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Old 03-14-2013, 10:18 AM
 
9,830 posts, read 19,513,473 times
Reputation: 7597

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Quote:
Originally Posted by lovethehighcountry View Post
As an avid hunter I have no problems with a restriction on large magazines.

On a different note:

We should not kid ourselves about modern warfare. This is not the 1700s, its not even 1950 when it comes to war. The technology and tools used by any country that might attach the US (including the US Govt itself, I suppose) laugh at our rifles. If we were attacked, we'd most likely be dead before we knew anything was happening due to bombs / missiles / rockets / drones all launched from well out of rifle range.
There are too many cases in modern warfare where peasants with rifles have fought a modern army to a standstill or ground them down into a bog.

So I don't buy your logic that we just need to surrender everything just because you think we can't win anyways. That just invites more openings for tyranny.

 
Old 03-14-2013, 10:28 AM
 
5,484 posts, read 6,933,593 times
Reputation: 2765
Quote:
Originally Posted by lovethehighcountry View Post
As an avid hunter I have no problems with a restriction on large magazines.

On a different note:

We should not kid ourselves about modern warfare. This is not the 1700s, its not even 1950 when it comes to war. The technology and tools used by any country that might attach the US (including the US Govt itself, I suppose) laugh at our rifles. If we were attacked, we'd most likely be dead before we knew anything was happening due to bombs / missiles / rockets / drones all launched from well out of rifle range.

Where were all these high-tech weapons when terrorists were crashing planes in the WTC and the Pentagon?
 
Old 03-14-2013, 10:33 AM
 
704 posts, read 1,495,738 times
Reputation: 629
Quote:
Originally Posted by iknowftbll View Post
I am a staunch conservative and voted for Tancredo in the governor's race in 2010. I had been pleasantly surprised by Hick and was considering a vote for him in 2014. I won't vote for him now. Just him voicing his support for these bills is enough to sway me away from supporting his reelection bid. I will make good on my promise to change my residency, but not before voting against Hick in next year's election.
I've never even shot a gun before and these feel-good gun bills have sparked an incredible sense of activism in my political heart. If these bills have ticked off someone like me, I can only imagine how incensed gun owners in Colorado are.

It's going to be a whale of an election in 2014--at least, I hope.
 
Old 03-14-2013, 10:45 AM
 
129 posts, read 216,214 times
Reputation: 143
Quote:
Originally Posted by wanneroo View Post
There are too many cases in modern warfare where peasants with rifles have fought a modern army to a standstill or ground them down into a bog.

So I don't buy your logic that we just need to surrender everything just because you think we can't win anyways. That just invites more openings for tyranny.
There are exactly no cases in modern warfare where peasants have done anything of consequence. Please, give me an example of a modern war where civilian rifles have had an impact. Anything older than 2000 is not modern.

If the civilians of a country we were in a war with were deemed a threat, we'd wipe out the whole area in a missile blast that would probably be over in a heartbeat. We just don't do that because we would **** off a lot of other countries. You can bet if someone attacked the USA they wouldn't hesitate, because attacking us directly they'd already have pissed off a LOT of people. They would have to fully commit with that first attack, civilian or military population be damned.

I never said to surrender everything either. I own and use guns. I would be severely PO'd if the gov't tried to take them away. High capacity magazines have no business except causing trouble. You don't need a high capacity magazine to hunt or to target practice.
 
Old 03-14-2013, 10:46 AM
 
129 posts, read 216,214 times
Reputation: 143
Quote:
Originally Posted by ram2 View Post
Where were all these high-tech weapons when terrorists were crashing planes in the WTC and the Pentagon?
Terrorism is not war.

Edit: And what effect did having high capacity magazines have there?
 
Old 03-14-2013, 11:09 AM
 
Location: Colorado
11,575 posts, read 7,173,128 times
Reputation: 20853
Quote:
Originally Posted by ram2 View Post
Where were all these high-tech weapons when terrorists were crashing planes in the WTC and the Pentagon?
Planes that they took over using...box cutters? Wait...surely, they had military grade equipment including HUGE magazines full of terrifying bullets for big, scary, automatic assault weapons the likes of which Rambo would envy, no? Hm.

Well, there's that.

Honestly I'll go so far as to say that my husband is a certified tinfoil-head paranoid conspiracy theorist. He is also an expert marksman, having won any number of competitions and possessing extreme skill with any sort of rifle. And after laying down some ground-rules for my own comfort, being the "not a gun person" kind of chick I am, I'm totally confident in his ability to responsibly own his rifle of choice, the AK, and any size magazines he wants for it. One of those rules, btw, was that it's not a home defense weapon in the life we live today. It is not to be kept in such a state that it is ready to be used for this, nor is it to be thought of as such. Since we've got kids in the house, none of our guns are for home defense. They are locked up in a safe at all times. They are for recreation, and in his mind and view they are also for any kind of apocalyptic scenarios that may play out in his lifetime.

