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View Poll Results: Should Colorado Legalize Marijuana?
Yes 164 76.64%
No. 50 23.36%
Voters: 214. You may not vote on this poll

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Old 12-08-2011, 03:53 PM
 
Location: Prague
1,975 posts, read 2,862,646 times
Reputation: 2546

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Quote:
Originally Posted by snofarmer View Post
They make synthetic marijuana that is much more dangerous and it is legal.
“Duluth emergency room doctors dispute that claim. They're seeing an increasing number of people show up with serious medical conditions after using synthetic marijuana.”
“It is a big problem with regard to the clinical effects that it causes. Patients can end up in the emergency department, and of course we'll see cases where patients are very, very sick. They require an emergency assessment and treatment, so it's not somebody who can just walk into the emergency department and you say, 'OK, let's check their blood pressure and heart rate.' These patients come in and they have a fast heart rate, their blood pressure is high, they can have a very high fever, agitation is one of the biggest problems and this delirium “
“ Is synthetic marijuana more dangerous than non-synthetic marijuana?
There are differences in the effects of them. They both work in the areas of the brain where marijuana would work. The effects make them more dangerous. We don't see a lot of patients in the emergency department who come in on a yearly basis because they're smoking marijuana. But we do see them coming in because they're smoking the synthetic version or ingesting the synthetic version. These can cause some of the differences — nausea and vomiting, but more importantly, hallucinations, paranoia, seizures have been reported with these. “
Much more dangerous than illegal pot.

Now for the lack of a test .
What happens to them today as folks are showing up to work high?

The workplace does not need to allow it’s workers to work high now or after it is legalized.
Workers can still be fired on the spot for no reason (“union” if the reason is great enough they to can be fired on the spot) the work place can have a “0” tolerance polices so if you test positive your fired. It will not mater if you got high on your time or not.
 
 
Driving. We have laws right now that cover driving while under the influence.
Today many people are arrested for driving under the influence of marijuana.
It would make no difference if it is legal or not.
I'm not sure you really read my post. Pot is currently illegal. Nobody needs to test if you are currently high, only if they detect pot in your system. You cannot just fire employees on the spot. Maybe in some states you can, but in most that is a quick way to spend all of your profits on lawsuits.

Take for example your statement: "The workplace does not need to allow it’s workers to work high now or after it is legalized." Can you not see the difference once it is legalized? Currently, and employer only needs to prove that you smoke pot. The employer doesn't need to prove that you smoked pot during lunch and that you are currently making heart valves for Abbot with a buzz. So if pot becomes legal, how does an employer prove you are currently high? Merely knowing that you smoke pot is no longer enough. That is what I mean by a lack of tests currently available. No doubt those tests will someday be fit for mass use, but they aren't today.

If you understand business, and the liabilities businesses face, you have to see the impact legalization will have IF they legalize it without addressing an employer's ability to ensure its workforce is not high. They have mechanisms in place for alcohol. There are established testing protocols and case law. Drugs are zero tolerance so they don't need to prove you are currently under the influence of drugs.
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Old 12-08-2011, 04:07 PM
 
Location: Wherabouts Unknown!
7,756 posts, read 16,501,052 times
Reputation: 9292
VenusAllen wrote:
someone decided weed was bad
That someone would be the likes of the pharmaceutical companies, pesticide companies, cotton growers, the wood pulp industry, etc. The AMA was initially against the prohibition of cannabis because many doctors of that era recognized the healing benefits of MJ. During WW2, farmers were recruited to grow cannabis for uniforms, ropes, etc to supply the military. MJ is currently illegal, primarily because it would harm the profits of certain special interests. A smear campaign filled with lies and half truths to induce fear has been going on for generations now, resulting in a high percentage of the population being totally brainwashed against it. If the gubmint say so...it must be true. That's my 2 cents!
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Old 12-08-2011, 04:18 PM
 
Location: Santa Ana, CA
298 posts, read 326,328 times
Reputation: 223
Quote:
Originally Posted by CarawayDJ View Post
I'm not sure you really read my post. Pot is currently illegal. Nobody needs to test if you are currently high, only if they detect pot in your system. You cannot just fire employees on the spot. Maybe in some states you can, but in most that is a quick way to spend all of your profits on lawsuits.

