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Does your "all" include those who are excluded from all medical care because they have only Medicare and can't afford any supplements?
I answered that in my previous post:
"Some people have different priorities for their lives and they will pay for a Bronco Game but not for these additional programs. Of course these are the same people who say they cannot afford auto insurance but can go to a bar, every night.
Many of these programs are free. I am on Medicare and I pay a small amount for additional coverage on a Medicare Advantage Plan, but there is also an option for a no cost additional coverage.
You cannot argue that these people are poor and cannot afford to pay extra--remember some are free. In addition low income are provided lower cost or no cost Part B Medical Insurance, which you continue to pay when on medicare. Also, they are supplemented with Part D Prescription Drug Coverage costs and are given more coverage for less cost when Medicare is provided with Medicaid. To round it out Part A is Hospital Insurance."
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Again it is about choices. I know this issue very well because I had a good job, good money and suddenly I got very sick and became disabled--lost my job, my income. I had to learn about medicare and these issues. However, there was a big difference between me and the whinners that permeate the world--I was alway thrifty and saved my money, so when the rainy day came--I was able to survive.
Now, I live on very little. So, do not give me the sad story about these people who cannot pay their mortgages; cannot get health insurance because they want everything now and go into debt to buy luxuries. They should pay their mortgages first; have health insurance and have these basic expenses as priorities. Sure, there are people and families that have situations that are beyond their control and need and deserve help--but many of these cry babies caused the problems themselves.
Do not get me wrong, I am not defending the system. I think it has many severe problems. I am just pointing out how to work with the current situation. We need national health insurance with coverage for all--that should be our priorities in this country.
Lest we forget. Below is the original POST. I did not mean for it to get sidetracked (Hijacked). I feel I gave OutBnd a piece of information that they need to keep in mind when considering moving to any place.
There must be another Forum for further discussions on our Health Care system.
Quote:
Originally Posted by OutBnd
We are in our early 70's and desperate to leave So Cal, even if it means moving away from family. Grand Junction seems to be a community we could enjoy even in our later years. We enjoy outdoor activities such as gardening, hiking, photographing wildlife; and we enjoy indoor activities such as geneology, theater/concerts, wood working, and continuing education. Since we are on a fixed income now, we are concerned with the cost of living, especially costs such as income tax, sales tax, auto registration, insurance. We are also seeking a community with good quality health care, 4 seasons, friendly neighbors and a sense of community. Do you think Grand Junction would be a good place for people like us to move to?
Many of these programs are free. I am on Medicare and I pay a small amount for additional coverage on a Medicare Advantage Plan, but there is also an option for a no cost additional coverage.
You cannot argue that these people are poor and cannot afford to pay extra--remember some are free. In addition low income are provided lower cost or no cost Part B Medical Insurance, which you continue to pay when on medicare. Also, they are supplemented with Part D Prescription Drug Coverage costs and are given more coverage for less cost when Medicare is provided with Medicaid. To round it out Part A is Hospital Insurance."
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None of this is any use if doctors will not accept you, which is reportedly the case in GJ.
Jazzlover: thank-you so much! Very well stated and informative. It appears our concerns were as we feared. It is so beautiful there, and the homes and neighborhoods so appealing, yet, the factors that can make a place ( like California) turn from wonderful to problematic are reaching even Colorado. It seems so many places in our country are experiencing the same troubles: growing crime, meth infestation, diminising dollar power, less than excellent medical care, education, community. I guess we are looking for utopia. Some things that make for a good quality of life are just too important to live without: clear air, adequate water, safety, community, beauty. Wish I knew where we could find all five!!
I lived in Palisade for a while (east of Grand Junction). I was first attracted to it because of the fruit stands and wineries, plus I found a great builder who built me a beautiful custom home. But in fall and spring, the farmers burn brush by permit, and the smoke just hangs in that valley. So on a nice day, forget having your windows open if you're sensitive to smoke. Plus, the town was very old-fashioned and slow to change for the better, so I got bored after 3-1/2 years and left.
Also, I did not like having to drive so far to get to the major shopping on the west side of Grand Junction - about 15 miles on the interstate -- easy, but with gas prices so high now, I'm glad I moved away from there, but don't like my new location either -- Montrose (won't get into the reasons why in this forum -- that's another story). All I'll say is I wish I'd never moved south of the Grand Junction area. Live and learn...........
