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View Poll Results: Should Colorado Legalize Marijuana?
Yes 164 76.64%
No. 50 23.36%
Voters: 214. You may not vote on this poll

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Old 12-19-2011, 05:22 PM
 
Location: TX
6,009 posts, read 4,971,807 times
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My thoughts:

I acknowledge that alcohol and many other legal substances do more damage than (pure) marijuana ever could. But I'm still against legalization because I do not believe the U.S. will be able to handle it responsibly any time soon. I don't push for the prohibition of alcohol with as much effort as I would for keeping marijuana illegal (which isn't much either way) because keeping marijuana illegal is a fight I believe we can actually win... even if it is admittedly due to an irrational prejudice against it.
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Old 12-19-2011, 05:29 PM
 
2,665 posts, read 2,114,245 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Vic 2.0 View Post
even if it is admittedly due to an irrational prejudice against it.
Congratulations, the first step to recovery is to admit you have a problem.

As for the war on drugs being winnable, we can't keep drugs out of prisons, and you think if we just lock up enough people that we'll somehow keep them off the streets? Redonckulous.
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Old 12-19-2011, 06:35 PM
 
Location: TX
6,009 posts, read 4,971,807 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by DentalFloss View Post
Congratulations, the first step to recovery is to admit you have a problem.

As for the war on drugs being winnable, we can't keep drugs out of prisons, and you think if we just lock up enough people that we'll somehow keep them off the streets? Redonckulous.
Yeah, I already said that everything else is worse than marijuana; so clearly, I don't have the forementioned prejudice. Nice reading though!

And no sir, I don't think we can EVER keep drugs off the street. I didn't say that either. But I do realize that making/keeping something illegal makes it harder to get.
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Old 12-19-2011, 07:02 PM
 
2,665 posts, read 2,114,245 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Vic 2.0 View Post
But I do realize that making/keeping something illegal makes it harder to get.
I have not found that to be true, but even if it is, the criminal enterprises that drug prohibition creates are worse than the drugs themselves.
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Old 12-19-2011, 07:10 PM
 
Location: Atlanta Metro
129 posts, read 178,098 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Vic 2.0 View Post
My thoughts:

I acknowledge that alcohol and many other legal substances do more damage than (pure) marijuana ever could. But I'm still against legalization because I do not believe the U.S. will be able to handle it responsibly any time soon. I don't push for the prohibition of alcohol with as much effort as I would for keeping marijuana illegal (which isn't much either way) because keeping marijuana illegal is a fight I believe we can actually win... even if it is admittedly due to an irrational prejudice against it.
Quite irrational, to say the least.... Alcohol kills tens of thousands every year, not to mention causes all kinds of fighting & broken marriages, etc., and is highly, physically addictive, and will destroy your body. It's legal, yet you want to keep something illegal that's never killed anyone, doesn't destroy one's body, and even has many positive uses. Makes of course, ZERO sense....

And what in God's name makes you think after 40+ YEARS of our law enforcement doing their best, the war on drugs has not put a dent in the drug trade, ask any cop, DA, or judge! Also, why are thousands of current & former cops, feds, DAs, judges, mayors, governors, members of congress, etc, all saying we need to END this madness yesterday?

Perhaps the information on this website of those involved on the "front lines" of the drug war might open your eyes:
LEAP | Law Enforcement Against Prohibition
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Old 12-19-2011, 08:08 PM
 
Location: TX
6,009 posts, read 4,971,807 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by DentalFloss View Post
I have not found that to be true, but even if it is, the criminal enterprises that drug prohibition creates are worse than the drugs themselves.
You must be talking about the stereotype of violent crime associated with drug dealers. But that's a statistic NO ONE can provide, which reality would be less harmful - all drugs being legal (because surely you realize that legalizing just marijuana would hardly rid the country of our most violent dealers) or the way it is right now.

Quote:
Originally Posted by SaxnFlutman View Post
Quite irrational, to say the least.... Alcohol kills tens of thousands every year, not to mention causes all kinds of fighting & broken marriages, etc., and is highly, physically addictive, and will destroy your body. It's legal, yet you want to keep something illegal that's never killed anyone, doesn't destroy one's body, and even has many positive uses. Makes of course, ZERO sense....
Nonsense. Alcohol doesn't kill anyone. Being irresponsible with it does, and it's the irresponsibility of this nation in general ("All things in excess!" is our only true anthem) that makes me say marijuana should stay illegal. It's so easily made a crutch. While not as bad as alcohol, it's the crutch laying in the fire already. I say we should leave it there.
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Old 12-19-2011, 08:50 PM
 
1,052 posts, read 1,582,993 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Vic 2.0 View Post
Nonsense. Alcohol doesn't kill anyone. Being irresponsible with it does, and it's the irresponsibility of this nation in general ("All things in excess!" is our only true anthem) that makes me say marijuana should stay illegal. It's so easily made a crutch. While not as bad as alcohol, it's the crutch laying in the fire already. I say we should leave it there.
Huh?

