We are looking at moving to Castle Rock - Thoughts? (Denver: how much, home builder)

[Anjelica]

After years of my husband asking to move to Colorado I finally "gave in" this week (albeit I have been poking around the internet, etc. for a good year now). I'm looking for some thoughts on a variety of subjects.

Some background: We currently live in a suburb of St. Louis, MO (actually on the Illinois side of the metro area called Shiloh Illinois). Both my husband and I work in IT (he a J2EE/JAVA architect and I websphere architect, etc.). We live a comfortable lifestyle due to (I believe) lower cost of living than other regions. We have two children (ages 4 and almost 1).

So here are some questions/opinions I am looking for from folks:

1 - My husband has glanced/read about the Colorado River "drying up" but I can't seem to find to much information on that in terms of water - how do most folks (especially in Castle Rock) get their water? Are there realistic expectations that in coming years there will be a water shortage?

2 - How is the transportation - specifically the "free about town" shuttles in Castle Rock? I have read there is a bus transportation (fee-based) between Colorado Springs and Denver Tech Center (with a stop in Castle Rock) - how is this? My husband is legally blind so transportation is a huge issue for us. Are there any "light-rail" systems?

3 - We currently own 3100 sq ft. livable space (with full basement) with the current value around $280,000. I understand the housing market in castle rock is more expensive with smaller lots (we currently own 1/3 acre). How is the housing market (yes I have checked realtor.com) in terms of new home building? I tend to like the designs of DR Horton home builder but from what I have read in JD Powers and Associates their overall customer satisfaction is low. I don't want to be a slave to a home but I also want to add a few more bells and whistles then what we currently own.

4 - Cost of living - realistically? My husband and I make, combined, over $200,000 but I have read that there are some areas in Denver metro when average household income is quite high. Will we be able to maintain a mostly comfortable lifestyle?

5 - My husband comes from humble beginnings and I from a middle-income class family. We are very down to earth and can appreciate the current area we live in terms of not dealing with overly pretentious folks. I don't want to feel like I have to dress up just to go shopping, etc. I truly can appreciate down to earth folks - are we looking in the right area (i.e. Castle Rock).

I truly appreciate any opinions/thoughts folks have. This is a big step for us but something we need to do (we aren't getting any younger). My husband LOVES the outdoors and wishes he could do quite a bit more hiking then what our current area provides (he's been to Philmont twice). He also loves to ski and well, our area hasn't provided much in terms of real snow in years.

Thanks in advance!!!

[b.adams]

1- The Front Range doesn't get its water from the Colorado River. Castle Rock currently gets its water 100% from underground wells and claims that it has a very safe source of water for the foreseeable future. They are also paying a substantial amount to the city of Parker for rights to a portion of the new Hess reservior, which will begin to be filled in 2010. Eventually Castle Rock will have 50% of its water from renewable sources. So the water is a tad expensive, but nothing to worry about. Some houses rely on well water, so there is a change of an expensive redrill if you buy a home with a private well.

2 - I haven't ridden on the local shuttles, but you would certainly want to examine the routes and find a house convienient to this free transportations. I've heard from friends that ride it that they like it a lot. The FREX has a stop at the Castle Rock outlets and stops at Arapahoe (in Denver, Tech Center area) and downtown denver. It is $3 each way, but has internet access on the bus and its very comfortable. You can optionally transfer to the RTD light right at Arapahoe Rd, where there is an overpass to the light rail. I the light rail is $5.50 roundtrip from arapahoe rd. I rode the FREX and it was great, but certainly a little time consuming. If you used the free internet to work or just slept, then it would be perfect.

3 - There are plenty of choices for housing. We bought a DR Horton/Continental home and have found its quality to be very good. Castle Rock building department has higher standards/requirements than some surrounding towns -- that is what I was told. You can have a bigger lot if you want one. THe compromise might be the distance to transportation.

4 - I think your income is more than enough to live very comfortably on in CO. You will
just need to decide how much how you want to purchase and how important access to amenities and transportation is. If you choose Highlands Ranch, there are more trails and amenities and better access to transportation. BUt the lot sizes tend to be rather small (1/4 acre or less, many 1/8 acre size).

There are two light rail lines (RTD) serving the SOuth metro denver area. One goes from downtown to Mineral (Mineral & Santa Fe) and another goes from Denver to Lincoln (along I-25 corridor). The drive from Castle Rock to the Lincoln light rail is about 15-20 minutes. The light rail into down town takes around 35 minutes. On a really good day, you can drive the same thing in 35 minutes. The light rail takes the same, even on really bad snow days, typically.

