The 5 things you should do if you want to live in rural Colorado: (Canon City: taxes, living)

[Mtlover3]

Franco, love your remarks! I'm inspired! Thank you!

[BlueSimple]

I couldn't resist reposting this little quote I had posted on another thread, it is what I believe at any rate:

One last note on Colorado itself. There you will run into, and on here, people who call themselves 'native' Coloradans. Cool, they were born in the state. As if that actually means something. I don't understand how a person being born somewhere can actually be relevant. It does not give any sort of cosmic insight into the inner workings or how things should be handled. If anything, that person has a more in-depth view and experience of the place they're from, how it has changed, but it doesn't mean they know what they are talking about, especially regarding stewardship of land. I just do not get it. The fact that it is a state that benefits from tourism is not a good enough justification. I am a native of Illinois, born and bred. I am not so arrogant as to assume people born in other states cannot positively contribute to the standing of my home turf. In fact, I can guarantee there are thousands of people that are non-natives that have more insight into the land and could be better stewards of it than I could ever be.

No corporation forces me to do anything. I will never understand people blasting those gosh-durn evil, ya know....corporations...! Damn them for providing goods and services efficiently, having an effective business model and expanding! While not all businesses practices are moral or even legal, small and mid-sized businesses are just as guilty of those deviant acts. I don't remember any corporation, S-corporation, LLC or anything else ever holding a gun to me and hijacking my wallet from me. Ever.

Progress can be painful. It can be evil and destructive, but can also be wonderful and incredibly beneficial. Not many places, especially in this country, are the same as they were 50 or 100 years ago. That is not always such a bad thing. I just do not understand the lack, in my eyes, of simple level-headedness. The emotions involved, while not invalid, are ultimately not that important.

There is no such thing as the good old days.

[CosmicWizard]

BlueSimple wrote:

The emotions involved, while not invalid, are ultimately not that important.

According to meta-physicians, emotions are EXTREMELY important because emotions are inner radar, showing us what we are focused upon. A good feeling emotion indicates that we are focused upon a desired outcome, whereas a bad feeling emotion indicates that we are focused upon an undesired outcome. The law of attraction states that we attract WHATEVER we focus upon, wanted or unwanted.

[BlueSimple]

I agree with you. However I was not referring to all emotions as a generality, I am sorry if it came off that way. I am not a stone-cold person with no feelings, quite the opposite.

I was referring more to the emotions that are involved with people when regarding land usage, whether it be rural areas becoming more populated or urban sprawl, what have you. When you are talking about the feelings involved, rather than the practicalities, it is counterproductive, in my opinion.

[Recumbent Falcon]

Most of the natives didn’t ask you to show up and a lot of them, at least privately, wish you hadn’t.

Not to be argumentative, but I don't recall needing to ask them, either *shrug*. The area I live in has become more expensive and crowded in the last twenty years. I'm not happy with that fact, but it is indeed a fact. I understand some people's need for things to stay static, howbeit ever unrealistic. But rather than whine about things I can't change, I'll find someplace else more to my liking. That place might be in Colorado. We all have the right to live wherever we can afford. None of us 'own' a particular geopilitical sub-division. No state or city is a private club.

I appreciate the observations, Jazz. You've been a polite and welcome source of information and opinions. Some of the forum posters have been a bit, well, less polite, let's say.

But life goes on, things change, we all adapt or suffer. I don't expect people will always like change, but they have to deal with it. Another word for 'lack of change' is 'stagnation'.

And if, as your original post suggests they want to blame average citizens like me for their current economic problems, well, I guess that's their right. It's ludicrous, in my opinion, but hey - I've never been one to stick my nose in other people's personal beliefs.

I just want to move to a change of scenery, without changing a thing, and enjoy the beauty of the mountains - as I have the beauty of the midwest - before I die. If your natives think that part of the world is their personal possession to be hoarded merely because they lived there longer, then they are mistaken. If they are unhappy because I wish to relocate somewhere else, and I choose Colorado, then they are free to be unhappy.

I'll be out enjoying the beauty God put into the world - beauty offered to everyone, not a select few.

I am sympathetic to economic problems. We've had our share. You don't hear me blaming everyone else, however. Bad times happen to all of us.

Edited to add: Most 'natives' - if I recall my my history - were allocated land outside of Colorado when the 'outsiders' moved in. Perhaps it's true about history repeating itself. Of course, the natives you refer to don't seem as concerned about how they (their ancestors) acquired their property. They are merely unhappy it's their turn to be relocated. At least no one's going in with guns and demanding they move or be slaughtered.

A favorite writer of mine once noted that only a fool believes he owns the land. The land has been here long before Man and will be here long after we - as a species - are gone. It takes no notice of irrelevant claims of ownership. It owns itself, and generally ignores our presence.

[Recumbent Falcon]

Did it ever occur to you that there were some things in Colorado that just might be worth saving? You accuse me of living in the 1950's. Well, let's see what has been lost, even from the 1960's or 1970's:

No one doubts there is a lot to save. It's what people go to look at. But you act like Colorado is the only place in the world affected by the stress of increasing population. It's happening everywhere, and will continue until the population exceeds the planet's ability to support said population is gone.

1. In most small towns in the state, people didn't have to lock their doors or take the key out of their cars. Try that now.

