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Old 07-03-2017, 08:34 AM
 
Location: Colorado Springs
4,798 posts, read 4,901,271 times
Reputation: 17166

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"Colorado faces massive shortage of construction workers. A fix wonít be easy.
Construction needs skilled workers, and they canít hit the job market quickly enough."


By 2025, the state expects to add 56,000 new construction jobs, and 40,000 more could become available because of retirements, according to an economic impact study released in January by the CSU researchers. Right now, the industry employs 148,604.

The shortage is nationwide but particularly distressing in Colorado, a state with the lowest unemployment rate in the country, 2.3 percent, coupled with one of the highest growth rates. In other words, there are a lot of things to build and too few people to build them. As some observers put it, if you are unemployed in this state now, thereís a reason ó typically a lack of skills.


Colorado faces massive shortage of construction workers. A fix won't be easy.

I've read that the housing demand in Colorado Springs is so large that new houses are now sold before they even have drywall.

I also think that we've lost workers due to the current posture wrt illegals.
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Old 07-03-2017, 08:26 PM
 
Location: mancos
7,170 posts, read 6,449,848 times
Reputation: 4943
We got treated like crap were replaced with low wage Mexicans and now you want us back?Too bad I won't even look at a job for less than 40 an hour. You convinced younger generations we were animals and college loans were the only way to escape being a low life tradesman.
my how the tables have turned.I will never retire as I love Carpentry but I will never work for anyone who does not respect me.I am past retirement age and am allowed to be
grumpy.
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Old 07-04-2017, 06:54 AM
 
Location: Colorado Springs
4,798 posts, read 4,901,271 times
Reputation: 17166
Quote:
Originally Posted by parfleche View Post
We got treated like crap were replaced with low wage Mexicans and now you want us back?Too bad I won't even look at a job for less than 40 an hour. You convinced younger generations we were animals and college loans were the only way to escape being a low life tradesman.
my how the tables have turned.I will never retire as I love Carpentry but I will never work for anyone who does not respect me.I am past retirement age and am allowed to be
grumpy.
I can't say I blame you for feeling like that. But I don't know of a solution.

Way back in 1992, when I had a house built, I became aware of the labor issue. The builders went for the lowest priced sub-contractors and many of them were staffed by illegals who learned, for example, how to put up sheet rock by copying the other guy. They would just repeat each others mistakes.

I was surprised to discover that the largest purchase in my life was being constructed with the least amount of process control by the most poorly trained workers. The attitude in the industry was to do it over instead of doing it right the first time. I also discovered that most of the full custom home builders were using the same subs as the volume builders.

Because home building is so cyclical, most of the workers must be temporary. Also, most home buyers are focused on getting the lowest cost per square foot.

The industry will never accept regulation and certification of the trades as done in other places like Germany.

What's different this time is that it's getting harder for employers to find or employ illegals. Perhaps that's causing the ridiculously high cost of building new houses.
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Old 07-04-2017, 08:30 AM
 
Location: Washington Park, Denver
6,905 posts, read 6,501,326 times
Reputation: 7355
Quote:
Originally Posted by parfleche View Post
We got treated like crap were replaced with low wage Mexicans and now you want us back?Too bad I won't even look at a job for less than 40 an hour. You convinced younger generations we were animals and college loans were the only way to escape being a low life tradesman.
my how the tables have turned.I will never retire as I love Carpentry but I will never work for anyone who does not respect me.I am past retirement age and am allowed to be
grumpy.
Vote for anti regulation, union busting politicians who think the free market is a panacea and get anti regulation, free market policy.
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Old 07-04-2017, 09:39 AM
 
Location: Phoenix, AZ
2,561 posts, read 1,808,146 times
Reputation: 2659
I don't mind private employee unions as long as the state has right to work laws. Illegal immigrant labor has unfairly suppressed construction labor wages.
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Old 07-04-2017, 10:22 AM
 
33 posts, read 30,064 times
Reputation: 92
Quote:
Originally Posted by parfleche View Post
We got treated like crap were replaced with low wage Mexicans and now you want us back?Too bad I won't even look at a job for less than 40 an hour. You convinced younger generations we were animals and college loans were the only way to escape being a low life tradesman.
my how the tables have turned.I will never retire as I love Carpentry but I will never work for anyone who does not respect me.I am past retirement age and am allowed to be
grumpy.
If they use such cheep labor why do they charge so much for a new home?
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Old 07-04-2017, 11:58 AM
 
