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Old 03-13-2013, 09:40 AM
 
Location: Pueblo - Colorado's Second City
12,174 posts, read 20,955,081 times
Reputation: 4258

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Quote:
Originally Posted by iknowftbll View Post
Why is that?
I am for the second amendment but I am also for reasonable gun laws.

These 2 are over the top and I would have not supported them. So I am glad they were killed.

House Bill 1226 banned concealed carry permits on college campuses and was killed by its sponsor.

Senate Bill 196 holds manufacturers and sellers of semiautomatic weapons liable for violence committed with them and was killed by its sponsor.

The other four are reasonable in my opinion and I would not have a problem if they got passed.

House Bill 1224 limits ammunition capacity to 15 rounds.

House Bill 1228 imposed a fee for background checks.

House Bill 1229 proposes universal background checks, including private sales and transfers.

Senate Bill 195 bans online certification for concealed carry permits, requiring people to attend in person.

 
Old 03-13-2013, 10:03 AM
 
Location: Fredericksburg, VA
10,626 posts, read 11,019,566 times
Reputation: 13847
Quote:
Originally Posted by davebarnes View Post
I believe in the 2nd Amendment.
If you want to own "arms" then you must be a member of the "militia" [National Guard].
Not a member, then you can't own a gun.
Period.
But the 2nd Amendment clearly states the "right of the PEOPLE to keep and bear arms..." National Guard is a function of government, so a rule banning non-national guard members from owning a gun violates the 2nd Amendment.
 
Old 03-13-2013, 10:04 AM
 
Location: 5280 above liquid
356 posts, read 513,556 times
Reputation: 383
Quote:
Originally Posted by Josseppie View Post
I am for the second amendment but I am also for reasonable gun laws.

The other four are reasonable in my opinion and I would not have a problem if they got passed.

House Bill 1224 limits ammunition capacity to 15 rounds.
House Bill 1229 proposes universal background checks, including private sales and transfers.
I have no idea how they would police these bills.

And with 3D printing of magazines available, having a ban on 15 round capacity is frivolous IMO.
 
Old 03-13-2013, 10:07 AM
 
Location: Fredericksburg, VA
10,626 posts, read 11,019,566 times
Reputation: 13847
Quote:
Originally Posted by Josseppie View Post
I am for the second amendment but I am also for reasonable gun laws.

These 2 are over the top and I would have not supported them. So I am glad they were killed.

House Bill 1226 banned concealed carry permits on college campuses and was killed by its sponsor.

Senate Bill 196 holds manufacturers and sellers of semiautomatic weapons liable for violence committed with them and was killed by its sponsor.

The other four are reasonable in my opinion and I would not have a problem if they got passed.

House Bill 1224 limits ammunition capacity to 15 rounds.

House Bill 1228 imposed a fee for background checks.

House Bill 1229 proposes universal background checks, including private sales and transfers.

Senate Bill 195 bans online certification for concealed carry permits, requiring people to attend in person.
I agree on the two that were killed. Those two were just idiotic, to put it nicely. Regarding those that remain, I believe that a law should serve a purpose. When you make a law, you destroy freedom on some level, as law and freedom are mutually exclusive. Of course you need a balance between the two. These laws don't meet that balance in my opinion. I think the law makers have failed to demonstrate how these laws satisfy their stated purposes. A fee for a background check? How does that make anyone safer?
 
Old 03-13-2013, 10:10 AM
 
Location: Corona
10,058 posts, read 13,945,641 times
Reputation: 8887
Quote:
Originally Posted by ELCO5280 View Post
I have no idea how they would police these bills.

And with 3D printing of magazines available, having a ban on 15 round capacity is frivolous IMO.
Not to hard put law in place and wait for people to transfer guns without paperwork to commit crimes and charge them with criminal transfer. Sure those that don't commit crimes will probably never be caught until someone says something.

A lot of hype on printing 3D guns in news and articles and yet no real proof other than hype. Show me one example of a common criminal using a printed gun there are none?
 
Old 03-13-2013, 10:11 AM
 
Location: The Berk in Denver, CO USA
13,947 posts, read 20,190,335 times
Reputation: 22564
Default Still not OK

If United States v. Miller - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia allows machine guns to be regulated so heavily that they are effectively outlawed, then why can't we do the same with semi-automatic weapons?

Why should it be legal to own a semi-automatic assault rifle, but not legal to own a ManPAD? If I am going to be part of a militia, then I should be able to own an effective weapon against aircraft.
 
