Evidence that Colorado Springs is ultra-conservative? (Denver: live, residential, best)

[smdensbcs]

Originally Posted by ckdub

In addition, I am really not trying to beat a dead horse, Skies... On other threads, it seems that people make generalizations, but there is little real evidence to support the stereotype. I was wondering if I was missing something.

You're not missing anything. Some people, not all, simply like to make generalizations, especially negative generalizations. It makes them feel better about themselves to put down others, whether the "other" be a group of people or a city, region, state, nation, etc. It's not unlike many Europeans who like to label Americans as war-mongering racist gun-loving fundamentalists. Obviously, we're not all that, nor are all Colorado Springs residents ultra-conservative Christians, nor are all Muslims terrorists. I live in the Southwest part of Colorado Springs and of our group of 20+ nearby families we know well, only three or four of us go to church and maybe 1/3 vote republican. The large numbers of retired military who settle in CO Springs after putting in their 20 years tend to vote almost entirely republican. If you took that one single group out of the population here (not that we'd want to, as we love our retired military folks), I suspect you'd see an almost equally balanced voting pattern between democrat and republican.

Ultimately, you have to just decide how much a regions politics matter to you. My spouse and I lived in Santa Barbara, CA for a few years a while back and it voted 2/3 democrat. I knew LOTS of conservative republicans in Santa Barbara and they weren't all rushing to move to Texas or Alabama, etc. They LOVED living in Santa Barbara and had the means to do so and just sort of tolerated the liberal politics and the fact they'd likely never send a republican rep to Congress. Same thing here. 200,000+ democrats/progressives in El Paso County never make a county-wide majority, but they're not all moving to Boulder in despair, last I checked. Too many great things about living in Colorado Springs to allow politics alone to drive your behavior.

[Sonic_Spork]

Originally Posted by ckdub

...
I just hate to see negative ideas about a city circulate with apparently little evidence of truth.
...

Speaking of dead horses, need I say it? Nah...

People here do like to make rather silly judgments about different cities in the state, and different sides of town within the city, which are often only partially true, not really true, or outright ridiculous. This is one reason that some here will advise new residents to rent for a while, I think you really do need to make up your own mind and not rely on what you hear, even in these forums which are full of knowledgeable local viewpoints, people have their own biases.

I personally think that the atmosphere is overwhelmingly Libertarian here. Funny thing is, a lot of folks here don't even know it. They might think that they are Liberal because they support some Liberal political points, and are not particularly religious. They might think they are Conservative because they are anti-tax and pro-right to bear arms. But if you laid out all of the positions on all of the topics, mostly they come ideologically into the Libertarian camp, the true Libertarianism, not this tea-party nonsense. Meaning pro-liberty, freedoms, individual rights and choices, constitutionalism and States' rights. The wretchedly sad reality though, is that Americans everywhere seem to be basically brainwashed into thinking that R and D are the only valid options. That is a travesty. It should never have gotten to be like that. I keep hoping that with all the internet communication out there, people will break free of thinking what their mainstream media outlet of choice tells them to...but, here we are.

[CharlotteRJ]

FWIW, I think there's a difference between saying "it's my mission to make it liberal" and "it's starting to change to more liberal."

So far, I've been hanging out downtown, south west, and Manitou, and it feels pretty liberal to me. I'm sure when I venture further north it'll feel differently.

[colobill]

I have always thought of our city as bipolar. They have, and want to implement services that would be considered liberal, yet they stick to a very conservative budget and vote down almost all tax proposals. I think a lot of the conflict, division, and budget issues are a result of this. Sometimes it seems like we want it all, but we don't want to pay for it.

[Sonic_Spork]

Originally Posted by colobill

I have always thought of our city as bipolar. They have, and want to implement services that would be considered liberal, yet they stick to a very conservative budget and vote down almost all tax proposals. I think a lot of the conflict, division, and budget issues are a result of this. Sometimes it seems like we want it all, but we don't want to pay for it.

I've seen that too. I catch a lot of people out, saying they want things, and wanting to have a say, but ultimately wanting it to be someone else's problem to pay for it or make it happen. And I think the citizens of the Springs have been burned a few very significant times with big, expensive things happening that were not to their liking or approval. So they don't really trust the elected officials with the money anymore. What people REALLY want is transparancy and accountability, so we can pay for stuff that most folks agree is for the common good...and know our tax dollars aren't being wasted on foolishness or corrupt backroom dealings.

At least that's what I'd like to see.

