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Ugh, what is a 5.0 GPA? Can't we just say 4.0? People get a bonus for taking hard (AP, IB, whatever) classes on their GPA? The reward for taking hard classes should come from within. While it's pretty easy to translate 5.0 down to 4.0, people who should really have a 3.4 GPA but "get" a 3.9 or whatever because of their APs make things pretty absurd.
Pretty good SAT, not amazing though.
Last edited by toobusytoday; 04-06-2015 at 05:03 AM..
Reason: fixed typo
But let's just say, for the sake of argument (and simplicity), that the bottom 35% of students admitted to the Ivy league schools were admitted with an SAT score of 2100-. If he had a 35% chance of getting admitted to each school, that would give him an overall probability of about 0.02% of being admitted to all eight Ivy league schools. You still want to claim that race wasn't a factor?
You're focusing on solely the SAT score, which is not meaningful on it's own. What is the median SAT score of a straight A student with these AP scores, who is also an artist in three instruments and a star athlete? Heck, what's the average SAT score at ivies for star athletes?
No one is questioning the fact that schools take diversity into consideration. They do and they should.
What's interesting about this student is that he made it into these great schools without having to rely on diversity factors. Had he been white with the exact same criteria, he would have yielded the same results. He's an extraordinary student.
Ugh, wtf is 5.0 GPA. Can't we just say 4.0? People get a bonus for taking hard (AP, IB, whatever) classes on their GPA? The reward for taking hard classes should come from within. While it's pretty easy to translate 5.0 down to 4.0, people who should really have a 3.4 GPA but "get" a 3.9 or whatever because of their APs make things pretty absurd.
Pretty good SAT, not amazing though.
GPA's aren't that meaningful... that's why they're often weighted. Universities can just as easily look at how many challenging courses a student took... but the weighted GPA just calculates it within the number. It's a demonstration of aptitude more than it is grade point average (and as you suggest, perhaps it shouldn't be).
High school is pretty much a joke in this country. You can basically sleep your way through high school and get a 3.8. If your 3.8 is really a 3.3 or 3.4 but you took APs... just let the adcoms read your transcript and see if you took hard classes, just like grad schools do. Grad schools can see that you took a few grad classes, and you don't get a 5.0 for an A in those grad classes.
My high school didn't have any AP or IB stuff. I took a Calculus class at a nearby college and got an A. Weighted GPAs are just stupid. Give an honest GPA, and give the student a sticker for taking APs. Difficulty of school and course schedule can be ascertained without giving a ridiculous weighted GPA.
High school is pretty much a joke in this country. You can basically sleep your way through high school and get a 3.8. If your 3.8 is really a 3.3 or 3.4 but you took APs... just let the adcoms read your transcript and see if you took hard classes, just like grad schools do. Grad schools can see that you took a few grad classes, and you don't get a 5.0 for an A in those grad classes.
My high school didn't have any AP or IB stuff. I took a Calculus class at a nearby college and got an A. Weighted GPAs are just stupid. Give an honest GPA, and give the student a sticker for taking APs. Difficulty of school and course schedule can be ascertained without giving a ridiculous weighted GPA.
I very much disagree with your comment. High Schools vary a lot across the country, which is why so much weight is given on standardized tests such as the AP's, SAT's and ACT's. Grades are weighted so that kids that take the easy classes don't end up with the same GPA's as the kids that take the very hard classes. You should be rewarded for your hard work. I know how much more reading and writing was required for AP classes that my kids took.
I think this is an exceptionally talented young man who worked hard in HS. And yes, he was given a nudge for being non-white. Every child from Alaska is given a geographical bump when they apply to any college, because all colleges want to have students from far away. Athletes are given bumps. My son the Eagle Scout was given credit for that. Getting accepted to colleges is not just about GPA's and test scores. This student just had everything.
2100 SAT wouldn't do jack for a suburban white kid.
I agree
Quote:
Originally Posted by NJBest
You're focusing on solely the SAT score, which is not meaningful on it's own. What is the median SAT score of a straight A student with these AP scores, who is also an artist in three instruments and a star athlete? Heck, what's the average SAT score at ivies for star athletes?
No one is questioning the fact that schools take diversity into consideration. They do and they should.
What's interesting about this student is that he made it into these great schools without having to rely on diversity factors. Had he been white with the exact same criteria, he would have yielded the same results. He's an extraordinary student.
2100 would not get a look for most kids in the country, even athletes. He got into ALL of those schools because he could check the URM box along with having reasonable scores. I agree that the GPA is pretty meaningless without knowing what classes he took and a 5.0 with all AP's should score higher than 2100...so, we will see....
There was a student last year that was also accepted into all the Ivy's. He, however is not from a poor family, but also was a URM. He had a 2250 SAT and is a freshman at Yale.
SAT doesn't play that big of a role compared to the 5.0 GPA, 3 instruments and a sport. 2100 falls within the largest distribution (about 1/4th of the student body) of Ivy league students (albeit in the lower end). So it's not an unusual score at all. Looking at Brown, specifically, about 35% of students have below a 2100.
Equal opportunity means that everyone who meets a certain level of merit has equal opportunity for admission. If you look at the admissions of Ivy league universities, this student's SAT score is right smack in the middle or within 2 deviations. So he didn't need any other help than his merit.
Let's be honest, he's a bright kid. It's a shame he wants to go to Yale or Brown.
Yet you can be sure a fair number of his fellow students in those exclusive schools would remind him regularly that he doesn't really belong. Just look at some of the reactions on this thread. Even at public universities, the Black students get attitude from White students based on assumptions they got in on some special dispensation.
2100 would not get a look for most kids in the country, even athletes. He got into ALL of those schools because he could check the URM box along with having reasonable scores. I agree that the GPA is pretty meaningless without knowing what classes he took and a 5.0 with all AP's should score higher than 2100...so, we will see....
There was a student last year that was also accepted into all the Ivy's. He, however is not from a poor family, but also was a URM. He had a 2250 SAT and is a freshman at Yale.
Students from private schools get a lot of coaching on how to take standardized tests, they are taught test-taking strategy, and they get practice at taking the SAT. They get to take it once as a trial run in their junior year, typically. Then they take it again in their senior year, for their school applications. Oakland schools don't provide all that training, so the scores of students from there will reflect that.
Why can't we just be happy for these kids, and congratulate them for their achievements? The Ivy League has enough wealthy white kids who get in based on family ties and legacies. Here is another recent story:
Ugh, what is a 5.0 GPA? Can't we just say 4.0? People get a bonus for taking hard (AP, IB, whatever) classes on their GPA? The reward for taking hard classes should come from within. While it's pretty easy to translate 5.0 down to 4.0, people who should really have a 3.4 GPA but "get" a 3.9 or whatever because of their APs make things pretty absurd.
Pretty good SAT, not amazing though.
5.0 GPA, that school must have had honors gym.
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