There are some places being built next the Lincoln station, if living on a rail line appeals to you. I don't know how child friendly that would be.

My kids are really liking the schools in Castle Rock and both go to Castle Rock elementary.

[COflower]

b.adams - Just a bit of information. In fact some Front Range communities do get their water from the Colorado River water basin.

Colorado-Big Thompson Project (http://www.usbr.gov/dataweb/html/cbt.html - broken link)

I'm just pointing it out so that people who are newer here understand why water is such a contentious issue between Eastern Slope communities and Western Slope communities and stretches into Utah, Arizona, Nevada and California...and why the Arkansas River is so contentious between Pueblo, Colorado Springs, Aurora and those that live on the Arkansas River and beyond. Gotta love water issues in CO.

But yes, Castle Rock gets its water from the Denver Basin aquifer which the entire basin (with sub-basins, if you will) extend from Weld County south into El Paso County.

Town of Castle Rock - Castle Rock's Water (http://www.crgov.com/Page.asp?NavID=217 - broken link)

[b.adams]

Thanks COFlower, good information. Thanks for correcting me on the use of the Colorado river water East of the Rockies.

I will point out that the main use of the Colorado via that project is for agriculture, not to say it isn't important to people indirectly ... but not for drinking water.

"It provides supplemental water for irrigation of about 720,000 acres of land, municipal and industrial use, hydroelectric power, and water-oriented recreation opportunities"

I guess my point is -- if your worrying about moving to Colorado due to lack of water -- thats probably not a real concern for most. People are working hard here to find new ways to capture water from storms and become more efficient and conserve more.

[jazzlover]

Originally Posted by b.adams

Thanks COFlower, good information. Thanks for correcting me on the use of the Colorado river water East of the Rockies.

I will point out that the main use of the Colorado via that project is for agriculture, not to say it isn't important to people indirectly ... but not for drinking water.

"It provides supplemental water for irrigation of about 720,000 acres of land, municipal and industrial use, hydroelectric power, and water-oriented recreation opportunities"

I guess my point is -- if your worrying about moving to Colorado due to lack of water -- thats probably not a real concern for most. People are working hard here to find new ways to capture water from storms and become more efficient and conserve more.

First of all, the Denver Basin acquifer is in trouble. That has been well-publicized. Depletion estimates by some experts are for depletion as soon as 25 years off. 40 years ago the experts thought it had a 400 year supply. So much for that. If Castle Rock thinks their water souirce is so "safe," then why are they sniffing around to get into another Western Slope water grab? (And they are.)

The Colorado River Basin is a major source for Front Range water, including a lot of municipal use. There are major diversions from the Colorado River itself, and major tributaries including the Blue River, Frying Pan, Fraser, etc. Not to mention the thousands and thousands of acres of irrigated farmland and ranchland in the South Platte and Arkansas drainages on the Eastern Slope that have been dried up so Front Range suburbanites can water the @#$%^!!! Kentucky bluegrass lawns (yes, I've posted that a few times before--maybe someday the insanity of that kind of water use will sink in). Front Range suburbia is an obnoxious water pig, and there is no two ways about that.

I grew up fairly near Douglas County. I watched it turn from one of nicest areas of Colorado into an inceasingly suburbanized mess. It still has some nice areas (albeit darned expensive), but I thlink it faces an ugly future--either it gets more water and grows into another Orange County look-alike, or it doesn't and those $500K+ trophy house homeowners scattered over the countryside have to haul their water. As I've said before, you just gotta love "progress."

[tfox]

Originally Posted by b.adams

1- Castle Rock currently gets its water 100% from underground wells and claims that it has a very safe source of water for the foreseeable future.

Lol... "safe"? Yes, it's plenty safe in terms of water quality -- the whole front range has great water quality. But, it's not safe in any way imaginable in terms of supplies. Every gallon of water you pump up from the Denver basin is one less gallon left down there. Once it's gone... it's gone. No one knows exactly how long the ground water will last, but it's a pretty safe bet to say it's no more than a few decades at the very most.

They'll get water for current residents, don't worry, by hook or by crook. If you have enough money, you can buy water off of farmers. It may cost the residents dearly, but they'll find it.