Take for example your statement: "The workplace does not need to allow it’s workers to work high now or after it is legalized." Can you not see the difference once it is legalized? Currently, and employer only needs to prove that you smoke pot. The employer doesn't need to prove that you smoked pot during lunch and that you are currently making heart valves for Abbot with a buzz. So if pot becomes legal, how does an employer prove you are currently high? Merely knowing that you smoke pot is no longer enough. That is what I mean by a lack of tests currently available. No doubt those tests will someday be fit for mass use, but they aren't today.

If you understand business, and the liabilities businesses face, you have to see the impact legalization will have IF they legalize it without addressing an employer's ability to ensure its workforce is not high. They have mechanisms in place for alcohol. There are established testing protocols and case law. Drugs are zero tolerance so they don't need to prove you are currently under the influence of drugs.
blood test, same as for prescription drug misuse and is also an option for alcohol testing
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Old 12-08-2011, 04:51 PM
 
Location: Bend, OR
3,296 posts, read 8,228,427 times
Reputation: 3316
Quote:
Originally Posted by CosmicWizard View Post
VenusAllen wrote:
someone decided weed was bad
That someone would be the likes of the pharmaceutical companies, pesticide companies, cotton growers, the wood pulp industry, etc. The AMA was initially against the prohibition of cannabis because many doctors of that era recognized the healing benefits of MJ. During WW2, farmers were recruited to grow cannabis for uniforms, ropes, etc to supply the military. MJ is currently illegal, primarily because it would harm the profits of certain special interests. A smear campaign filled with lies and half truths to induce fear has been going on for generations now, resulting in a high percentage of the population being totally brainwashed against it. If the gubmint say so...it must be true. That's my 2 cents!
Tried to rep for this post Cosmic, but appears I must spread the love around a little! I think you're dead on with this. Unfortunately the lobbyists for big pharma, big ag, etc. are paid well to ensure pot remains illegal on the federal level.
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Old 12-08-2011, 07:10 PM
 
1,052 posts, read 1,583,285 times
Reputation: 1883
Quote:
Originally Posted by CosmicWizard View Post
VenusAllen wrote:
someone decided weed was bad
That someone would be the likes of the pharmaceutical companies, pesticide companies, cotton growers, the wood pulp industry, etc. The AMA was initially against the prohibition of cannabis because many doctors of that era recognized the healing benefits of MJ. During WW2, farmers were recruited to grow cannabis for uniforms, ropes, etc to supply the military. MJ is currently illegal, primarily because it would harm the profits of certain special interests. A smear campaign filled with lies and half truths to induce fear has been going on for generations now, resulting in a high percentage of the population being totally brainwashed against it. If the gubmint say so...it must be true. That's my 2 cents!
You hit the nail on the head. It should make everyone out there think critically about what else our government is lying to us about......

Sadly, in the modern era, critical thinking is not one of the strengths of too many people in our great country......
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Old 12-08-2011, 08:40 PM
 
20,382 posts, read 37,949,187 times
Reputation: 18194
Well, it's time to cue up the classic old movie


Reefer Madness - YouTube
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Old 12-08-2011, 09:40 PM
 
Location: Northern MN
3,869 posts, read 12,572,881 times
Reputation: 3546
1. You can fire a person on the spot for any reason or for no reason, in every state.
(The only time this may get slowed down and the employee get a 2nd chance is if they belong to a union.)

2. Alcohol is legal and you can’t work drunk.
Again your employer does not need to prove it. (see #1)

3.Your employer can have a drug policy and drug test the employees any positive test results and you can be fired. (see #1)

4. I own 2 business.

5. I can fire you for drinking or smoking pot.
I don't need prof. Also see #1

6. The only time it may be necessary to document it is in the case of a work place accident or if your are a union employee. (contract requirements) But still union or not if the situation is serious enough you still can get fired on the spot.

7. Legal or illegal, drugs and or alcohol the employer still has the same ability to control the work force.
To establish protocols and test the work force.

8. I have peed in a cup and I have required others to do so.

Quote:
Originally Posted by CarawayDJ View Post
I'm not sure you really read my post. Pot is currently illegal. Nobody needs to test if you are currently high, only if they detect pot in your system. You cannot just fire employees on the spot. Maybe in some states you can, but in most that is a quick way to spend all of your profits on lawsuits.

Take for example your statement: "The workplace does not need to allow it’s workers to work high now or after it is legalized." Can you not see the difference once it is legalized? Currently, and employer only needs to prove that you smoke pot. The employer doesn't need to prove that you smoked pot during lunch and that you are currently making heart valves for Abbot with a buzz. So if pot becomes legal, how does an employer prove you are currently high? Merely knowing that you smoke pot is no longer enough. That is what I mean by a lack of tests currently available. No doubt those tests will someday be fit for mass use, but they aren't today.

