Getting more real. Help me out. (Denver, Parker: environment, trip , income)

[almost heaven]

OK. I just spent the last few days helping my wife deal with the fact that her stay at home mom days are numbered. We have been very lucky that she has been home for the past 10 years but I just can not afford to make it on one income anymore in the Bay Area. We have family in Parker and I think we will be out there in the spring. Here are some questions.
1. I know about the drout. Is it a deal braker?
2. Jobs. I hear people talk about the low wages in Colorado but when I look on line the construction management jobs pay a livable wage?
3. Do yo see construction staying strong?
4. What is the general feeling about the future of the state as a whole?
I have visited the Denver for the last 15 years and love to ski and I know about the dry air, cold spells, blizzards and the good thunder storms you get in the summers. So I am not planing a move with closed eyes. Oh and I hate all that California has become so don't worry about me bringing any of California with me.

[Mike from back east]

Originally Posted by almost heaven

OK. I just spent the last few days helping my wife deal with the fact that her stay at home mom days are numbered. We have been very lucky that she has been home for the past 10 years but I just can not afford to make it on one income anymore in the Bay Area. We have family in Parker and I think we will be out there in the spring. Here are some questions.
1. I know about the drout. Is it a deal braker?
2. Jobs. I hear people talk about the low wages in Colorado but when I look on line the construction management jobs pay a livable wage?
3. Do yo see construction staying strong?
4. What is the general feeling about the future of the state as a whole?
I have visited the Denver for the last 15 years and love to ski and I know about the dry air, cold spells, blizzards and the good thunder storms you get in the summers. So I am not planing a move with closed eyes. Oh and I hate all that California has become so don't worry about me bringing any of California with me.

1. I know about the drout. Is it a deal braker?
A: Not really. But for sure, water is an issue, especially if a home has a well, then you need plenty of due diligence. Use the Search Tool with keyword well or drill or acquifer to find the info alread posted in here.

2. Jobs. I hear people talk about the low wages in Colorado but when I look on line the construction management jobs pay a livable wage?
A: Salaries vary by industry, some more, some less.

3. Do yo see construction staying strong?
A: I do, but I have no crystal ball on this. Seems plenty of commercial stuff is going in, and some homebuilders are working.

4. What is the general feeling about the future of the state as a whole?
A: I'm positive. Most folks are. National economic issues could turn negative, but if it goes south, it goes south everywhere, for everyone.

Is it Parker you are intested in, or all Denver metro area, some other area? The more specifics you give, the better we are able to target our advice back to you. What about kids, schools, hobbies, type of house, price range, etc?

s/Mike

[jazzlover]

I probably have a more negative view on the Colorado economy than many, so I'm sure there will be many who disagree with with what I'm about to write. I've also expressed a lot of this before, so I will be brief here. You can query my other posts.

Do I think the drought is a "deal breaker?" Not right now, but water is a very serious long-term problem in the West. Eventually, it will be the resource that limits just how many people can live here. There is a lot of debate about when that will occur, but I think that it will be sooner than many people think.

Colorado's biggest economic problem is that its economy is overreliant on construction (the industry that you work in, apparently) and recreation. When the national economy sours, and I think more and more people are recognizing that it is, those two industries are going to fare pretty poorly. To answer your third question, no, I don't think construction is going to stay strong. In fact, the LAST field I would want to depend on for a job right now is construction--other than maybe being an RV salesman, that will probably be worse.

I think Colorado has a mixed future. Because it, and its neighboring states, are one of this countriy's last large areas of fossil fuel reserves, I think that part of the economy will continue to grow, albeit with some unpleasant environmental consequences being pretty likely. The Front Range will continue to be a trade center for the region. I do think that virtually all the factors that have contributed to Colorado's explosive growth over the last decade or so are going to wane substantially. I predict the state entering a protracted period of negligible population and economic growth--possibly even declines in population--that will resemble what happened in the state for most of the first half of the 20th century. The people who will be able to stay in the state will be the ones who are able to accept Colorado on those terms--and make the material and other sacrfices to live in the state. Those who can't or won't--well they won't be here.

[brightdoglover]

Jazzlover, I so appreciate your cogent, articulate posts about Colorado. I have considered it for summer, and for retirement, or semi-retirement or whatever I could, and bought and sold small properties in Ridgway twice now, since I can't figure out a way to live in two places as a normal working person (still interested in discussions of the wonderful place, though). I think I'll remain a touristy visitor, at least when I pay off my last road trip from Kanab, Utah, through Ridgway and into Durango.
I'll continue to look forward to your posts and everyone else's.

