Colorado State Fair in Pueblo (Denver, Boulder: income, move, budget)

[highplainsrus]

Originally Posted by Josseppie

This state fair is not surrounded by urban blight as it is located on the south side, one of the areas I recommend people move to. In fact I live just a few blocks away from the fair.

Denver has their own fairs the only reason they always go after this fair is due to jealousy, in my opinion. I suspect their will be a editorial on this in the chieftain in the next coming days. If so I will post it here.

yes, that term was too harsh on my part. i've been reading too many critiques of the fair and the neighborhood written in recent years by fair visitors. if the reports are true, they've had some bad experiences inside and outside the grounds. i've only driven around it several times in mid-day - hardly a credible basis for disrespecting it.

[Josseppie]

Originally Posted by highplainsrus

yes, that term was too harsh on my part. i've been reading too many critiques of the fair and the neighborhood written in recent years by fair visitors. if the reports are true, they've had some bad experiences inside and outside the grounds. i've only driven around it several times in mid-day - hardly a credible basis for disrespecting it.

When you have thousands of people in one place there is bound to be some bad experiences. Moving it to Denver is not going to change that.

[McGowdog]

I would say the businesses around there west of Prairie along Northern are on the up and up.

There's one of the best grocers in town there, the King Snoopers (their deli is awesome and the bakery ain't too shabby), the Safeway and Albertsons aka Grocery Warehouse are there. That Albertsons has the best Hispanic foods in the area.

The A&W Rootbeer is awesome by fast food standards and is more like a mom & pop. Passkey is over there.

Ashley's hardware is the best in the County. A pretty good looking bowling alley is over there, a Philly Cheesesteak place, a Papa Murphs... none of those businesses are closed down.

As you go south and east of there you get into Bessemer, but still, they are getting by on a rough economy. The projects are across the street from the Albertsons but they don't make the 5:00 news.

The neighborhoods going west to Pueblo Blvd only get better and there are a number of good businesses along PB there and you move on into the El Camino and Regency area.

But between Prairie and Pueblo Blvd north get into some really nice neighborhoods. Now, go north and east of the fair grounds there and move along Orman or Lake and once you get over to Orman to Abriendo and north of about just south of Central HS, and you've got some killer architecture and some really nice areas. Joss, tell me the name of that neighborhood by your hs but south of the Aberdeen area. I did a small photo tour of that area yesterday and would like to post a few of those, thx.

I have friends who live near there on Small and near Mesa and that place is a diamond in the rough.

[Josseppie]

Are you taking about the blocks?

Honestly I drive by the fair grounds everyday as I bank at Wells Fargo and its there and shop at Safeway. Plus my family owns a business in the area but I will not say what it is here.

[wong21fr]

Originally Posted by Josseppie

However, this has noting to do with this anyway it has everything to do with Denver's jealousy of Pueblo having the sates largest annual state event and always has been. That is why this debate goes back to at least 1930 when Pueblo was the states second largest city.

To be fair, the State Fair is probably the fourth or fifth largest event in the state. The National Western Stock Show, Taste of Colorado, and Colorado Pro Challenge are all larger annual events.

Oh, and they all make money.

[wong21fr]

Originally Posted by McGowdog

Pueblo's police force is down 30. So how do typical Puebloans respond? Oh, I can go knock off a Dollar Store and the cops won't get there for hours! Gee!"

That's pretty pathetic and it certainly doesn't help Pueblo's image as a crime-ridden city.

Cities need to understand that if they aren't willing to invest in keeping institutions they shouldn't expect to keep them because of tradition. Denver wasn't willing to invest in the CU Medical School and lost out to Aurora. Aurora went big by practically selling the city to ensure they got the Gaylord complex. The Stock Show made rumblings about moving due to lack of investment, but that was met with a firm commitment to ensure that the institution will be viable for the next century with an investment by the city. If Pueblo isn't willing to provide increased local funding, than you can expect the rumblings to only grow.

There are plenty of other cities that would be eager to host the State Fair and would provide the financial incentives to do so. Shiny brand-new buildings are a big temptation for institutions.