You say you'd love to find a combination of clear air, adequate water, safety, community, beauty. So would I. How about changing your focus from the mountain west to, say, the plains - like eastern Kansas. I am looking into Johnson County, KS. They have some beautiful homes there reasonably priced -- and with beautifully finished basements. One negative about KS is the danger of tornadoes, so a basement is a "must have" in tornado alley. Basements are very rare on Colorado's western slope, partly because of water table problems, I'm told. Or maybe the builders are just too lazy to put them in -- I'm not sure. If Jazzlover reads this, perhaps he could set us straight on the basement issue. I've also considered moving to Broomfield, north of Denver, where I used to live back in the 80's, but Denver is a zoo now with all the explosive growth, so not too sure about that. I just see my days in Montrose ending before long as I get more restless and unhappy. Sure, there are no mountains in Kansas, but I think the plains and meadows with their unobstructed sunrises and sunsets are just as beautiful -- just different. I need all the hours of sun I can get, and here in Colorado, we're cheated out of some of it, as I found out when I first moved here back in '82.
You say you'd love to find a combination of clear air, adequate water, safety, community, beauty. So would I. How about changing your focus from the mountain west to, say, the plains - like eastern Kansas. I am looking into Johnson County, KS. They have some beautiful homes there reasonably priced -- and with beautifully finished basements. One negative about KS is the danger of tornadoes, so a basement is a "must have" in tornado alley. Basements are very rare on Colorado's western slope, partly because of water table problems, I'm told. Or maybe the builders are just too lazy to put them in -- I'm not sure. If Jazzlover reads this, perhaps he could set us straight on the basement issue. I've also considered moving to Broomfield, north of Denver, where I used to live back in the 80's, but Denver is a zoo now with all the explosive growth, so not too sure about that. I just see my days in Montrose ending before long as I get more restless and unhappy. Sure, there are no mountains in Kansas, but I think the plains and meadows with their unobstructed sunrises and sunsets are just as beautiful -- just different. I need all the hours of sun I can get, and here in Colorado, we're cheated out of some of it, as I found out when I first moved here back in '82.
I wish you luck in finding your dream spot.
There are some places--especially around irrigation--that water seepage into basements can be an issue in west-central Colorado, but mostly it's just a case of construction costs. No danger of tornadoes in western Colorado, relatively mild winters (with relatively low energy costs, though rapidly changing now) make basements a hard sell.
Funny that you should mention eastern Kansas. I actually think there are some beautiful areas there--especially in the Flint Hills. Unfortunately, the climate there is pretty brutal in the summer. 90°+ temperatures constantly in the summer, with high humidity and "hot" nights can be miserable. The storm issues don't personally bother me (I study thunderstorms for a hobby), but those storms certainly can be unnerving--especially if they go tornadic. I disagree that Johnson County, Kansas is attractive. It has the same suburban sprawl crap issues that the Front Range in Colorado does. In fact, I'm not especially enamored with the Kansas City metro area at all. I also have spent some time in Topeka and, while it is a very historical city, it has some real crime issues--a surprise for a medium-size Midwestern city. On the other hand, many of the smaller towns in eastern Kansas have real charm, low housing costs, low crime, and great people. Something that rural Colorado should envy is that many of those smaller towns actually have some local industry that often pays relatively decent wages. A question I am pondering is which areas are going to fare better if the economy/energy situation in this country gets as dire as I think it might. I am not convinced that much of Colorado is going to be a very livable place to be in that scenario, but I also see challenges in places like Kansas, too. That bears some more research . . .
To return to the OP's question, I don't think Grand Junction is going to be a great long-term place for retirees. Why? I've seen what Grand Junction is like when it busts. It's not pretty and a lot of services and amenities that retirees expect could be unavailable if a bust happens again. Conversely, if Grand Junction continues to boom as it is now with the energy industry, it likely will not remain a very attractive place for retirees. Living in a "boomtown" is no fun if you are not making the big money that the "boomers" are (and I don't mean Baby Boomers, I mean people who "chase" the boom). Sort of a "Heads I win, tails you lose" proposition.
There are some places--especially around irrigation--that water seepage into basements can be an issue in west-central Colorado, but mostly it's just a case of construction costs. No danger of tornadoes in western Colorado, relatively mild winters (with relatively low energy costs, though rapidly changing now) make basements a hard sell.
Funny that you should mention eastern Kansas. I actually think there are some beautiful areas there--especially in the Flint Hills. Unfortunately, the climate there is pretty brutal in the summer. 90°+ temperatures constantly in the summer, with high humidity and "hot" nights can be miserable. The storm issues don't personally bother me (I study thunderstorms for a hobby), but those storms certainly can be unnerving--especially if they go tornadic. I disagree that Johnson County, Kansas is attractive. It has the same suburban sprawl crap issues that the Front Range in Colorado does. In fact, I'm not especially enamored with the Kansas City metro area at all. I also have spent some time in Topeka and, while it is a very historical city, it has some real crime issues--a surprise for a medium-size Midwestern city. On the other hand, many of the smaller towns in eastern Kansas have real charm, low housing costs, low crime, and great people. Something that rural Colorado should envy is that many of those smaller towns actually have some local industry that often pays relatively decent wages. A question I am pondering is which areas are going to fare better if the economy/energy situation in this country gets as dire as I think it might. I am not convinced that much of Colorado is going to be a very livable place to be in that scenario, but I also see challenges in places like Kansas, too. That bears some more research . . .
