Is Colorado Springs getting more liberal? Is it really as conservative as everyone says it is? (Denver: fit in, crime)

[SheridanL]

I thought the Health Inspection cuts were for daycare centers!

[Irishsailor]

Trust me when I tell you that Colorado Springs is a beautiful looking town but it is filled with the worst of what Christianity has to offer. To paraphrase Ghandi, "I have no problems with your Jesus, it is with your Christians I have the problem." I had the unfortunate experience of being sent there as a clergyman and I witnessed everything from deviant and closed minded Catholicism in Monument to the "drug induced High on Jesus" near Garden of the Gods to the religious fighting within the Air Force Academy. My experience in Colorado Springs moved me to say this organized religion thing is just crazy and just another excuse for Americans to make more money of each other. Stay away from the place as it is fanatical.

Irishsailor

[treedonkey]

Why all the afore-posted attempts at classifying every individual in a large area with a single label?

Yesterday, I was Driving the speed limit on Academy Blvd. One kid in an outdated sportscar tailgated me very closely, threw his hands up in the air and (as I read his lips in the rear-view mirror) yelled 'Move, you %$#@!'. After he angrily roared past, another kid signaled to come into the lane in front of me, carefully pulled in and politely waved as I let him in.

Different people are different, and the same people behave differently at different times. Am I the only one getting really tired of this pointless, generalistic thread going on forever... and ever... and ever...?

[Bob from down south]

Originally Posted by treedonkey

Am I the only one getting really tired of this pointless, generalistic thread going on forever... and ever... and ever...?

No, I thoroughly enjoy having a place for charlatans claiming to be clergy to come in and puke on their own shoes.

As to Douglas Bruce, I think he'll rise again, as the exploding national deficit and ensuing deflationary collapse puts the local economy into a vise. You'll see all sorts of bad and creative attempts to extort even more tax money from the local taxpayers as property values continue to cliff dive and the tax base with it. At some point people will say "enough is enough," and guys like Bruce will be needed to put the out-of-control local politicos back into a cage where they belong.

[CMartel2]

Originally Posted by Irishsailor

To paraphrase Ghandi, "I have no problems with your Jesus, it is with your Christians I have the problem."

Says a guy who comes from a country where Christians are still beaten and burned alive... Granted, it's a bit more friendly in India than in the Middle East.

I tend to have an overwhelmingly positive view of organized religion. If any other institution were held to the same standards, we'd all be jumping off of bridges and buildings in sheer anguish.

All that aside, I think Colorado Springs is a great place to live. Friendly people, a beautiful setting. Can't say I ever saw "crumbling infrastructure." Obviously this person has never driven in Illinois or Indiana.

[RunningHooligan]

Since I just moved to Colorado Springs from the DC Metro area a few months ago I thought I'd give my impression and hopefully some examples. I'll try to be purely objective at first and then give my impression based on my previous experiences.

Colorado Springs is a highly conservative town as many have noted. This is most likely due to the concentration of military and christian-affiliated organizations such as Focus on the Family, Compassion, etc. New Life church (founded by Ted Haggard) is a very large mega-church in the area. Colorado Springs is an amazingly scenic city and the northern half of the city is still very new and feels like a suburban/rural area. Most people are incredibly friendly and will strike up a conversation with anyone at any time. People actually say "Hi!" and most of my neighbors have been warm and welcoming. My first impressions of the city were highly favorable.

On the other hand, the fundamental Christians do have a strong hold on this city. A few examples are:

* On my initial rental application one question stated "Is Jesus Christ your savior? When/where were you saved?" This was a bit shocking to me since it violated every fair housing law on the books. I ignored it as an isolated incident and went to a different house.

* During my first month at work I was questioned several times about my political affiliation and what church my family has decided to attend. When I changed the subject the questioning got deeper and several coworkers professed that THEIR church saved them and that it teaches the Bible strictly.

* You will see many people holding religious discussions in coffee shops, restaurants, etc. Each will have a Bible in hand. Not a positive or negative, just an observation

* Fox News is ALWAYS the channel of choice at work and in public. Fox news is known for being a conservative news station

* I arrived around election time and noticed 95% of signs were McCain/Palin. Obama/Biden signs were very rare.

* Lost of road advertisements are anti-abortion. Some say "Jesus Saves". "Your mom chose life."

* There are a tremendous number of churches around here. Most that I've seen tend to be "mega churches" of the "Bible" type. Quite a few Baptist as well.

* At Halloween, it is alleged that several neighbors passed out fliers in lieu of candy that stated something to the effect of "Halloween is a Pagan holiday and you are blasphemous." The other was "Obama is evil and will ruin our country."

Again, these are my observations so far and not meant to present any bias. Take them at face value. This could occur in any city in any city to any person.

* Now I'll get subjective. Sorry, can't help it.

I am personally moderate and a-religious so I don't take offense. However, I do find the religious overtones in nearly every aspect of life around here. People will openly discuss religion and have no qualms telling you how they feel about it. If you're not a Christian, this would be a difficult place to live. Lots of activity and friendships are based around church affiliation. Most people are open and inviting, but after they get to know you is when they finally start to show their motive. DC, it was about money. CO Springs, it's about "salvation". When nurses at the hospital started into the talk about Evil Obama and Jesus saves I just had to roll my eyes. There really is no escape here. I know a lot of people have these feelings, but for some reason the people here find the need to express those feelings. That's the major difference.