20,842 posts, read 39,064,756 times
Reputation: 19075
Quote:
Originally Posted by Vision67 View Post
... builders went for the lowest priced sub-contractors ....
One of the things I learned is builders often tell the subs how much they'll pay for a given job, i.e., to put a roof of X quality on a roof of X square feet, we'll pay you X dollars, take it or leave it. Subs either take the deal or walk. Subs who take the deal then must squeeze every aspect to assure the most profit. It isn't like military style "cost plus fixed fee" contracting. The subs then find the cheapest of everything, especially the labor. Used to be in the DC area that the "hiring hall" was the parking lot at the lumber yard or 7-11 store where subs would go and ask total strangers to come work on homes. The only quality control is if the builder sends his rep out to make on-site inspections of finished work.

That business model differs greatly from how we buy things as individuals. To replace OUR A/C systems or roofs we individual citizens get estimates from a few contractors and pick the one we deem best meets our needs, price AND other factors considered. When I did a few Army contracts in the IT business, we made sure that "price" was just one of many considerations, else we'd end up with a low-bid firm doing a drive-by dump of IT gear on our shipping dock.

To go slightly off topic, look at how the allegedly shoddy construction of condos, with all the construction defect lawsuits against builders, has hobbled the building of condos in the Denver area. I've no doubt many builders of these multiple dwelling units use the same practice of hiring the cheapest subs they can find for the work. And it shows.

I don't blame Parfleche for his frustration with the 'cheap cheap cheap' mentality of many builders and some people. I've no doubt he knows his king, jack and cripple studs from one another, when to use a flitch plate header, and a thousand other things. I did some of this work when I was younger. Much younger. I still love the smell of sawdust....
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Last edited by Mike from back east; 07-04-2017 at 12:15 PM..
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Old 07-04-2017, 12:07 PM
 
Location: The Berk in Denver, CO USA
13,950 posts, read 20,207,715 times
Reputation: 22581
Default Basic Market Economics

Quote:
Originally Posted by RobertGray View Post
If they use such cheep labor why do they charge so much for a new home?
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Old 07-05-2017, 07:39 AM
 
Location: The 719
14,498 posts, read 22,347,982 times
Reputation: 13810
Quote:
Originally Posted by Vision67 View Post
"Colorado faces massive shortage of construction workers. A fix wonít be easy.
Construction needs skilled workers, and they canít hit the job market quickly enough."


By 2025, the state expects to add 56,000 new construction jobs, and 40,000 more could become available because of retirements, according to an economic impact study released in January by the CSU researchers. Right now, the industry employs 148,604.

The shortage is nationwide but particularly distressing in Colorado, a state with the lowest unemployment rate in the country, 2.3 percent, coupled with one of the highest growth rates. In other words, there are a lot of things to build and too few people to build them. As some observers put it, if you are unemployed in this state now, thereís a reason ó typically a lack of skills.


Colorado faces massive shortage of construction workers. A fix won't be easy.

I've read that the housing demand in Colorado Springs is so large that new houses are now sold before they even have drywall.

I also think that we've lost workers due to the current posture wrt illegals.
I'm of the opinion, that's right, opinion, that there are plenty of residential and commercial and industrial structures already up just waiting to be refurbished and dusted off.
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Old 07-05-2017, 09:51 AM
 
Location: Colorado Springs
3,051 posts, read 2,081,073 times
Reputation: 3539
Quote:
Originally Posted by RobertGray View Post
If they use such cheep labor why do they charge so much for a new home?
Because they can. Profit motive ya know. pretty sure they didn't go into business to be altruistic, other wise they would work at non-profits.


Quote:
Originally Posted by McGowdog View Post
I'm of the opinion, that's right, opinion, that there are plenty of residential and commercial and industrial structures already up just waiting to be refurbished and dusted off.
I'd like to think so, but so many people moving here want a new home that better fits their immediate lifestyle that they are willing to pass over lower priced structures 30-50 years old that need some make-overs. But, I really think there are a host of influencing factors in all of these decisions as well.
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