[almost heaven]

Thank you all for the comments on the situation out there, good and bad. I need a realistic view of the job situation. My inlaws are self employed, live on a horse ranch and make plenty of money, so they have it good all the time. I do have real concerns about the construction market though. I build the big type of buildings like concrete parking structures with retail on the bottom and 5 stories if lofts above, so i see that type of construction and alot of retail going up. I am intrested in Parker so we will be close to family and It feels like a real nice place to live and the schools are good for my two kids. well, I will take anymore info you want to share.

[dj32]

I still think construction is pretty strong in commercial/mixed-use development. South Denver, DTC is still experiencing commercial growth with more development planned. Also, the redevelopment of the Gates site will keep many employed for several more years. If you did residential, I would be a little more concerned.

[BigCheeze]

I agree I don't think the water issues are a deal breaker, they are happening all over the West so it's just a fact you have to learn to deal with.

As for the job market, I left the Sacramento area about 3 1/2 yrs ago and I'm making considerably more than I was there, and my wife's salary has doubled. However we are both in IT. So the market out here is pretty good over all from what I can tell.

Now for the construction industry... well Housing has slowed, noticeably. From what I can tell commercial still seems to be going pretty well. They have to build all the retail and business to catch up with all the houses they built, as well as it seems that Colorado based business or business with employees in Colorado are growing here.

While I do not think that Colorado will have this Cinderella story board life in front of it, I think it has a very good outlook a head of it. This can of course change based on the National economy and if we get some real stupid politicians and/or special interest groups that come in a Fubar things up. I do also think that over all Colorado has some growing up to do, and I am not sure if it wants to or if it will. But overall I think it's about 200 times better than any place in California.

[erinkmorse]

Having moved from South Orange county California 6 months ago to Castle Rock (right next to Parker), I have to say I love it here. I was in California for over 20 years. Colorado has soo much to offer...you won't miss California. The school/educational system here is great! Water can be a problem if you have a well,...so make sure you check out the district or community water system. Hardest part I had adjusting was the altitude. Colorado is receiving an abundance of jobs, and since the housing is very affordable, it is worthwhile.... California home prices have just become ridiculous, and especially for what you can buy for in Colorado. If you check out my website, you will see a live webcam of the Castle Rock area.

[a51ampFuse]

This is hard to resist, Colorado-Construction-Jobs-Future?
I am or was a native of Colo. for over 50 yrs. until a few months ago. I moved from there for numerous reasons, but mostly for those you asked about. Here's a couple of facts of Colo. and Denver. Prior to 9/11, the building boom was a fluke. Denver has always had a reputation economically of going up, being good for maybe 2 yrs., then down into the toilet for 3. Denver is a very service oriented city with no economic backbone support. So when it's good,,,it's real good,but when it's bad, it's real bad. Construction, well if you're hispanic and preferably illegal,,, then no problems there. If you're not, good darn luck finding a job, period. Lower wages will continue on a progessively downward direction due to the terrible immigration issues. The future, Colo. is in for some harsh lessons before long. Poorly skilled politicians for many years have seen and chosen growth as it main revenue rather than bringing anchor industry to the state. During the fluke boom, it brought developers from all points to the state that have come to milk it. When the milk is gone, they will be as well. If you have a successful niche, such as a horse ranch, you'd probably be fine. But when you create an atmosphere of such popular practices as spending 230k on a house and lot so you can scrape it for a 800k duplex left and right, with no other financial resourses otherthan that and continued growth through construction of new homes, you're a disaster going somewhere to happen.

[jazzlover]

Originally Posted by a51ampFuse

This is hard to resist, Colorado-Construction-Jobs-Future?
I am or was a native of Colo. for over 50 yrs. until a few months ago. I moved from there for numerous reasons, but mostly for those you asked about. Here's a couple of facts of Colo. and Denver. Prior to 9/11, the building boom was a fluke. Denver has always had a reputation economically of going up, being good for maybe 2 yrs., then down into the toilet for 3. Denver is a very service oriented city with no economic backbone support. So when it's good,,,it's real good,but when it's bad, it's real bad. Construction, well if you're hispanic and preferably illegal,,, then no problems there. If you're not, good darn luck finding a job, period. Lower wages will continue on a progessively downward direction due to the terrible immigration issues. The future, Colo. is in for some harsh lessons before long. Poorly skilled politicians for many years have seen and chosen growth as it main revenue rather than bringing anchor industry to the state. During the fluke boom, it brought developers from all points to the state that have come to milk it. When the milk is gone, they will be as well. If you have a successful niche, such as a horse ranch, you'd probably be fine. But when you create an atmosphere of such popular practices as spending 230k on a house and lot so you can scrape it for a 800k duplex left and right, with no other financial resourses otherthan that and continued growth through construction of new homes, you're a disaster going somewhere to happen.

You hit the nail right on the head. Colorado's latter day growth is like a chain letter. Fine, until somebody (or something) breaks the chain--then flop it goes.