U.S. CitiesCity-Data Forum Index
Go Back   City-Data Forum > U.S. Forums > Colorado
 [Register]
Please register to participate in our discussions with 1.5 million other members - it's free and quick! Some forums can only be seen by registered members. After you create your account, you'll be able to customize options and access all our 15,000 new posts/day with fewer ads.
Jump to a detailed profile or search
site with Google Custom Search

Search Forums  (Advanced)
Business Search - 14 Million verified businesses
Search for:  near: 
Reply Start New Thread
 
Old 03-16-2012, 05:21 AM
 
Location: 80904 West siiiiiide!
2,755 posts, read 4,753,471 times
Reputation: 1227

Advertisements

Quote:
Originally Posted by jazzlover View Post
Actually, 85 octane fuel in Colorado will behave about the same as 87 octane fuel at near sea level. Read all about it here:

Octane rating - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia

The rule of thumb is to run your vehicle on the lowest octane fuel that will not cause knocking in the engine. Using higher octane fuel than necessary is just a waste of money.

Octane is not a measure of energy in a gallon of gasoline. In fact, some higher octane fuels may have less energy, because ethanol is often used as a cheap octane booster.

Personally, I would not own a vehicle that requires higher octane fuel. It locks you into paying a premium for fuel for the life of the vehicle. Also, truth is, if I were buying a new vehicle today, I would be buying the absolutely most fuel-efficient vehicle that would meet my needs. The coming $6+ per gallon gas (certainly coming within the lifetime of a new vehicle) will make a gas guzzler a real t**d to own down the road.
I spent my youth and young driving days in Ohio where there is only 87 octane, and when I moved back to Colorado, I was in horror that people were putting 85 in their tanks and there was "no way" I was putting **** water in my tank, but then realized, that like you said, because of the altitude, it behaves like 87 octane at sea level. That being said, I feel Colorado gets kinda ripped off. We pay the same for 85 octane that the rest of the country get 87 for.
Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message

 
Old 03-16-2012, 09:38 AM
 
Location: Northern MN
3,870 posts, read 5,460,967 times
Reputation: 3215
The effect of increasing altitude may be nonlinear, with one study reporting a decrease of the octane requirement of 1.4 RON/300m from sea level to 1800m and 2.5 RON/300m from 1800m to 3600m . Other studies report the octane number requirement decreased by 1.0 - 1.9 RON/300m without specifying altitude . Modern engine management systems can accommodate this adjustment, and in some recent studies, the octane number requirement was reduced by 0.2 - 0.5 (R+M)/2 per 300m increase in altitude. The larger reduction on older engines was due to:- - reduced air density provides lower combustion temperature and pressure. - fuel is metered according to air volume, consequently as density decreases the stoichiometry moves to rich, with a lower octane number requirement. - manifold vacuum controlled spark advance, and reduced manifold vacuum results in less spark advance.


J. C. Callison - Amoco Oil Co.
Abstract:


Past tests of vehicles show that their octane number requirements decrease with altitude. As a result, gasoline marketers sell lower-octane-number (ON) gasoline in the mountain states and other high-altitude areas. The current ASTM specifications, which allow reduction of gasoline octane of 1.0 to 1.5 ON per thousand feet, are based on CRC test programs run on 1967 to 1972 model vehicles. However, many new vehicles are now equipped with sophisticated electronic engine systems for control of emissions and improvement of performance and fuel economy at all altitudes. Because these new systems could minimize the altitude effect on octane requirement, Amoco Oil tested twelve 1984-1986 model cars and light trucks. We found their ON requirements were reduced on average about 0.2 ON per thousand feet on an (R+M)/2 basis (RMON/1,000 feet). We expect octane demand on gasoline suppliers in high-altitude areas to increase as these new cars make up a larger part of the vehicle population, and this could raise the cost of gasoline.

Last edited by snofarmer; 03-16-2012 at 09:56 AM..
Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message
 
Old 03-16-2012, 09:41 AM
 
2,755 posts, read 8,685,215 times
Reputation: 1374
Quote:
Originally Posted by Lawman_Kyle View Post
I couldn't figure out why gas was so much cheaper in Colorado ( Pueblo up to Loveland ) than it is here in Oklahoma. Not just a little cheaper, but 30-40 cents cheaper. Then I got to looking closely and noticed that it was 85 octane instead of 87. I've never seen 85 before. Is there a reason Colorado offers this? I searched some past forums and couldn't get any good answers.

I fueled up with 87 cause thats what our Nitro was used to. Anyone got the answer?
The Rocky Mountain West of late has been the lowest in the country for fuel prices. We have our own refineries that formulate fuel for our region, and for a variety of reasons that fuel can't be shipped out just anywhere (the 85 Octane is one part of that, but from what I understand a fairly small part.)

From what I understand, we are also the beneficiaries of proximity to petroleum supplies in Alberta, as well as other places. Inadequacies in pipeline infrastructure means that it's cheaper to get the supply to refineries that serve the Mountain West rather than other places. That causes a ripple effect.

There's a similar benefit to our energy bills here -- Colorado has among the nation's lowest price for natural gas, because we and our neighbors are major producers, and there's not a lot of easy ways to get that natural gas to markets elsewhere.