How can alcohol be blamed for 100,000 deaths each year?

>5% of all deaths from diseases of the circulatory system are attributed to alcohol.
>15% of all deaths from diseases of the respiratory system are attributed to alcohol.
>30% of all deaths from accidents caused by fire and flames are attributed to alcohol.
>30% of all accidental drownings are attributed to alcohol.
>30% of all suicides are attributed to alcohol.
>40% of all deaths due to accidental falls are attributed to alcohol.
>45% of all deaths in automobile accidents are attributed to alcohol.
>60% of all homicides are attributed to alcohol.

(Sources: NIDA Report, the Scientific American and Addiction Research Foundation of Ontario.) Also see Alcohol Consumption and Mortality, Alcohol poisoning deaths, CDC report,
100,000 deaths.

That's more than a statistic. That is 100,000 individuals with faces. 100,000 individuals with lives not fully lived. 100,000 individuals grieved by mothers, fathers, brothers, sisters, and children. Every year.

How anyone can ever justify the fact that the holy drug war & it's partner the private prison industry has turned the US into the most highly imprisoned nation in the world is beyond belief. 5% of the world's population & 25% of the world's prisoners. Are you proud of that? 800,000+ arrests for marijuana each year with countless young lives ruined forever with criminal records. Not to mention the costs.... $80B+ every year to inflict a war on the citizens of our country because of what they choose to ingest.

You support this disgrace? Really?

The irresponsibility of this nation doesn't lie with the nation in general. The irresponsibility lies with those who think we need to stop people from pursuing these activities because they don't know how to mind their own business.
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Old 12-19-2011, 09:02 PM
 
Location: TX
6,009 posts, read 4,971,807 times
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You cannot argue that ALCOHOL kills by listing the minority of circumstances that have been blamed on it, neverminding the majority of circumstances in which people drink alcohol, feel better (alright, sometimes considerably worse right afterward), and then go about their lives as before. Again, alcohol is bad, compared to weed. But it's not a murderer.

Quote:
Originally Posted by SoButCounty View Post
Huh?
How anyone can ever justify the fact that the holy drug war & it's partner the private prison industry has turned the US into the most highly imprisoned nation in the world is beyond belief. 5% of the world's population & 25% of the world's prisoners. Are you proud of that? 800,000+ arrests for marijuana each year with countless young lives ruined forever with criminal records. Not to mention the costs.... $80B+ every year to inflict a war on the citizens of our country because of what they choose to ingest.

You support this disgrace? Really?

The irresponsibility of this nation doesn't lie with the nation in general. The irresponsibility lies with those who think we need to stop people from pursuing these activities because they don't know how to mind their own business.
I'm glad you brought that up. I actually don't think anyone should go to prison for marijuana use or dealing. Unless it's a rehabilitation center (one of the few that actually IS one, mind you) specifically for that crime, they shouldn't go to prison.

And you're talking to one of those crazy people who think everything's everyone's business... Yeah! Imagine that!
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Old 12-19-2011, 09:10 PM
 
Location: Atlanta Metro
129 posts, read 178,098 times
Reputation: 129
Quote:
Originally Posted by Vic 2.0 View Post
Nonsense. Alcohol doesn't kill anyone. Being irresponsible with it does, and it's the irresponsibility of this nation in general ("All things in excess!" is our only true anthem) that makes me say marijuana should stay illegal. It's so easily made a crutch. While not as bad as alcohol, it's the crutch laying in the fire already. I say we should leave it there.
I see someone beat me to the punch. ALCOHOL KILLS THOUSANDS, I guess you'll know that now.... I've had friends who weren't alcoholics or ever in trouble with the law, etc, who died as their livers could not handle the booze... With a plant like marijuana, where not a single case of it ever killing anyone, yet you believe possessing it should deprive people of their freedom, and future, while a killer like alcohol, (which often kills innocent people around them), is freely available, is pure insanity, period....
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Old 12-19-2011, 09:12 PM
 
2,665 posts, read 2,114,245 times
Reputation: 1471
Quote:
Originally Posted by Vic 2.0 View Post
You must be talking about the stereotype of violent crime associated with drug dealers. But that's a statistic NO ONE can provide, which reality would be less harmful - all drugs being legal (because surely you realize that legalizing just marijuana would hardly rid the country of our most violent dealers) or the way it is it's the crutch laying in the fire already. I say we should leave it there.
You are blind, whether or not it's willful I don't yet know. Portugal decriminalized all drugs and usage dropped. States where marijuana is all but legal have no statistically different usage patterns than states which vigorously prosecute even small time users. And you only have yourself to look at... If you awoke tomorrow to find drugs legal, would it change your usage of them.

They're already freely available to anyone who wants them, and most who want them are already using them. Rare indeed is a person waiting for the law to say it's okay.
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