Should Colorado Springs build a new Expo Center? (property, state)

[Josseppie]

Originally Posted by CS-Urbanist

If a new CC, it MUST be downtown. I don't think I could tolerate another mindless decision made where moving a great civic piece anywhere outside of downtown. If it's on any ballot for anywhere other than downtown, I will personally persuade people all over town to get it shut down (which shouldn't be too hard in this town). However, if downtown, I will definately be for it completely!

You mean you don't want it out in Bannen Lewis Ranch?

[reginhild]

Originally Posted by CS-Urbanist

If a new CC, it MUST be downtown. I don't think I could tolerate another mindless decision made where moving a great civic piece anywhere outside of downtown. If it's on any ballot for anywhere other than downtown, I will personally persuade people all over town to get it shut down (which shouldn't be too hard in this town). However, if downtown, I will definately be for it completely!

I don't see any need for it to be downtown. It is something where people need easy access and parking and hotels nearby. Putting everything downtown might work well in some cities where there are a couple interstates that allow access but, our downtown will likely have limited growth until better E/W access in created.

[tfox]

Originally Posted by CS-Urbanist

If a new CC, it MUST be downtown. I don't think I could tolerate another mindless decision made where moving a great civic piece anywhere outside of downtown. If it's on any ballot for anywhere other than downtown, I will personally persuade people all over town to get it shut down (which shouldn't be too hard in this town). However, if downtown, I will definately be for it completely!

Convention Centers do take up a lot of land, and that land has to come from somewhere. (Just look at the number of blocks Denver's Convention Centers take up). If downtown, I would insist that there be NO destruction of historic property involved. (This was sadly NOT the case in Denver, even though the final product is nice). Ideally, it would be built on a brownfield industrial site.

[Josseppie]

Originally Posted by reginhild

I don't see any need for it to be downtown. It is something where people need easy access and parking and hotels nearby. Putting everything downtown might work well in some cities where there are a couple interstates that allow access but, our downtown will likely have limited growth until better E/W access in created.

That would really be sad if you guys did not build it in downtown and then you could forget about your downtown ever being a world class downtown. In fact you guys would not even be able to compete with Pueblo's downtown as the states second largest.

One example is Orlando, they did not put their convention center downtown and while the area has seen tremendous growth over the past 20 years their downtown continues to struggle to find it's identity.

[reginhild]

Originally Posted by Josseppie

That would really be sad if you guys did not build it in downtown and then you could forget about your downtown ever being a world class downtown. In fact you guys would not even be able to compete with Pueblo's downtown as the states second largest.

One example is Orlando, they did not put their convention center downtown and while the area has seen tremendous growth over the past 20 years their downtown continues to struggle to find it's identity.

How does having the convention center downtown help make it a world class downtown? I think our downtown is more historic than modern. To do a big city style modern downtown we would need to build more new hotels and business parks at the expense of the historic sites. I'm happy with downtown Colorado Springs as the government center with some surrounding businesses and historic/quaint night life. Our city is tending toward multiple business areas and the fastest growing one is on the North side just off of I-25.

[Mike from back east]

Originally Posted by reginhild

How does having the convention center downtown help make it a world class downtown? I think our downtown is more historic than modern. To do a big city style modern downtown we would need to build more new hotels and business parks at the expense of the historic sites. I'm happy with downtown Colorado Springs as the government center with some surrounding businesses and historic/quaint night life. Our city is tending toward multiple business areas and the fastest growing one is on the North side just off of I-25.

Yes, agree. Our downtown is very nice as it is, no need to load it up with so much stuff that we lose sight of it and don't even recognize it. I like the Interquest area best, or the far north end of Nevada second best. I still dislike turning our downtown into a high density 'coastal' style city with a dense core that leads to horrific hub-spoke commuting patterns.

To concentrate all the big draw items into a tight downtown center creates too much mass and congestion in one spot. Dense cores make "close-in" real estate unaffordable for the vast majority of locals who end up living ever further out from the core and setting up commuting patterns that create instant gridlock. BTDT in Baltimore and DC for 57 years. COLO SPGS is refreshingly different and I hope it stays that way.

Our city layout is unique, linear, along the Front Range and I-25. I see us as being unique among larger American cities in that we did not expand equally in all directions from an original city bullseye, like Denver. The mountains to the west kept COLO SPGS strung out in a north-south orientation. We cannot change geography, so it's best if we spread out the big draw venues along that same orientation.

Someday we'll get rail passenger service on the tracks that already parallel I-25 and the Front Range and serve our 'distributed' city. We can have smart, walkable urban villages strung out all along our corridor, like a string of pearls.

Back to the OP, yes, I'd like a bigger expo center and prefer a modest-size convention center. I'd like it in a spot that can accommodate growth for the next 40 years, be erected quickly for least cost, and not wreck our cool downtown.

[Josseppie]

There is no reason why you cant keep your historic part of downtown, well what's left of it anyway, and have a convention center, Pueblo has done that. We built our convention center by our new Riverwalk and left space so they both can expand. That has created a need for more hotels, condos, restaurants, and shops in downtown making a once rundown area of town the trendy place to be. Even during this down economy there is more development planed for downtown Pueblo then since the 1990's.

Why build the convention center away from downtown and let all the business, shops, restaurants and hotels go there? The Interquest business park is nice but do you really want that area of town to be the center, because it would if that's where you built the convention center. Why not keep the center where is should be, downtown.

Also, you are not unique in how you grew, north - south. Just look at Chicago, San Diego, LA, Cleveland or Milwaukee. What you are unique in is the lack of attention given to your downtown, and urban planning, just like LA, that is why you are more spread out then the city of Denver with less population.

Keeping the same growth polices you have had for your cities future will be the reason why Pueblo will always have a larger downtown then Colorado Springs. Like it or not cities are judged on their downtown's not their suburbs. So if you don't mind having a small downtown while other cities pass you up while haveing your city image be the tech park north of town, then build your convention center at Interquest Business Park.

Then again, I think this is all academic anyway as I would be surprised if voters in the Springs ever passed a bond issue to build a convention center.

[froggin4colorado]

I voted no because I think city money should be spent elsewhere right now.

[reginhild]

Originally Posted by froggin4colorado

I voted no because I think city money should be spent elsewhere right now.

Interesting, where do you think money would be of the most benefit currently? I was thinking a larger convention center would be a stimulus boost to the city with an ability to attract more businesses to relocate here (or just stay here). Short term it would employ part of the construction population that has lost work as the new housing construction declined here.

[MMichelle]

The Phil Long Expo Center is private property.
Have we forgotten the World Arena? It's held several state wide conventions as well as the more well know concerts.