[jazzlover]

A side note: I spent most of my childhood drinking Denver Basin acquifer water. The well we had (this in the 1960's) was about 900' feet deep and the water table was at around 450-500 feet. My understanding is that well is nearly dry now. That ought to tell you what is happening to the acquifer.

[b.adams]

Boy, sorry to have ignited such a fire of local emotions. I was attempting to help answer the questions of the thread starter.

It seems like some people here are obviously (and rightly) bitter and angry about the situation -- but it's a loosing battle in the end. There is a bit of acceptance and tolerance needed here.

I think I have as much right to this water as any of you, whether I grew up here or not. I agree that a KY bluegrass lawn is wasteful, but so is flood farming and so is growing crops in poor CO soil. Various degrees of waste, I agree. I'm not saying mine is better or more justifiable.

Like it or not, our forefathers stole this land from the indians and changed their way of life ... and I don't see them whining about it anymore.

I see the current migration of residents into Colorado doing the same thing ... and this time, you might be finding yourself on the short end of the stick. I'm sorry. "Progress" is really a bitter pill to swallow, I agree.

I just think getting all huffy puffy about this issue (over and over again) ... is non-productive and resorting to scare tactics to try and keep away new residents is never going to amount to much more than name calling and sour grapes ... and false perception that Colorado people are unfriendly.

And we have all been hearing about the aquifers going dry for the last 30 years ... just like the predictions about how oil would be gone by the end of the century. I guess were not always as smart as we think, eh?

Remember, just like global warming, the science is new and unproven in many respects. The dynamics and exact amount of water in the underground aquifers is something we don't understand it completely ... so yes, water is a concern ... but getting all crazy about it isn't always the answer either. Maybe a little education and adaptation over time is all we can hope for. There will ultimately be sacrifaces made -- but when confronted with the power of cities, municipalities and powerful HOA(s) ... the single homeowner or rancher has an uphill fight, to be sure.

[Anjelica]

Originally Posted by b.adams

Boy, sorry to have ignited such a fire of local emotions. I was attempting to help answer the questions of the thread starter.

It seems like some people here are obviously (and rightly) bitter and angry about the situation -- but it's a loosing battle in the end. There is a bit of acceptance and tolerance needed here.

I think I have as much right to this water as any of you, whether I grew up here or not. I agree that a KY bluegrass lawn is wasteful, but so is flood farming and so is growing crops in poor CO soil. Various degrees of waste, I agree. I'm not saying mine is better or more justifiable.

Like it or not, our forefathers stole this land from the indians and changed their way of life ... and I don't see them whining about it anymore.

I see the current migration of residents into Colorado doing the same thing ... and this time, you might be finding yourself on the short end of the stick. I'm sorry. "Progress" is really a bitter pill to swallow, I agree.

I just think getting all huffy puffy about this issue (over and over again) ... is non-productive and resorting to scare tactics to try and keep away new residents is never going to amount to much more than name calling and sour grapes ... and false perception that Colorado people are unfriendly.

And we have all been hearing about the aquifers going dry for the last 30 years ... just like the predictions about how oil would be gone by the end of the century. I guess were not always as smart as we think, eh?

Remember, just like global warming, the science is new and unproven in many respects. The dynamics and exact amount of water in the underground aquifers is something we don't understand it completely ... so yes, water is a concern ... but getting all crazy about it isn't always the answer either. Maybe a little education and adaptation over time is all we can hope for. There will ultimately be sacrifaces made -- but when confronted with the power of cities, municipalities and powerful HOA(s) ... the single homeowner or rancher has an uphill fight, to be sure.

Thank you for the help you have given, etc. I do find some on the threads do not like "outsiders" coming and living in Colorado, etc. I also appreciate their opinions and views (always good to have two sides to an issue, etc.).

For myself it is somewhat disheartening when folks who have lived there 30-40 years dislike the "progress" because I can't quite figure out if its progress thats disheartening for some or the WAY the progress is happening.

For myself, I grew up as a Navy brat and never had a hometown or a place I could feel was truly my home. I plan on calling Colorado my home and hope that my children enjoy it as many of the long time residents have done so also.

Again - Thanks to everyone for answering my questions, etc.

[thedividedside]

I Just Recently Took A Course 10 Min. North Of Castle Rock. It's Beautiful But Extremly Windy. If You Are Going To Buy A Home There It Is A Great Market And It Is Also The 2nd Fastest Growing Region In America (statisticly) God Bless All Of Your Endeavors As A Family.