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I haven't looked into this myself, but a social studies teacher told our high school class that the Soviet Union went into a cultural Dark Age. While they devoted a lot of funding to the sciences, they eventually fell behind the U.S. I've read that, while China takes math and science education very seriously, they aren't even close to being as innovative and imaginative as Americans. Steve Jobs explained why the humanities were important for the technology field. Not only do people want products that look cool, but there is an artistic component to designing apps and websites that are visually appealing and are user friendly. Actually, behavioral science has a part in this too. Cognitive psychology is used in the IT field. The DoD has psychologists who work with pilots and engineers.
No. The USSR and China did not "go into a Dark Age." They didn't "eventually fall behind"--they were already behind, far behind. Both the USSR and China were generations behind the US even at the start of the 20th century in both basic technology as well as technological infrastructure. They were essentially still serfdoms.
In the latter half of the 20th century, they put effort and resources into certain facets of industrialization, but held themselves back (or took wrong directions) in other areas for political reasons. Neither nation actually suppressed the Humanities as such--that is, they did a lot of education in the Humanities--but they had twisted their Humanities to fit a specific political paradigm.
For instance, both countries killed off their real economists, anthropologists, and even biologists and replaced them with Communist theory hacks. Yes, they still taught art in Soviet schools, but as one of their artists complained, "I'd like to paint a bouquet of flowers without it having to bear a political message."
Back in the 90s, my daughter spend a year in South Korea attending a special international college program. Her room mate was a girl from China, a math major. When that girl discovered that my daughter was the child of a military retiree and a political science major, the Chinese student was daunted...apparently Chinese students can't simply decide to study politics unless they're politically connected, such as having a father who is a military retiree (all Chinese military are Party members).
The US faces a huge problem with Humanities here also being twisted for political purposes, although the twisting is being done from two directions, left and right.
STEM is much more about imagination than about absorbing absolute knowledge, at least once you get past the standard freshman classes. And certainly on the research level.
A major that requires little creativity would be, I don't know, accounting?
That's been my observation.
So now you've generated and/or gathered a bunch of data. How to make sense of it all? What are the relevant conclusions to be drawn, and how can it be extrapolated to accurately answer the question(s) at hand? How can that possible answer be used in generating a solution or designing further, meaningful experiments? Many of these questions can not be answered by mathematical algorithms, but instead need more nuanced interpretations.
Per my experience, advanced research in science and engineering has always required applying your knowledge of the cold hard facts in conjunction with your more creative, soft skills.
Perhaps I've only known outliers, but I've known far more scientists and engineers who are adept in their knowledge of literature, poetry, music, and all the other arts and "humanities" than vice versa.
Perhaps I've only known outliers, but I've known far more scientists and engineers who are adept in their knowledge of literature, poetry, music, and all the other arts and "humanities" than vice versa.
Seems to be a pragmatic move in light of our changing societal needs in a global economy. I think this is a good assessment by Mr. Carnevale:
“We don’t want to take away Shakespeare. We’re just talking about helping people make good decisions,†he said. “You can’t be a lifelong learner if you’re not a lifelong earner.â€
They are not arguing that STEM in and of itself is "better" than the humanities, or that the humanities are irrelevant to a person's education; rather, they are arguing that there is a greater need in these current economic times for students to major in STEM fields in order to be better prepared for the jobs/careers of the future.
We are now competing with a global work force, with countries in which STEM is highly pushed and well supported for those students entering those field; with highly motivated students. Not addressing the validity of the whole need for immigration via H1B visas for perceived dearth of qualified applicants in certain job sectors, but surely many students are better served by gathering some top-notch STEM skills in conjunction with their studies in humanities and arts.
Seems to be a pragmatic move in light of our changing societal needs in a global economy. I think this is a good assessment by Mr. Carnevale:
“We don’t want to take away Shakespeare. We’re just talking about helping people make good decisions,†he said. “You can’t be a lifelong learner if you’re not a lifelong earner.â€
They are not arguing that STEM in and of itself is "better" than the humanities, or that the humanities are irrelevant to a person's education; rather, they are arguing that there is a greater need in these current economic times for students to major in STEM fields in order to be better prepared for the jobs/careers of the future.
We are now competing with a global work force, with countries in which STEM is highly pushed and well supported for those students entering those field; with highly motivated students. Not addressing the validity of the whole need for immigration via H1B visas for perceived dearth of qualified applicants in certain job sectors, but surely many students are better served by gathering some top-notch STEM skills in conjunction with their studies in humanities and arts.
There's not even a greater need for STEM jobs.
