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Old 11-12-2012, 11:28 AM
 
9,830 posts, read 19,523,464 times
Reputation: 7597

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Quote:
Originally Posted by SoButCounty View Post
Are we having much trouble with bootleg liquor these days?
Yes, we are. Moonshine is big business.
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Old 11-12-2012, 11:32 AM
 
9,830 posts, read 19,523,464 times
Reputation: 7597
Quote:
Originally Posted by SoButCounty View Post
Wanneroo, you regurgitate the same tired old reefer madness arguments that continue to be laid in front of everyone like a flea infested old rug.

Get serious and find some facts. Your continued wild claims just make you look sillier & sillier.

If you want credibility, try backing it up some time if you know how. I mean, you do know about Google, don't you?
Yes since post 1 I have requested people use Google if they choose to educate themselves. I know it's hard for you, but you can give it a try.

Nice try at diversion by sidestepping my post and trying to turn the focus on me as though I'm the problem, but it falls flat. If relaxing of pot laws really worked in the Netherlands, it would not be a major issue of debate now in the papers, media, with local government and in national government. Quite clearly if it worked so well, they would not have all the problems they do.

Something for Colorado to consider.
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Old 11-12-2012, 11:36 AM
 
9,830 posts, read 19,523,464 times
Reputation: 7597
Quote:
Originally Posted by jazzlover View Post
The pro pot crowd is so busy wanting to get their weed and smoke it, that they can't think clearly about any of the inconvenient implications of what they want--legal or not. Typical of self-centered, hedonistic stoners who only can think about their next high.
+1.

Just like with all leftist policies, they always have these "unintended consequences" which is always dumped on everyone else to clean up and pay for.
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Old 11-12-2012, 11:46 AM
 
Location: Colorado
11,607 posts, read 7,188,754 times
Reputation: 20919
I'm really rather surprised no one has mentioned Portugal. I've read numerous articles (here's one, supplied via Google, but I didn't double check any credentials as I'm just trying to introduce the idea here: Portugal Drug Policy: Decriminalization Works - Business Insider ) They are trying to address the drug problem with medical rehabilitation instead of punishment and it's actually working rather well for them, from what I have heard.

And by the way, Wanneroo, I think the main problem with Google research is that a lot of the anti-pot material available is from highly biased sources. I have done a lot of research myself on the subject because I've written 3 college papers on it, and my research had to be solid, with a myriad of properly documented references cited. One of my papers was intended to be an unbiased "pros and cons" of decriminalization. I had great difficulty with this, because all of the most intelligent arguments were in favor of decriminalization (which is really ironic, because I do believe that there is a causal relationship between use and lower intelligence in at least many cases.) All of the readily available anti-pot material was shallow government propaganda with no basis in fact. At the end of the day, the strongest argument against the substance that I could muster was my own anecdotal experience. Not so good for a collage paper, hm?

Another interesting exercise: while I know my own personal stance on pot (anti-use, but pro-choice) things get more clear when I ask myself how I feel about legalization in relation to my children. I have two sons, 11 and 13 years old. Do I want them heading into teenager-dom in a state where recreational weed is legal?

Yes. Absolutely.

Because I have faith in my ability to teach them the reasons that they should abstain. I talk and talk and never stop talking. They wish I would stop talking. It will never happen. I am the MOM! haha... (My husband wishes he could shut me up too sometimes lol) But, should all my best efforts to parent them fail, they will go into the decision knowing the facts. It won't just be "drugs are bad, mkay"--they might disregard the consequences and do it anyways, because teenagers do that, but they won't be ignorant. And if they obtain marijuana and smoke it with their friends, which would I prefer:

a.) they get it from a street dealer, a baggie full of vegetative matter of unknown origin and possibly laced with who knows what

or

b.) they get it (still illegally because of their age) from a source that ultimately obtained it previously from a store, because that's the easiest place...and therefore it is most likely not laced with anything.

And sure, as it passes through hands and makes its way to the underage, it could have additives put into it. But I consider it less likely. When somebody buys beer for his underage friends, he doesn't normally put PCP into it. Same-same with tobacco.

I don't consider the odds of my boys trying weed to be any higher or lower because of decriminalization. It is a decision they will have to make, to make responsible choices with all of the info they've been given...or to chance the consequences and try it anyways.

By the way, I'm a poster child for the "pot kills brain cells" argument. I took the SATs in 8th grade and 12th grade and my score went down significantly. BUT...was it a direct or indirect effect? I honestly think that maybe because I was lazy and demotivated due to habitual smoking, therefore skipped school, therefore lost/forgot information...that is more likely than simply killing off my grey matter in a direct causal relationship between smoking weed and lower test scores.
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Old 11-12-2012, 11:49 AM
 
359 posts, read 513,199 times
Reputation: 327
Quote:
Originally Posted by SoButCounty View Post
Hair extensions aren't under a regulation as liquor is and cannabis will be. Hair extension robberies are hardly analogous to potential crime involving a regulated & controlled product.
Actually, hair extensions are regulated to some extent. States have their own laws, and some methods of attaching the extensions have to meet state standards.