If you understand business, and the liabilities businesses face, you have to see the impact legalization will have IF they legalize it without addressing an employer's ability to ensure its workforce is not high. They have mechanisms in place for alcohol. There are established testing protocols and case law. Drugs are zero tolerance so they don't need to prove you are currently under the influence of drugs.

Last edited by snofarmer; 12-08-2011 at 09:52 PM..
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Old 12-08-2011, 11:15 PM
 
Location: Prague
1,975 posts, read 2,862,646 times
Reputation: 2546
Quote:
Originally Posted by snofarmer View Post
1. You can fire a person on the spot for any reason or for no reason, in every state.
(The only time this may get slowed down and the employee get a 2nd chance is if they belong to a union.) No, you cannot. Can you fire someone because of their race? What about political beliefs? What about religious beliefs? Other than that, you can technically fire someone for most any reason. If you are a small business owner you can get away with firing people for most anything. However, if you are a large company you know that you can't. Technically you can, but be prepared for a wrongful termination lawsuit. Large companies have a lot of training and a lot of process on terminations for this very reason.

2. Alcohol is legal and you can’t work drunk.
Again your employer does not need to prove it. (see #1) Again, see my response to #1.

3.Your employer can have a drug policy and drug test the employees any positive test results and you can be fired. (see #1) While it is illegal, yes. If pot is legalized you don't have a test available to you (yet) that can tell the difference between smoking pot over the weekend or smoking an hour before work. Let's use an alcohol analogy. Could you fire an employee for drinking a beer on Sunday at the football game?

4. I own 2 business. I'm assuming small businesses. If you owned a large company or even were a manager at a large firm you would know that you can't fire anyone without good cause, and without dotting the i's and crossing the t's unless you want a lawsuit.

5. I can fire you for drinking or smoking pot.
I don't need prof. Also see #1 Even drinking a beer at the game on Sunday?

6. The only time it may be necessary to document it is in the case of a work place accident or if your are a union employee. (contract requirements) But still union or not if the situation is serious enough you still can get fired on the spot. Someday a lawyer is going to teach you otherwise. He will teach you the difference between what you "technically" can do, and what you can really do.

7. Legal or illegal, drugs and or alcohol the employer still has the same ability to control the work force.
To establish protocols and test the work force.

8. I have peed in a cup and I have required others to do so. And none of those tests they run when you peed in a cup can determine how recently you smoked. It's not like alcohol.
Maybe we need to have this discussion over a beer, because this Internet thing just isn't cutting it. I guess we are talking past each other.
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Old 12-09-2011, 02:52 AM
 
Location: Prague
1,975 posts, read 2,862,646 times
Reputation: 2546
Quote:
Originally Posted by dank View Post
blood test, same as for prescription drug misuse and is also an option for alcohol testing
Blood tests are the closest thing to testing if someone has recently smoked pot, but even it is only accurate if tested within an hour of smoking. If you take the blood after an hour, the levels are so low that it's debatable whether or not the person smoked 2 hours ago, or 8 hours ago. The blood levels go down drastically only an hour after smoking. It decreases much faster than alcohol.

That isn't a problem when there is zero tolerance. It is a problem if it is legal and the mere presence is no longer enough, you must determine when the person smoked...with a good degree of accuracy and using a test that will hold up in court when you are sued for wrongful termination.

All I'm saying is that legalization will create a good amount of uncertainty for businesses. Not for Joe the Plumber or the local flower shop owner, but for large companies who have a lot of liabilities and have a lot of targets painted on them. If I were an advocate for legalization, I would at least address these matters in any voter initiatives. Don't leave business exposed and you might meet less resistance from business.
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Old 12-09-2011, 06:52 AM
 
7,901 posts, read 8,660,465 times
Reputation: 3185
Quote:
Originally Posted by CarsonCityKid View Post
I have gotten the feeling that a lot of people in Colorado smoke pot. I feel that pot smoking has become a widely accepted activity.

I personally am against all illegal drug use. So these questions are specific to illegal pot use.
Are there a lot of pot heads in Colorado?
Are there a lot of casual pot smokers?

Regarding legal pot use...
Do you feel it is abused?

And how does this compare around the state from the small towns to the big cities?

Thanks
Yes, they do.

You should probably stay away from Telluride.
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