To return to the OP's question, I don't think Grand Junction is going to be a great long-term place for retirees. Why? I've seen what Grand Junction is like when it busts. It's not pretty and a lot of services and amenities that retirees expect could be unavailable if a bust happens again. Conversely, if Grand Junction continues to boom as it is now with the energy industry, it likely will not remain a very attractive place for retirees. Living in a "boomtown" is no fun if you are not making the big money that the "boomers" are (and I don't mean Baby Boomers, I mean people who "chase" the boom). Sort of a "Heads I win, tails you lose" proposition.
You didn't mention what I think is the main "plus" for having a basement; that is, a basement doubles the square footage of your living space if it is finished. I only paid $15,000 extra for the one I had in Palisade -- that's a small amount to pay to double your living/storage space. I never had it finished, but I'm sure the couple with two boys I sold it to did, as they were planning. Sure, that costs money to do, but, all in all, I think it's a great investment.
Yeah, hot nights would not be my cup of tea after being able to sleep with the windows wide open here and listen to the birds in the early morning. I lived in TX for 7 years and hated having to keep the A/C on all night -- it was like living in a sealed office building. But that's not what drove me away from Texas; it was the property taxes in the Austin area. They brag about not having a state income tax. Big deal. We have one here in CO, and it doesn't impact me one bit, especially since my pension is exempted. I enjoyed the Texas people; they treated me very well in spite of the fact I'm a yankee. The weather there from about October to mid-April was great, but I dreaded the summers; even the natives complained about the heat. I have a feeling I'd be singing the same song if I moved to Kansas City. I've been there in the summer (when the Yankees play the Royals), and know how hot it is. Still, I like the area in many ways -- and the people.
I know what you mean about tornado concerns. In Texas, I worried every time the sky clouded up, thinking "is this it?" In fact, I was living in Austin when that F5 hit Jarrell in May of '97, wiping a whole subdivision off the map and killing 27 people. The forecaster said it was coming south (towards my area in south Austin) following I-35. I grabbed my dog and went to an interior closet, but that would have done us no good had that thing hit us.
Remembering that huge bust in Grand Junction back in early '82, I had my Michigan house for sale in the spring of '81, planning to move to Grand Junction to work for Exxon and even had contacts lined up. Luckily for me, my house didn't sell, so I stayed in Michigan another year, eventually getting a transfer with my company to Denver. Had I moved to Grand Junction in 1981, it would have been a personal disaster. You're right, though, about the possibility of services going away in the event of another bust. I don't like what I hear about doctors in the area refusing to take on Medicare patients. I have a 90-year old friend up there whose doctor recently retired, and he had a heck of a time finding another. I don't see how doctors can legally get away with not taking Medicare patients. But that's a topic for another day.
Because of our mobility in this country, we have a lot of choices to pick from as far as places to live, especially if one is retired and doesn't have to worry about finding a job. No place is 100% ideal, so we just have to go ahead with what looks good at the moment, take the plunge, and see how it works out. Thanks for your input -- definitely gives me stuff to think about.
I don't see how doctors can legally get away with not taking Medicare patients.
Many doctors are primarily businesmen, who regard the practice of government medicine as an unnecessary evil. Accepting medicare patients for these businessmen is not good business, not only in Grand Junction, but just about everywhere.
FiftyFiftyAboutCO wrote:
No place is 100% ideal, so we just have to go ahead with what looks good at the moment, take the plunge, and see how it works out.
Agreed! You can do exhaustive research, pick the seemingly best place based on your research, and still pick a loser. Some times you win, some times you lose. On the other hand, someone might do minimal research, get lucky and pick a place that they enjoy for the rest of their life. IMO, good luck plays a more important role than all of the research in the world. There is no way ( that I know of ) to research how it's going to work out. However, you can't rely on good luck alone. You gotta do some research too and take the bull by the horns.
It's similar to the story of this religious party travelling thru the jungle. Several members were arguing as to wether it was best to tie up the horses at night or pray to God to look after them. Then a loud voice reverberated thru the jungle, Tie up your horses AND pray to God.
Last edited by CosmicWizard; 07-17-2008 at 12:21 PM..
Reason: spelling error spotted
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Grand Junction seems to be a community we could enjoy even in our later years. We enjoy outdoor activities such as gardening, hiking, photographing wildlife; and we enjoy indoor activities such as geneology, theater/concerts, wood working, and continuing education. Since we are on a fixed income now, we are concerned with the cost of living, especially costs such as income tax, sales tax, auto registration, insurance. We are also seeking a community with good quality health care, 4 seasons, friendly neighbors and a sense of community. Do you think Grand Junction would be a good place for people like us to move to?
former Grand Junction-area resident