I knew when moving here that it would be religious and I'd have to keep an open mind as well, but it really was more overwhelming than I was expecting. For all those people who claim that COS is open and diverse, I'd like to know where you came from that would give you that impression. I'm used to working with many Buddhist, Hindu, Christian, you-name-it religious walks of life. Never once have I been asked if Vishnu was my savior. Within 2-3 months in COS I have been asked numerous times. Maybe it's just an assumption.

A few people have complained about "whiny" Californians, but I really think a lot of their comments are right on the spot. They just tend to be more vocal about it.

[Bullitt007]

RunningHooligan,

Sorry to hear that you've had negative experiences here.

I don't have a lot to add other than to say I wish you the best and hope things get better. You're experiences/observations are very different from mine, however that doesn't make one of us right or wrong...just our observations.

Personally, I've lived here now (from California) for over 3 years and have never had anyone ask me on a rental paper if I was saved. I've also never had anyone ask me about my religious/political affiliation at work...even if I had, it's not a big deal to me to talk about it.

Honestly, I've been in hundreds of coffee shops/dining places and I cannot think of one instance where a "bible study" was going on. Once again, even if it was, I certainly would not be offended.

I don't watch TV at work, nor do I see others, so I don't have much to say other than the only show I've noticed on other tv's in public was ESPN...and they weren't carrying bibles.

95% of signs were McCain/Palin in CS? I certainly didn't see that at all...especially if you look at the voting records of CS this past election...no way 95% voted for McCain Palin. Actually, I had more Obama signs in my neighborhood than the others.

The anti-abortion road signs pale in comparison to those you see in the south. (as well as number of churches) Not even close.

I have never heard of those Halloween stories...not saying it didn't happen, but just never heard of 'em.

There may be a very valid reason why you've never been asked if Vishnu was your savior. It's probably because the Christian religion is the only religion that claims to have a savior. I don't and can't keep up with it all, but I just don't let stuff like this get to me. It is what it is. If someone were to ask me such a question, I would tell them that it's very personal and move on.

I wish you well...and my advice to you is not to let other people's religious views threaten you. After all, what is there to be threatened about? I have friends from all religious/political views and never once have I been offended. Who am I to tell them they are wrong? Tolerance goes both ways and it starts with each of us individually, day after day.

[Mike from back east]

Originally Posted by Bullitt007

RunningHooligan,

Sorry to hear that you've had negative experiences here.

I don't have a lot to add other than to say I wish you the best and hope things get better. You're experiences/observations are very different from mine, however that doesn't make one of us right or wrong...just our observations.

Personally, I've lived here now (from California) for over 3 years and have never had anyone ask me on a rental paper if I was saved. I've also never had anyone ask me about my religious/political affiliation at work...even if I had, it's not a big deal to me to talk about it.

Honestly, I've been in hundreds of coffee shops/dining places and I cannot think of one instance where a "bible study" was going on. Once again, even if it was, I certainly would not be offended.

I don't watch TV at work, nor do I see others, so I don't have much to say other than the only show I've noticed on other tv's in public was ESPN...and they weren't carrying bibles.

95% of signs were McCain/Palin in CS? I certainly didn't see that at all...especially if you look at the voting records of CS this past election...no way 95% voted for McCain Palin. Actually, I had more Obama signs in my neighborhood than the others.

The anti-abortion road signs pale in comparison to those you see in the south. (as well as number of churches) Not even close.

I have never heard of those Halloween stories...not saying it didn't happen, but just never heard of 'em.

There may be a very valid reason why you've never been asked if Vishnu was your savior. It's probably because the Christian religion is the only religion that claims to have a savior. I don't and can't keep up with it all, but I just don't let stuff like this get to me. It is what it is. If someone were to ask me such a question, I would tell them that it's very personal and move on.

I wish you well...and my advice to you is not to let other people's religious views threaten you. After all, what is there to be threatened about? I have friends from all religious/political views and never once have I been offended. Who am I to tell them they are wrong? Tolerance goes both ways and it starts with each of us individually, day after day.

Ditto for my experience. I've seen people in restaurants saying grace over their meals in all parts of the country, nothing unusual about that, only seen it here once, and we eat out often. Never had any of that other stuff happen to us.

[toxicavenger]

Hooligan what side of town do you live on? I have never had any of these issues you talked about. Are you sure you weren't renting a place at New Life and thought it was a apartment complex? Just joking. Now in Lousiana I have seen some of the things you describe but not it the Springs.

[toxicavenger]

So are you the guy that was knocking on my door on Sunday mornings?

Originally Posted by Irishsailor

Trust me when I tell you that Colorado Springs is a beautiful looking town but it is filled with the worst of what Christianity has to offer. To paraphrase Ghandi, "I have no problems with your Jesus, it is with your Christians I have the problem." I had the unfortunate experience of being sent there as a clergyman and I witnessed everything from deviant and closed minded Catholicism in Monument to the "drug induced High on Jesus" near Garden of the Gods to the religious fighting within the Air Force Academy. My experience in Colorado Springs moved me to say this organized religion thing is just crazy and just another excuse for Americans to make more money of each other. Stay away from the place as it is fanatical.

Irishsailor