[Mike from back east]

Originally Posted by wong21fr

To be fair, the State Fair is probably the fourth or fifth largest event in the state. The National Western Stock Show, Taste of Colorado, and Colorado Pro Challenge are all larger annual events. Oh, and they all make money.

State Fair might make money too.....if near a population center of 3M people.

[McGowdog]

Originally Posted by wong21fr

That's pretty pathetic and it certainly doesn't help Pueblo's image as a crime-ridden city.

But to be fair they aren't short 30 yet. That's projected assuming the ritires that are pending and the amount of failures at the recent batch of academy participants. This number will work itself out a bit, but the current budget doesn't help matters either.

As far as being a crime-ridden city, I disagree. CoSprings has by far the superior number... to the tune of 6+ pdf pages of raided meth lab seized property, a seemingly daily report of shootings or home invasions rapes or fire due to insurance-lightening... and I could only assume parts of Denver to be worse.

I've heard past stats of how bad Pueblo is supposed to be, but it doesn't jive to what I see on the 5 o'clock news.

[Josseppie]

I decided to make one post instead of address each one individually.

First off don't kid yourself there is only one main reason Denver wants the state fair. They believe that as the states capitol and largest city they are entitled to the states largest annual event. That is why this argument has gone back to the early 1900's the only thing that has changed has been the tactics.

Now yes I said the states largest annual event. In fact there is no comparing the state fair to the National Western Stock Show, Taste of Colorado, and Colorado Pro Challenge simply because of the reach the fair has in the state as it directly impacts every county as its the final fair of all the county fairs and the final showcase place for the FFA and 4H (this makes it a educational facility as well). Not not mention the impact it has on politics as its one of the only places both parties meet to discuss things related and unrelated to politics in the state outside of Denver on a annual basis. Denver has never liked the fact this takes place in Pueblo and not their city.

As far as the argument that Pueblo does not support the fair that is simply not true. Now yes we are just ending one of the worse recessions in my life and everyone has seen budget cuts and the fair is not exempt but even today they get about $300,000 in direct revenue from the city and county and even more in indirect from the chamber and citizens and companies of Pueblo. They started a fair foundation that gets money from Pueblo and in time hopes to make the fair even more profitable. I have donated thousands of dollars to the fair over the years and will continue to do so and I am not unique. So unlike what is the latest argument from Denver Pueblo does support the fair.

Finally there is no comparison with the fair to UC Medical Center which is arguably one of the best medical centers in the nation. The reasons they left Denver to Aurora are a lot more complicated then funding and they never left the Denver MSA. Had they gone to Pueblo I am sure Denver would not have let them leave so easily.

This is not new I suspect this will continue for many years as Denver will keep crying that Pueblo has the state fair and they do not. At this point I find it more amusing then anything else and proof that even today Denver is still jealous of Pueblo. Kind of a ego boost for me to be honest.

EDIT: I have a theory as to why the 1/2 cent sales tax increase for non profits, including the fair, failed but I need to see the raw data to prove it right or wrong. That will be available tomorrow and will go look at it then I will post if I was right or wrong here. My theory is that it was a county wide vote for non profits in the city. I think it passed in the city as we tend to support tax increases like this but failed in Pueblo West (they are our version of Colorado Springs as they vote no on all most any tax increase and always have a excuse). However the amount it passed in the city was not able to overcome how much it failed in the county ie Pueblo West. If my theory is true this has implications far beyond this tax but I will wait for my full analysis until I can see the raw data tomorrow and prove my theory right or wrong.

[LisaBoulder]

Originally Posted by Josseppie

I decided to make one post instead of address each one individually.

This is not new I suspect this will continue for many years as Denver will keep crying that Pueblo has the state fair and they do not. At this point I find it more amusing then anything else and proof that even today Denver is still jealous of Pueblo. Kind of a ego boost for me to be honest.

Who specifically in Denver is crying about Pueblo having the fair? I haven't seen anything that proves or even hints at Denver being jealous or Pueblo.