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Old 04-20-2013, 11:30 AM
 
Location: Wherabouts Unknown!
7,764 posts, read 16,849,592 times
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delta07 wrote: I don't necessarily think that you can blame transplants for that shift in Colorado. I think we have good old mass media to thank for this.

The media is only one side of the coin. On the other side of the coin are the idiots who BELIEVE everything the media tells them.
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Old 04-20-2013, 11:45 AM
 
Location: high plains
493 posts, read 702,594 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by delta07 View Post
I do tend to agree with some of what you have all said about this, even though I consider myself a mostly liberal person. However, I do think that it's more difficult to live in a place you are not comfortable with politically, if only because you are often seen as an outcast to society. It's hard to fit into a community where you can't speak your mind, your vote doesn't really count, and you are constantly on the other side of the fence as your neighbors. I've lived in very conservative, moderate and somewhat liberal cities/towns, and overall, I prefer the moderate to somewhat liberal leaning locales. I know that some of my bumper stickers are not popular amongst the ultra conservative crowd but I'm also free to voice my opinion. So, living in a place that holds at least some of my beliefs and values is a factor when choosing a place to live. It may not be the number one priority, and I don't get that from the OP either, but it does make a difference.

Jazzlover, I think you have a valid point regarding the far right and the far left. Unfortunately, I see our country shifting further away from the middle as a whole. But, I don't necessarily think that you can blame transplants for that shift in Colorado. I think we have good old mass media to thank for this. It's a reality s**t show on every news channel when something like Newtown or Boston happens. It only fuels the fire on both far sides of the spectrum and ultimately leads us further divided.
I wonder about use of the "moderate" and "middle" labels in the current political climate. Moderate views might be considered almost "radical" today. Live and let live...the golden rule....chafed by authoritarians/rules/regulations (ignore most of them)...independent voter.. and so on. Two Peaks in NM might be farther out on that spectrum. Many small mountain towns might fit perfectly. Many city neighborhoods might fit. It gets trickier when we factor in views on abortion, guns, cannabis, music lyrics, public noise, driving habits, tobacco, war and other social issues.
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Old 04-21-2013, 12:18 PM
 
811 posts, read 1,225,153 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by jazzlover View Post
Bluntly, most of the wildly conservative or wildly liberal people who now live here are recent transplants from someplace else.
As a politically moderate transplant, my profession gives me an opportunity to meet with several different couples each week, for several hours at a time. A surprising many of them articulate extreme/angry political views, assuming I share those views, which I don't. Most (more than half) of these extreme/angry political folks (I'll refrain from saying which side of the spectrum they invariably espouse) are native Coloradans.

Is it possible you simply assign blame for every problem you feel exists to those who are "recent transplants from someplace else?" I've definitely noticed this, year after year, post after post, from certain folks, you more than any. Just sayin.
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Old 04-21-2013, 01:05 PM
 
8,317 posts, read 25,802,953 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by smdensbcs View Post
As a politically moderate transplant, my profession gives me an opportunity to meet with several different couples each week, for several hours at a time. A surprising many of them articulate extreme/angry political views, assuming I share those views, which I don't. Most (more than half) of these extreme/angry political folks (I'll refrain from saying which side of the spectrum they invariably espouse) are native Coloradans.

Is it possible you simply assign blame for every problem you feel exists to those who are "recent transplants from someplace else?" I've definitely noticed this, year after year, post after post, from certain folks, you more than any. Just sayin.
To be sure, there are extremists within the ranks of long-time Coloradans. But, as a whole, most long-time Colorado residents have tended to be more moderate. I say this from my experience as a long-time political activist in this state who has spent a lot of time in the political arena and around folks from all sides of the political spectrum.

Another problem is high spending by out-of-state extremist political groups on both sides of the political spectrum to influence Colorado elections and legislative decision-making. The latest example of that was on the liberal side--on both the gun control and marijuana-legalization issues. The out-of-state conservative side has also been active in this regard on other issues. My first question to these people when they approach me is "Who is paying you and where are they from?" They really don't like to answer that question and they will usually end their conversation with me right there.
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Old 04-21-2013, 01:10 PM
 
Location: OKLAHOMA
1,784 posts, read 3,608,399 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by jazzlover View Post
....Another problem is high spending by out-of-state extremist political groups on both sides of the political spectrum to influence Colorado elections and legislative decision-making. The latest example of that was on the liberal side--on both the gun control and marijuana-legalization issues. The out-of-state conservative side has also been active in this regard on other issues. My first question to these people when they approach me is "Who is paying you and where are they from?" They really don't like to answer that question and they will usually end their conversation with me right there.


I think I'll use that question on people approaching me with issues I really do not care to debate on.