[Carrera32]

You asked for evidence one way or the other. The best evidence I can come up with is voting patterns. In our most recent presidential election, the local electorate voted approximately 60/40 Republican. In our 'non-partisan' mayoral runoff, the self-identified conservative took 58% of the vote against a moderately liberal opponent. In the recent city council elections, only one winning candidate (Jill Gaebler, in District 5, probably the most liberal skewing of the city's districts) could be considered as anything approaching liberal, and she was quick to point out at a meeting of the candidates that I attended that "We're all Republicans here." She describes herself on her website as a social liberal and a fiscal moderate (which, from her background, sounds pretty accurate). I think if you look at the political priorities and agenda that Mayor Bach has supported, you'll see a clear socially and fiscally conservative record. There are two newspapers in town, the Gazette (daily) and the Independent (weekly). The Gazette is owned by the Anschutz corporation, which owns a number of very conservative media, including the Washington Examiner, and seems to be more Libertarian in its editorial positions here than anything else. The Independent, a weekly tabloid, is decidedly liberal in its editorial positions. I don't have the figures in front of me, but my recollection is that El Paso County voted pretty convincingly against the winning Democrat and for the very conservative candidate in the last Senatorial election. Doug Lamborn is our Representative to the U.S. House, and if anyone ever called him liberal to his face, his head would explode.

Bottom line is I've lived in pretty conservative communities most of my life and IMO Colorado Springs fits pretty neatly into that definition. While there are liberal pockets in the area (e.g., Old North End, though I would describe ONEN as politically moderate), they have no real political power and limited influence. So, if you're a conservative or libertarian you'll feel very comfortable here. If you're liberal, then having your priorities addressed to your satisfaction will be an uphill, and for the most part, a losing battle.

[ckdub]

Thanks for the comments so far... They are helpful and I appreciate the largely balanced views.

As I mentioned, I could live wherever and be perfectly fine with whatever politics are primarily supported. It won't sway my decision to move or to relocate.

I know that views on the forums can be skewed and that generalizations are flawed. From some people's perceptions about the city, though, it almost seems like there is more to the story. I mean, there are certainly other cities that have a large military influence or evangelical/Christian presence. Why do you think CS takes such a beating in CO for its conservative bent? Is it because of the "hyper-presence" of military bases or evangelical churches/non-profits?

[Mike from back east]

Originally Posted by ckdub

Thanks for the comments so far... They are helpful and I appreciate the largely balanced views.

As I mentioned, I could live wherever and be perfectly fine with whatever politics are primarily supported. It won't sway my decision to move or to relocate.

I know that views on the forums can be skewed and that generalizations are flawed. From some people's perceptions about the city, though, it almost seems like there is more to the story. I mean, there are certainly other cities that have a large military influence or evangelical/Christian presence. Why do you think CS takes such a beating in CO for its conservative bent? Is it because of the "hyper-presence" of military bases or evangelical churches/non-profits?

IMO the majority of negative press came from the former head of FOTF, James Dobson, who stepped down a couple of years ago. Some of his statements, mostly about gay issues, seemed like sheer lunacy to many people, e.g., comments that a certain cartoon character (Tinky Winky) had "gay tendencies" and other such remarks. The national press picked up on his remarks and made us a laughing stock.

Then there was the time when the city turned off its street lights and sold off its police helicopters after voters turned down a small tax increase during the recent recession, which also got the city a lot of jeers in the national media.

Then there was the saga of Rev Ted Haggard who built a church that grew into a 14,000 member mega church that took in, so I'm told, about $150k/week in tax free funds. Ted preached against gay rights but was outed for visiting a gay hooker in Denver with some of the loot; he was promptly fired from his church and from his position as President of the National Evangelical Assn.

Then there was .....

[YoYoSpin]

When was the last time a non-Republican was voted into an El Paso County Board of Commissioner's seat?

[YoYoSpin]

Originally Posted by Mike from back east

IMO the majority of negative press came from the former head of FOTF, James Dobson, who stepped down a couple of years ago. Some of his statements, mostly about gay issues, seemed like sheer lunacy to many people, e.g., comments that a certain cartoon character (Tinky Winky) had "gay tendencies" and other such remarks. The national press picked up on his remarks and made us a laughing stock.

Then there was the time when the city turned off its street lights and sold off its police helicopters after voters turned down a small tax increase during the recent recession, which also got the city a lot of jeers in the national media.

Then there was the saga of Rev Ted Haggard who built a church that grew into a 14,000 member mega church that took in, so I'm told, about $150k/week in tax free funds. Ted preached against gay rights but was outed for visiting a gay hooker in Denver with some of the loot; he was promptly fired from his church and from his position as President of the National Evangelical Assn.

Then there was .....

It's often been said that those who make the biggest stink about an issue, gay marriage for example, are probably just terribly conflicted, and fighting their own internal demons...Haggard has got to be the all-time greatest poster child for this concept.