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Old 07-18-2007, 12:41 PM
 
8,317 posts, read 25,193,673 times
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I happen to think Kunstler gets a little overwraught at times, but his predictions about the passing of "Peak Oil" and what will happen as the end of cheap oil becomes apprarent are pretty chilling. I would add that some oil industry people I know quietly agree with Kunstler's and his brethren's bleak assessment of what lies ahead. The scary thing is that most of the public is currently in total denial about it, just like they were in this country when, in about 1939-December 6, 1941, Hitler was ravaging Europe, and Japan was kicking the crap out of China and Indonesia. Just as then, I believe some very "in your face" event will bring us painfully to our senses about the unsustainability of our current living arrangement. When that happens, a largely clueless public will be raking their political leaders over the coals and asking, "How could you let this happen?"

 
Old 07-18-2007, 12:44 PM
 
Location: Wherabouts Unknown!
7,756 posts, read 16,504,006 times
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Quote:
jazzlover wrote:

transplants from California--a state that has taken suburbanization and made it a religion--and from where tens of thousands of people now leave each year to escape its pernicious effects
I think you speak the truth, but what do you suggest all of those people attempting to escape its pernicious effects do?

regards...Franco
 
Old 07-18-2007, 11:43 PM
 
Location: Carefree Arizona
127 posts, read 392,840 times
Reputation: 80
[quote=jazzlover;1090393]vegaspilgrim says it's a generational thing--well she's part right. Some of us "old line" Coloradans can remember when there weren't literally a million crackerbox houses covering the Front Range, when there wasn't gridlock 18 hours a day on the roads, when one could find solitude and quiet in the mountains

Although I was born in the late 60's and have not seen or been around the block as much as jazzlover has, one thing that has changed and always will is the increasing of the population. As you go through the "remember when" speach, I guarantee the population of the US was significantly less than it is now. Yes, it is dishartening to see area's that were once nice covered in massive housing. Area's that were nice, or considered a well kept secret always get overrun with too many people. If you give it enough time even places like North Dakota will probably become ruined. I just saw an ad on TV promoting the state for it's tranqil beauty. Once you market and advertise this scenario - there goes the neighborhoold.

I always wondered to myself how the people who actually lived in Southern California prior to world war 2 felt when the mass migration to their state came. I bet it is pretty much the same
 
Old 07-19-2007, 12:45 PM
 
2,437 posts, read 7,130,015 times
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I'm currently a California resident who is in the process of buying a home in CO now and am planning to move there soon. Almost everyone in CA is from somewhere else, including other states and countries all over the world, so the label 'Californian' is really a misnomer when applied to the average resident. From my visits to Colorado thus far, I found that the vast majority of people are very reasonable and hospitable (after all, many of them are from somewhere else as well). Just like anywhere else, if you treat the people there with respect they will usually return in kind.
 
Old 07-19-2007, 05:28 PM
 
Location: Colorado
346 posts, read 1,421,407 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by treedonkey View Post
I'm currently a California resident who is in the process of buying a home in CO now and am planning to move there soon. Almost everyone in CA is from somewhere else, including other states and countries all over the world, so the label 'Californian' is really a misnomer when applied to the average resident. From my visits to Colorado thus far, I found that the vast majority of people are very reasonable and hospitable (after all, many of them are from somewhere else as well). Just like anywhere else, if you treat the people there with respect they will usually return in kind.
Amen! The stereotyping of Californians (or those from any other state) is so annoying and misrepresented. Those who were raised well will most likely be able to "fit in" anywhere, regardless of their state or country of origin. It's all about respect and the Golden Rule, in my opinion.
 
Old 07-20-2007, 11:43 AM
 
2 posts, read 6,363 times
Reputation: 10
I think that's true for the resort towns but not for others like Denver. I am from Denver and I'd like to think we're very welcoming of everyone (well, except maybe of Texans). The only talk I've heard of dislike towards Californians is their driving habits, but nothing serious. Coloradoans are very nice people, maybe because they're so active and the state receives more than 300 days of sun each year. Whatever it is, you're welcomed to the state.
 
Old 07-20-2007, 07:48 PM
 
11,715 posts, read 35,129,622 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by skoshi View Post
The only talk I've heard of dislike towards Californians is their driving habits, but nothing serious.
I got a chuckle out of that. I'm currently in Denver on my second scouting trip for a possible move. I've probably driven 500-600 miles around here so far and the half dozen times we've seen some really rude behavior, we joke that it must be a Californian because I see that crap CONSTANTLY back home. Most Denver drivers just seem so much more relaxed.
 
Old 07-20-2007, 07:59 PM
 
Location: Foot of the Rockies
85,125 posts, read 99,277,101 times
Reputation: 31590
Quote:
Originally Posted by EscapeCalifornia View Post
I got a chuckle out of that. I'm currently in Denver on my second scouting trip for a possible move. I've probably driven 500-600 miles around here so far and the half dozen times we've seen some really rude behavior, we joke that it must be a Californian because I see that crap CONSTANTLY back home. Most Denver drivers just seem so much more relaxed.
Apparently, you haven't driven I-25, I-70 or any other of the major roads at rush hour. Relaxed? I wish. I can't tell you how many times I've been stuck behind someone (RTD bus, bike, etc) and can't go around b/c the people six cars behind me or so are pulling around me, even though I have my turn signal on. Speaking of turn signals, who uses them? Not many.
 
Old 07-21-2007, 12:18 AM
 
11,715 posts, read 35,129,622 times
Reputation: 7470
Quote:
Originally Posted by pittnurse70 View Post
Apparently, you haven't driven I-25, I-70 or any other of the major roads at rush hour. Relaxed? I wish. I can't tell you how many times I've been stuck behind someone (RTD bus, bike, etc) and can't go around b/c the people six cars behind me or so are pulling around me, even though I have my turn signal on. Speaking of turn signals, who uses them? Not many.
When's the last time you drove in Southern California? Denver driving is way less stressful. I've driven all over Denver at various times of day. Yeah, there's traffic but its a walk in the park compared to what I deal with every day. I think I've yet to be passed on the shoulder in Denver which is almost a daily occurance at home. You all can complain about Denver traffic but its nothing compared to SoCal driving and I don't even live in the most congested part of SoCal.
 
Old 07-21-2007, 08:36 AM
 
Location: Foot of the Rockies
85,125 posts, read 99,277,101 times
Reputation: 31590
Quote:
Originally Posted by EscapeCalifornia View Post
When's the last time you drove in Southern California? Denver driving is way less stressful. I've driven all over Denver at various times of day. Yeah, there's traffic but its a walk in the park compared to what I deal with every day. I think I've yet to be passed on the shoulder in Denver which is almost a daily occurance at home. You all can complain about Denver traffic but its nothing compared to SoCal driving and I don't even live in the most congested part of SoCal.
It's been a long time since I've even been to SoCal, I admit. My frame of reference is Denver. It may be better than SoCal, but I would not call it relaxing. And the rude behavior you have seen here is probably being committed by Coloradans, who, if they are from anywhere else, are from the Midwest, since that's where most of the transplants come from.
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