But even then, regulating something won't stop criminals if they can make money. It does not matter how legal and unrestricted or restricted something is. It's nonsense to say that "regulation" will make criminals think, "Oh, well, it's regulated, I guess we can't sell any of it now."
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Old 11-12-2012, 11:50 AM
 
Location: Out in the Badlands
10,425 posts, read 8,746,458 times
Reputation: 7731
Quote:
Originally Posted by CincyIowan View Post
In the coming weeks in months, I'm predicting people will be migrating/moving to Colorado due to the new Marijuana law. Which, may not be a good thing to the person migration here due to a law.. same way as people are drawn to Las Vegas and end up Unemployed/Homeless. Do you think this could be the same scenario in CO?
Oh yeah...I'm sure it will make driving on the snow/ice covered roads much safer also.
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Old 11-12-2012, 12:04 PM
 
Location: Northern MN
3,869 posts, read 13,040,961 times
Reputation: 3566
Pot smokers are already on the road are right next to the alcohol drinker, pill popper, heroin user, sleepy driver, and the users of sheerooms and lsd etc etc.

It will still be illegal to drive under the influence.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Pretzelogik View Post
Oh yeah...I'm sure it will make driving on the snow/ice covered roads much safer also.
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Old 11-12-2012, 12:25 PM
 
5,444 posts, read 4,808,503 times
Reputation: 15020
Quote:
Originally Posted by Pretzelogik View Post
Oh yeah...I'm sure it will make driving on the snow/ice covered roads much safer also.
actually I thought this would make the roads safer. Get stoned and you will never drive over 15mph anyways.
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Old 11-12-2012, 12:27 PM
 
3,103 posts, read 2,830,944 times
Reputation: 4029
Quote:
Originally Posted by timber mt View Post
Funny that most of what I read about marijuana is against potheads. A pothead is some one that habitually smokes pot . Everything said about some one that smokes too much pot could be said about some one that is a drunk. Most people that drink are not drunks and most people that smoke pot are not potheads. Anyone that that constantly takes a drug will be messed up. Most the people in my life that are dying from drugs , are dying from legal pills...
Exactly, it's a poor straw-man argument, but it's all that they've got. They can't discredit our argument because we are right. Instead they try to discredit us, by calling us pot heads. They would have you believe we all live on welfare or in our parents basements.

Without going into detail, my wife and I would be considered part of the 1%. 15 years ago we had a few thousand to our name. Not bad for a couple of degenerates under 40.

In the end it's neither hear nor there because the people have voted to legalize. The balance of voting power has shifted and will continue to shift as the baby boomers and their failed war on drugs (at the cost of a trillion dollars) come to pass. It is now our turn to run the country and set policy and laws. The older generation has left us with quite a legacy to overcome. Thanks so much for the debt and for incarcerating millions of non violent drug offenders for petty crimes. The drug cartels, DEA and prison industry would all like to thank you as you policy's have made them rich. They are laughing at you, but they will not laugh at us.
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Old 11-12-2012, 12:31 PM
 
Location: Bend, OR
3,296 posts, read 8,420,129 times
Reputation: 3321
Quote:
Originally Posted by Sonic_Spork View Post
I'm really rather surprised no one has mentioned Portugal. I've read numerous articles (here's one, supplied via Google, but I didn't double check any credentials as I'm just trying to introduce the idea here: Portugal Drug Policy: Decriminalization Works - Business Insider ) They are trying to address the drug problem with medical rehabilitation instead of punishment and it's actually working rather well for them, from what I have heard.

And by the way, Wanneroo, I think the main problem with Google research is that a lot of the anti-pot material available is from highly biased sources. I have done a lot of research myself on the subject because I've written 3 college papers on it, and my research had to be solid, with a myriad of properly documented references cited. One of my papers was intended to be an unbiased "pros and cons" of decriminalization. I had great difficulty with this, because all of the most intelligent arguments were in favor of decriminalization (which is really ironic, because I do believe that there is a causal relationship between use and lower intelligence in at least many cases.) All of the readily available anti-pot material was shallow government propaganda with no basis in fact. At the end of the day, the strongest argument against the substance that I could muster was my own anecdotal experience. Not so good for a collage paper, hm?

Another interesting exercise: while I know my own personal stance on pot (anti-use, but pro-choice) things get more clear when I ask myself how I feel about legalization in relation to my children. I have two sons, 11 and 13 years old. Do I want them heading into teenager-dom in a state where recreational weed is legal?

Yes. Absolutely.

Because I have faith in my ability to teach them the reasons that they should abstain. I talk and talk and never stop talking. They wish I would stop talking. It will never happen. I am the MOM! haha... (My husband wishes he could shut me up too sometimes lol) But, should all my best efforts to parent them fail, they will go into the decision knowing the facts. It won't just be "drugs are bad, mkay"--they might disregard the consequences and do it anyways, because teenagers do that, but they won't be ignorant. And if they obtain marijuana and smoke it with their friends, which would I prefer:

a.) they get it from a street dealer, a baggie full of vegetative matter of unknown origin and possibly laced with who knows what

or

b.) they get it (still illegally because of their age) from a source that ultimately obtained it previously from a store, because that's the easiest place...and therefore it is most likely not laced with anything.

And sure, as it passes through hands and makes its way to the underage, it could have additives put into it. But I consider it less likely. When somebody buys beer for his underage friends, he doesn't normally put PCP into it. Same-same with tobacco.

I don't consider the odds of my boys trying weed to be any higher or lower because of decriminalization. It is a decision they will have to make, to make responsible choices with all of the info they've been given...or to chance the consequences and try it anyways.

By the way, I'm a poster child for the "pot kills brain cells" argument. I took the SATs in 8th grade and 12th grade and my score went down significantly. BUT...was it a direct or indirect effect? I honestly think that maybe because I was lazy and demotivated due to habitual smoking, therefore skipped school, therefore lost/forgot information...that is more likely than simply killing off my grey matter in a direct causal relationship between smoking weed and lower test scores.
Couldn't rep you anymore, but I 100% agree with you. Well stated, as usual.
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