It makes me wonder if the proposed Keystone XL pipeline would actually have a negative effect on Colorado fuel prices, because it would allow supply to reach other markets in a more efficient way.
Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message
 
Old 03-17-2012, 10:42 AM
 
8,177 posts, read 16,200,501 times
Reputation: 8259
Quote:
Originally Posted by tfox View Post
It makes me wonder if the proposed Keystone XL pipeline would actually have a negative effect on Colorado fuel prices, because it would allow supply to reach other markets in a more efficient way.
That is exactly the result my friends who work in the Colorado natural gas industry predict (and are hoping for).
Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message
 
Old 06-23-2012, 09:15 AM
 
Location: CO
2,327 posts, read 3,951,237 times
Reputation: 2693
Quote:
Originally Posted by md21722 View Post
Lawman_Kyle,

Much of the year Colorado gas is higher than Oklahoma gas. In the winter time the Rocky Mountain states seem to have cheaper fuel prices. Come summer, it will be higher in Colorado. . .
To update this thread. . .

As this poster and several others said above - notice now that our gas prices are higher than the national average:

From the AAA's DailyFuel Gauge Report, current national average for gas is $3.43 a gallon; in Colorado it's $3.69 (current Denver $3.65, current Colorado Springs $3.64).
Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message
 
Old 06-23-2012, 09:26 AM
 
4,153 posts, read 5,999,320 times
Reputation: 2920
Quote:
Originally Posted by Johnhw2 View Post
Its supplemented with butane in colder weather. Butane is a nice high octane number and is relatively inexpensive but gasoline wont handle as much in warmer weather and at higher altitudes as sea level too.

Also lower octane gasoline is cheaper to make then higher but not by 30 cents per gal or so as cited as the difference between OK and CO regular.

Side not, Hyundai gives the HP of their engines as two numbers. One is the HP you get with high octane fuel and the lower HP is the lower octane fuel result. Thats what happens with most modern high tech engines but they are the only ones who advertise it this way to my knowledge

Butane is used to increase the RVP so facilities can make easy money. Butane is cheaper than gasoline per gallon thus when you inject butane in gas you make the difference between the 2 minus expenses of course. It has nothing to do with helping to raise the octane rating.
Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message
 
Old 06-23-2012, 12:47 PM
 
8,177 posts, read 16,200,501 times
Reputation: 8259
Quote:
Originally Posted by suzco View Post
To update this thread. . .

As this poster and several others said above - notice now that our gas prices are higher than the national average:

From the AAA's DailyFuel Gauge Report, current national average for gas is $3.43 a gallon; in Colorado it's $3.69 (current Denver $3.65, current Colorado Springs $3.64).
It's been that way for years--as a fellow I know who was both a wholesale disrtibutor and service station owner for several decades in rural Colorado would substantiate. The wholesalers and retailers always pad their margins during the summer tourist season. They know that the "turistas" have to pay the price for fuel, whether they like it or not. Of course, the locals get to "enjoy" the same prices. When the summer tourist season ends and the fuel sellers have to rely more exclusively on the local residents, prices usually will back off some.
Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message
 
Old 06-24-2012, 12:27 PM
 
Location: La Crosse, WI
137 posts, read 158,808 times
Reputation: 91
I was out in Colorado about 10 years ago and drove basically from around 600ft in elevation here in Wisconsin to 14,000ft on Mt Evans... the difference in power was amazing. My car was such a dog at elevation...although it did seem like my gas mileage was higher out there.
Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message
 
Old 06-24-2012, 05:18 PM
 
Location: The 719
8,234 posts, read 13,482,062 times
Reputation: 9650
Yeah I think I know what you mean.

My car gets really good gas mileage when I'm going down Mt Evans.
Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message
 
Old 06-24-2012, 07:10 PM
 
8,177 posts, read 16,200,501 times
Reputation: 8259
Quote:
Originally Posted by franktank232 View Post
I was out in Colorado about 10 years ago and drove basically from around 600ft in elevation here in Wisconsin to 14,000ft on Mt Evans... the difference in power was amazing. My car was such a dog at elevation...although it did seem like my gas mileage was higher out there.
That is not uncommon in modern fuel-injected cars. At higher altitudes, the engine's computer automatically leans out the fuel injection to keep an optimum fuel/air mixture. Engine power is reduced, but fuel economy can actually improve. The rule for non-turbochanged engines is a loss of 3%-4% of horspower per 1,000 feet of elevation.
Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message
Please register to post and access all features of our very popular forum. It is free and quick. Over $68,000 in prizes has already been given out to active posters on our forum. Additional giveaways are planned.

Detailed information about all U.S. cities, counties, and zip codes on our site: City-data.com.


Reply
Please update this thread with any new information or opinions. This open thread is still read by thousands of people, so we encourage all additional points of view.

Quick Reply
Message:


Options
X
Data:
Loading data...
Based on 2000-2011 data
Loading data...

123
Hide US histogram


Over $84,000 in prizes was already given out to active posters on our forum and additional giveaways are planned!

Go Back   City-Data Forum > U.S. Forums > Colorado

All times are GMT -6.

2005-2014, Advameg, Inc.

City-Data.com - Archive 1, 2, 3, 4, 5, 6, 7, 8, 9, 10, 11, 12, 13, 14, 15, 16, 17, 18, 19, 20, 21, 22, 23, 24, 25 - Top