Here's the thing about that logic that "anyone who thinks something catastrophically bad could happen is just paranoid, and we don't trust those crazies with guns." As much as I'd like to agree that probably, and most certainly HOPEFULLY, nothing bad will happen...and it disturbs me when the preppers almost seem to WANT an end-times scenario just to prove how epic their skills are...I also feel that it's a little lame to act like nothing bad could possibly happen. And if it did, heaven forbid, if that day ever comes...I don't want to be a helpless little fawn in the woods.

Beyond that, when I married my manly warrior of a husband type guy, I tasked him with the job to provide for and protect to the best of his ability, our family and household. He put up with my paranoia about the million little mundane things that posed a hazard to our kids when they were little, and I now put up with his paranoia about big things that could pose a hazard to us, and let him do what it takes to give himself peace of mind.

Sometimes all it's about is peace of mind, so you can go about with your life. So when people ask if someone really needs that firearm in regards to whatever use they think they have for it, well if that is what it takes for that American to have peace of mind, then heck yes they "need" it. There are plenty of things I probably don't absolutely NEED, but they provide for my peace of mind, so I have them.

And to me, arguments about why it really matters if you can't have magazines above a certain size are silly because restricting magazine size isn't going to stop gun violence. It would have made NO DIFFERENCE in practically all of the criminal shooting deaths in the US in decades. One bullet can kill you. And if a criminal is the only armed person in the room, they can reload as many times as they want. None of the helpless victims are gonna stop 'em. No, it's like another poster here said...this is just the first small nudge in an "avalanche of legislation" pushing back against the Second Amendment. And in a situation where it shouldn't make a huge difference either way (shouldn't inconvenience hunters etc. that much yet won't really increase public safety that much either) I am never, EVER going to pick the side of "let's make more laws, why not?"
 
Old 03-14-2013, 11:10 AM
 
20,819 posts, read 39,016,065 times
Reputation: 19015
We're getting waaaaay off topic here...

....keep it centered on the proposed Colorado law changes or this thread will be history by sundown, if not sooner.
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Old 03-14-2013, 12:18 PM
 
Location: Fredericksburg, VA
10,613 posts, read 11,005,320 times
Reputation: 13825
Quote:
Originally Posted by wong21fr View Post
You voted for a draft-dodger? A coward even? Come on man.

(I'll admit that military service is a major political litmus test of mine. If you are a politician that employs a lot of national defense rhetoric and went out of your way to avoid serving the nation, you get a huge black-mark in my book. Prior to the abolishment of conscription this was pretty cut and dry.)
In 2010 when he was running for governor the issue of his not serving in Vietnam (and why he did not) was not even on my radar screen. I am not going to let the guy's life when he was in his 20s determine if I am or am not going to vote for him when he is in his 60s. There's no such thing as the perfect candidate. If you won't vote for anything short of the perfect candidate, you won't have to worry about standing in line on election day, because nobody will be good enough for you.

At any rate, had Tancredo won that race we would not even be having this discussion because even if all the bills passed, Tancredo would have veto'd them. Too bad we have Hick in there right now. I just hope that a lot of the voters who supported him in 2010 will not smile too kindly on his infringement of 2nd Amendment rights.

Quote:
Originally Posted by GoneNative View Post
I've never even shot a gun before and these feel-good gun bills have sparked an incredible sense of activism in my political heart. If these bills have ticked off someone like me, I can only imagine how incensed gun owners in Colorado are.

It's going to be a whale of an election in 2014--at least, I hope.
I am very encouraged to hear this. I am hoping that Colorado has a lot more people like you who will hold accountable those who have been responsible for pushing this legislation through.
 
Old 03-14-2013, 12:20 PM
 
Location: Littleton, CO
2,394 posts, read 4,296,266 times
Reputation: 7531
Here is my do not vote list for the people who voted for HB 1224 --

Angela Giron 2014
Gail Schwartz 2014
John Morse 2014
John Kefalas 2016
Jeanne Nicholson 2014
Matt Jones 2016
Rollie Heath 2016
Evie Hudak 2016
Jessie Ulibarri 2016
Andy Kerr 2014
Mary Hodge 2016
Linda Newell 2016
Nancy Todd 2016
Morgan Carroll 2016 (Majority Leader)
Pat Steadman 2016
Irene Aguilar 2014
Michael Johnston 2016
Lucía Guzmán 2014
 
Old 03-14-2013, 12:34 PM
 
Location: The Berk in Denver, CO USA
13,934 posts, read 20,154,489 times
Reputation: 22534
Default 15 is just the first step

Next it will be 10.
Then 5.
Then bolt action only.
Which is all good.
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