What happens is there an over surplus of people who get humanities degrees who are not skilled enough to apply these jobs. Liberal arts degrees are for people who want to teach, work in the arts, or go to law school. You need to demonstrate high a GPA and/or talent to do these things. If you're a C range sociology major with nothing going on for you, you'll end up doing secretarial work. That's not the fault of the liberal arts, that's the fault of a crappy candidate.
People try to blame others for all of their problems. So the government may be deciding to REDUCE the number of TALENTLESS people going out for these degrees from state schools since they are not going to be able to apply them.
What happens is there an over surplus of people who get humanities degrees who are not skilled enough to apply these jobs. Liberal arts degrees are for people who want to teach, work in the arts, or go to law school. You need to demonstrate high a GPA and/or talent to do these things. If you're a C range sociology major with nothing going on for you, you'll end up doing secretarial work. That's not the fault of the liberal arts, that's the fault of a crappy candidate.
People try to blame others for all of their problems. So the government may be deciding to REDUCE the number of TALENTLESS people going out for these degrees from state schools since they are not going to be able to apply them.
Even if they had the talent to locate applications, there aren't nearly enough applications to be located compared to the "sales" effort being made by the education industry. There is a surplus of even lawyers these days.
Society really needed that C sociology student (and even most of the A and B sociology students) to have learned how to build something, maintain something, or monitor something with a high level of technical expertise.
Even if they had the talent to locate applications, there aren't nearly enough applications to be located compared to the "sales" effort being made by the education industry. There is a surplus of even lawyers these days.
Society really needed that C sociology student (and even most of the A and B sociology students) to have learned how to build something, maintain something, or monitor something with a high level of technical expertise.
That C sociology student has a mind of his/her own. Perhaps that person has no interest in building something, maintaining something, or monitoring something with a high level of expertise. Perhaps that C sociology student will work as a bartender or waiter.)
No A sociology student needs to learn how to build something, maintain something, or monitor something.
Academia is confusing for blue collar people, because it obviously is nowhere near enough to just get a degree and boom, you got a miracle job.
I teach English to immigrants.
My undergraduate degree was in history and I had a good foreign language background. In order to teach ESL, I had to additionally take an ESL instructor class to get my permit to teach ESL. In order to stay in the field, I had to go to grad school and start work on my masters.
When I was completely my undergraduate degree at no point was I under the illusion that I would miraculously graduate and within two weeks get a good paying job. From the beginning I knew I would have to do grad school. I'm okay with that, and I like what I am doing. Society didn't pay for my education. I paid for it, and it's within my rights to study or do what I please with my money and my future.
That C sociology student has a mind of his/her own. Perhaps that person has no interest in building something, maintaining something, or monitoring something with a high level of expertise. Perhaps that C sociology student will work as a bartender or waiter.)
No A sociology student needs to learn how to build something, maintain something, or monitor something.
Academia is confusing for blue collar people, because it obviously is nowhere near enough to just get a degree and boom, you got a miracle job.
I teach English to immigrants.
My undergraduate degree was in history and I had a good foreign language background. In order to teach ESL, I had to additionally take an ESL instructor class to get my permit to teach ESL. In order to stay in the field, I had to go to grad school and start work on my masters.
When I was completely my undergraduate degree at no point was I under the illusion that I would miraculously graduate and within two weeks get a good paying job. From the beginning I knew I would have to do grad school. I'm okay with that, and I like what I am doing. Society didn't pay for my education. I paid for it, and it's within my rights to study or do what I please with my money and my future.
This thread is, however, specifically about society paying for that--in your words--"crappy candidate's" sociology degree. "He who pays the cost is the boss."
LPN's are nurses with associates degrees. RN's have bachelor degrees. There's often a difference between the duties of the two. To get a RN license you must have a bachelor's DEGREE.
As far as the secretarial/clerical jobs, agreed. All they generally need is a high school diploma or associates degree.
RNs usually have bachelors degrees. This can vary from state to state. In Alabama, an RN can have an Associate Degree.
This thread is, however, specifically about society paying for that--in your words--"crappy candidate's" sociology degree. "He who pays the cost is the boss."
Even there the Republicans were talking about cutting funding too, but not eliminating those departments at those state schools. So for anyone who wants to study humanities at the state schools, they will just have to pay MORE for it. But they are entitled to do that if they want to.
You can't make people study something they don't want to, no matter how much you fund it as they can always reject the funding and pay for what they want to study or not study at all.
And not everyone who doesn't want to go out for an academic, professional, or artistic careers wants to do the trades. There's office work, there's retail, there's restaurant/bar/hotel work, there's sales, there's customer service, etc.
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