Old 03-13-2013, 10:15 AM
 
Location: 5280 above liquid
356 posts, read 513,556 times
Reputation: 383
Quote:
Originally Posted by Colorado xxxxx View Post
Not to hard put law in place and wait for people to transfer guns without paperwork to commit crimes and charge them with criminal transfer. Sure those that don't commit crimes will probably never be caught until someone says something.

A lot of hype on printing 3D guns in news and articles and yet no real proof other than hype. Show me one example of a common criminal using a printed gun there are none?
Did you misread my post because I'm not sure what you're replying to. I stated those two bills would be impossible to police and did not state that anybody has committed a crime with a printed magazine.

I'm very pro-2nd and support the printing of magazines.
 
Old 03-13-2013, 10:15 AM
 
Location: Fredericksburg, VA
10,626 posts, read 11,019,566 times
Reputation: 13847
About a week ago I wrote this letter to Governor Hickenlooper's office:


Dear Governor,

As a Colorado resident and military officer currently stationed in Virginia, I am greatly troubled by the recent gun legislation that passed the Colorado House Assembly. This legislation will soon be subject to review and debate by the State Senate. Should the Senate approve the legislation, I strongly urge you to not to sign into law any legislation that infringes upon the Second Amendment rights of Colorado citizens.

Colorado is a great state with a long history of rugged independence and proud tradition of responsible gun ownership and firearms proficiency. I understand that in the face of tragedies such as the Century 16 Theater in Aurora and the Sandy Hook shooting in Newton, combined with our still painful memories of the Columbine High School shooting our response may be to react by imposing strict gun laws in an effort to prevent future tragedies. I question if such legislation is a good idea, however. Consider Illinois, a state which boasts some of the most restrictive firearms legislation in the United States, yet the City of Chicago is in an era of violence surpassed in its severity only by the Al Capone era. If passing gun legislation were the answer, Chicago would be the safest major city in the country. We are fooling ourselves if we think we can address the actions of law breakers by restricting the rights of law abiders.

Freedom and legislation are mutually exclusive. With this in mind, legislation should be considered only when there is no other alternative, because legislation by nature infringes upon the freedoms of the citizen. In my adult life I have endeavored to avoid making big decisions on an emotional high or low state of mind. Such reactionary behavior often results in sub-optimal results. With this in mind, I make an effort to make big decisions in my life only after a sustained level of logical consideration. Similarly, legislation taken in a reactive spirit, such as House Bills 1224, 1226, 1228, and 1229, is powered by emotion and not a sustained level of logical or critical thought. If the state is going to impose upon the liberties of its citizens, it should at minimum oblige itself to do so under a sustained level of logic rather than an emotional reaction to a tragedy. I find it somewhat ironic that each bill ends with a safety clause stipulating that the bill is proposed in the interest of “public peace, health and safety.” As I read each bill, I could not help but be reminded of the wise words of Benjamin Franklin, “They who can give up essential liberty to obtain a little temporary safety, deserve neither liberty nor safety.”

I have read reports that you support the proposed legislation that I have identified above and that you intend to sign it if it passes the State Senate. This will be a sad day for the State of Colorado. I have long looked forward to the day in which I leave military service and return home to Colorado to continue my life in the state I love most. However, I have carefully weighed the ramifications of this legislation and have deemed it incompatible with my values and rights as an American. It is with a heavy heart that I will be forced to switch my residency (and with it my taxable earnings and commerce) to the State of Virginia, a place where Second Amendments rights are still valued by the state level government.

This is a decision point I wish to avoid, and I hope that you will do everything in your power to preserve the rights of Americans citizens and Colorado residents. I strongly urge you to seek alternatives that address the root of the problem rather than the symptoms.

Sincerely,

[iknowftbll]
Colorado Resident, State District 35
Captain, USMC
 
Old 03-13-2013, 10:20 AM
 
Location: 5280 above liquid
356 posts, read 513,556 times
Reputation: 383
Great letter iknowftbll.
 
Old 03-13-2013, 10:20 AM
 
Location: Corona
10,058 posts, read 13,945,641 times
Reputation: 8887
Quote:
Originally Posted by ELCO5280 View Post
Did you misread my post because I'm not sure what you're replying to. I stated those two bills would be impossible to police and did not state that anybody has committed a crime with a printed magazine.

I'm very pro-2nd and support the printing of magazines.
I didn't misunderstand anything. I simply responded and don't agree with your post and offered an counterpoints.
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