter the opponent and 1st and 20 for OSU team is right in their wheel house.
You can run the ball on any team. You just can't run the ball when the other team is stacking the box and expecting the run. 1st and 20 is the perfect time for a draw because you know the defense has to play the pass.

Anybody who has spent more than an hour in their life watching football knows that you don't try to get back yardage with a few long throws. You chip away at it with a run or a draw on 1st down, a screen on 2nd down, a quick hitch on 3rd down. You don't have to get 15 yards on each attempt because you're already in 4 down territory anyway. The goal in that situation is to get to a manageable 3rd or 4th down and Wisconsin's coaching staff clearly failed in that regard.

And it's not like the playcalling was being dictated by the clock. They were on their 47 yard line with 1:27 to go and a timeout. That's more than enough time to call a run play to at least try to make back some of the 10 yards they lost.
 
Old 12-04-2017, 11:01 AM
 
3,723 posts, read 3,889,081 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Carolina Knight View Post
ESPN and Alabama disagree with you. ESPN needs the ratings. It operates the SEC Network. It has influence on which four teams participate for the national championship. Alabama is ESPN and the SEC Network's biggest draw for college football.

Nick Saban's interview on ESPN Sunday was slanted toward Alabama. That is no surprise.

Ohio State won a conference championship. Alabama did nothing this season.
I did find it interesting that they had Saban on Game Day stumping for Alabama and then Scott van Pelt had him on that night to stump again for them to get in. Why didn't Clay Helton get some air time to stump for his team? If he did on ESPN then I missed it.


Anyways, this year, like last year, only goes to show that we need an 8 team playoff. It's a shame that 2 power 5 conferences get left out. Last year I thought Penn State deserved to be in over Ohio State. At least in that case a Big Ten team got in so only 1 power 5 conference was left out.
 
Old 12-04-2017, 11:03 AM
 
2,841 posts, read 1,785,417 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by BajanYankee View Post
You can run the ball on any team. You just can't run the ball when the other team is stacking the box and expecting the run. 1st and 20 is the perfect time for a draw because you know the defense has to play the pass.

Anybody who has spent more than an hour in their life watching football knows that you don't try to get back yardage with a few long throws. You chip away at it with a run or a draw on 1st down, a screen on 2nd down, a quick hitch on 3rd down. You don't have to get 15 yards on each attempt because you're already in 4 down territory anyway. The goal in that situation is to get to a manageable 3rd or 4th down and Wisconsin's coaching staff clearly failed in that regard.

And it's not like the playcalling was being dictated by the clock. They were on their 47 yard line with 1:27 to go and a timeout. That's more than enough time to call a run play to at least try to make back some of the 10 yards they lost.
You don't think OSU defense plays to those well known tendencies that you point out? When you get out schemed and you don't have the better players you have to break typical down and distance tendencies. Besides the plays I mentioned you'd almost need a trick play as well. Hard to execute offense given the circumstances that went on

I was more upset with what they didn't do prior to that drive. The two plays I pointed out could have made a draw play produce results. I saw Bosa and Lewis crashing inside hard all game. One effective jet sweep freezes the DE created space inside and calms the passrush a bit

I've watched Wisconsin play BYU, Iowa and Michigan this season this is not a team that has executed on 2nd and 20 - they didn't need to that often this year. Their offense is setup when they make 5 on first down.
 
Old 12-04-2017, 11:04 AM
 
3,723 posts, read 3,889,081 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by BajanYankee View Post
Surprised no one has mentioned the atrocious playcalling at the end of the B1G championship game.

Wisconsin got called for holding, which made it 1st and 20. They lost possession on a 4th and 20. How does that happen? They called a screen pass on 3rd and 20, which was dropped, but that's a 1st or 2nd down play, not a 3rd down play.

That type of playcalling should cost you a job. Everyone here has probably watched enough football to know that you run some type of draw or quick pass play to get back yardage after a penalty. Wisconsin even had a timeout left. That was awful.
It's college football - you have atrocious play calling all over the place, plus gimmick offenses being run. That's the main reason why so few players at the QB position come into the NFL and can be successful in their first 2-3 seasons. Look at the Big 12 title game. TCU, down by 17 with less than 8 minutes to go in the 4th, opts to run the ball on second down and on 3rd and 8, then try a read option play that promptly gets blown up. Mississippi State did the same thing against Alabama a few weeks back - their play calling cost them the lead and the game.
 
Old 12-04-2017, 11:29 AM
 
Location: Around and about
580 posts, read 377,895 times
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The columnist is a bit of a pot stirrer but he makes a great point.
If Auburn doesn't blow a 20-0 lead against LSU, then there would have been no Alabama vs.OSU for the 4th seed debate.

AL.com All-Access: LSU kept Auburn out of the playoff and put Alabama in | AL.com.
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