Same all over the country, or haven't you noticed?

2. You could go many places in the mountains, and you wouldn't see trophy houses, condos, umpteen paved roads, horrid weekend traffic, and zillions of 4WD's and ATV's in some of the remotest areas.

Ditto.

3. Most of all, you wouldn't see a bunch of spoiled brats (from 8 to 70 years old) showing off all of their fancy toys while they clutter up and ravage the countryside in virtually every way that our "high-technology" and affluence allows us to do.

Ditto.

4. What you would see back then were a lot of honest, hardworking (but certainly not rich) people working on farms and ranches, or in the mines actually producing something of value. They loved their communities and--maybe most of all--they knew and looked out for each other.

That's what all old folk say about the 'good old days'. My memories of the 'good old days' is they weren't so good as I'd like to remember them. My ancestors were honest hard working (certainly not rich) people building houses and repairing tools (many of them agricultural), producing things of value. Sound familiar? By the sound of your complaints, that description doesn't apply to anyone nowadays. Got bad news for you: there were spoiled, obnoxious, self-centered people with too much money back in the good old days as well - even in Colorado.

Your arguments don't hold up in the wash, my friend. People back then were people as they are now. There's just more of them today. There'll be even more tomorrow.

[Recumbent Falcon]

Jazzlover, you have the right to express yourself in these forums. But so do I, and I'm telling you that I am so fed up with your negativity, that you have officially turned me off to wanting to move to Colorado. Why don't you just put up a great big sign at the Colorado border, telling people to turn around and go home? I've never encountered such an unwelcoming attitude, and frankly I'm sick of it.

If you don't want people coming to Colorado, fine. I'll go somewhere else. It's a shame, because I really had my heart set on the area. But I'd be too reminded of your attitude and it would just make me feel uncomfortable and unwanted.

I'm sorry you feel the rest of the country is to blame for the problems in Colorado. I'm sure the native Americans felt the same way about the settlers.

Give in to other people's selfish desires, and they will begin to think their selfish desires are inalienable rights. I know I'm commenting on posts nearly a year old, but since I've been researching retirement places on these forums, I've become appalled at a (small) hard-nosed corps of people who come off as extremely selfish and a bit (perhaps) self-righteous. And - of the eight states I've been researching - I've only come across that attitude in the Colorado forum.

Don't let someone else's attitude dictate your actions. Move anywhere you wish. Personally, I'm more inclined to move to Colorado now (more than ever) just so my very presence is an additional irritant. If they're going to ***** about me, I at least want to have the enjoyment of doing the deed they're *****ing about.

Jazzlover suggests - should I move - I'm going to have to live with them. It works both ways: they're going to have to live with me. Pity it can''t be us living together.

***** = complain. Apologies for my faux pas.

[Minx]

This one is for you Jazzlover. I'm not from Colorado, but I met and married a beautiful native Coloradian. What do you suggest I do? Move to Colorado and be (as you describe) a transplant, or take my wife back to where I came from, since (according to your views) I'm not welcome here?

[Katiana]

Originally Posted by Minx

This one is for you Jazzlover. I'm not from Colorado, but I met and married a beautiful native Coloradian. What do you suggest I do? Move to Colorado and be (as you describe) a transplant, or take my wife back to where I came from, since (according to your views) I'm not welcome here?

Here's a post I wrote once about this issue.

Originally Posted by Katiana

With apologies to Jonathan Swift; if you don't know who he is, check it out before reading this.

With the growth issue rearing its ugly head on this forum, I am submitting my own "modest proposal".

As of a predetermined date, all non-native Coloradans must leave the state. There will be no exceptions! If you give a non-native an inch, he/she will take a mile.

All non-native parents of minor children must leave. Orphanages will be established to care for the native children who are left behind. Parents will have the option of taking their children along, if the receiving state will accept them. This should not be a problem in some cities where population is declining and with it, school population. Pittsburgh comes to mind as one example.

Non-native married couples may go to either partner's native state, if it will accept both of them. Otherwise, they must separate and go to their individual states. A sort of "leper colony" will be established in Dinosaur, CO to house those who cannot find a state that will accept them. No marriage or procreation will be allowed at the penal colony!

All non-native educators must leave, as must all out of state students at all the colleges and universities. Never mind that out of state students at state colleges pay more than the cost of their education to subsidize the in-state students. Any increase in tuition will be more than welcome by the natives.

All non-native members of the Avalanche, Broncos, Nuggets, Rockies, Rapids, Mammoth, and Crush teams must leave, as must any non-native coaches.
No native may bring an elderly non-native parent here to care for him/her in the final years, period! Health care providers will not be allowed an exception. Get out!

Come on, natives! We are all non-natives deep down. If it was OK for a young couple to come here in 1945 to start and raise a family, why wasn't it OK for my DH and I to do so in 1980, at the height of "native" hysteria? Why isn't it OK today? We have come, sometimes for a lifetime, sometimes for a short while. While here, we have paid taxes, volunteered in the schools, and dare I say it: helped make Colorado a better place!

Here is a link to the thread:

http://www.city-data.com/forum/color...-proposal.html

[BayAreaHillbilly]

Jazzlover - it's not Nazism or Fascism, but a more democratized Western thing, of more recent birth, namely, corporatism. The Founding Fathers warned us there might be days like these.