Last edited by Mike from back east; 04-21-2013 at 03:14 PM.. Reason: Fixing quoted material
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Old 04-21-2013, 06:07 PM
 
1,059 posts, read 1,636,718 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by CosmicWizard View Post
delta07 wrote: I don't necessarily think that you can blame transplants for that shift in Colorado. I think we have good old mass media to thank for this.

The media is only one side of the coin. On the other side of the coin are the idiots who BELIEVE everything the media tells them.
I'm 100% with ya on that one CW!

The crap that people believe is just ridiculous. People just don't think for themselves anymore.
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Old 04-22-2013, 11:05 AM
 
Location: Colorado - Oh, yeah!
833 posts, read 1,435,273 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by delta07 View Post
Jazzlover, I think you have a valid point regarding the far right and the far left. Unfortunately, I see our country shifting further away from the middle as a whole. But, I don't necessarily think that you can blame transplants for that shift in Colorado. I think we have good old mass media to thank for this. It's a reality s**t show on every news channel when something like Newtown or Boston happens. It only fuels the fire on both far sides of the spectrum and ultimately leads us further divided.
You took the words out of my mouth; this shift to extremes is not a Colorado thing (and not the fault of transplants); this is the direction our country is headed and Colorado is along for the ride. The fact that Colorado has historically been rather moderate makes this change more noticeable than in some deep red or deep blue states where the extremism is simply taking on a new flavor.
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Old 04-22-2013, 11:15 AM
 
Location: Colorado - Oh, yeah!
833 posts, read 1,435,273 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by SoButCounty View Post
I'm 100% with ya on that one CW!

The crap that people believe is just ridiculous. People just don't think for themselves anymore.
This is part of the reason I find myself on Facebook less and less. It is honestly depressing how flat out stupid people are. The mindless repetition of conspiracy theories, the "like this post enough and a doctor will save a kid's life" and the other mindless drivel people accept as fact.

I am starting to think more and more that as a parent I am not nearly as worried about my kids having good grades as I am concerned with them being able to tell the BS from the plausible and then being able to find out the truth on their own. Ideally, they do this before they start repeating the crap that they are surrounded by.
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Old 04-22-2013, 02:45 PM
 
2,253 posts, read 6,026,414 times
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Wink As touchstone

I just returned from a small town in southern Colorado, wherein at times the discussion briefly turned to how largely right most everything was there—and grossly wrong elsewhere (i.e. Washington D.C.). When in an oft beautiful and idyllic place where many still leave their homes unlocked and unguarded at times, it is easy to believe. Even with an obviously limited economy, much does seem right there—neighbors happy to help one another, a certain sense of community, etc.—versus all the many ills one might view on television, somewhere else.

There is certainly a truth in this, and such realms existing this very moment in areas of Colorado. In such circumstances even the Front Range seems another world away. Yet to one degree or another the internet is available, modern autos are present, and in varying degrees the 21st century has arrived. Within the greater populace as well. Perhaps one facet of this was something else I observed: in what seems an all the more common blind acceptance. News of whatever flavor seemed to be swallowed whole by its audience, hook, line and sinker. Independent questioning and analysis was apparently a foreign concept seldom practiced. Yes, there was a deep sense that this county as a nation is very much off track; but the responsibility for that was assumed elsewhere. Presumably by politicians who should know better—or at least have such morals—but elected and maintained by a greater populace who largely seem unwilling to demand and get to the truth of any given matter, or keep a tight rein on their representatives.

It does seem that in venturing to rural Colorado one can in some ways return to an older and better place, one with many modern conveniences but often untouched by the world's cares. But that can only last in measure and as eternally protected.

People do belong to Rotary and other civic organizations, and whether rural or urban take an interest in local concerns. Although I know one fellow who was locally active for decades, yet believing any higher office would require too many morally questionable sacrifices. More the pity. But the perception that somehow this nation is collectively not exactly ours, but best governed by authorities who presumably know better, seems widespread—whether in city or smallest town. It is not an outward ill, but within each and every individual one of us in measure. That largely blind acceptance is inimical to democracy.

Or to the places we hold most dear in our hearts.

Last edited by Idunn; 04-22-2013 at 03:27 PM..
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Old 04-22-2013, 03:55 PM
 
Location: Maine
398 posts, read 1,161,843 times
Reputation: 219
Back on topic for the OP. I second the recommendation of looking into Evergreen. I prefer Evergreen over Conifer for many reasons, but mostly just because it feels more community oriented. They actually like, and will stand behind things like a rec center (if that's what you like), whereas the general opinion in Conifer is "go down the hill if you want that stuff". This may not be a big deal to you, but when you have kids, it's nice to have more amenities and services.
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