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Old 07-17-2008, 04:40 PM
 
2,253 posts, read 6,957,630 times
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Being no fan of SUVs I never thought I'd say this, but now may be the time that if you have 'em smoke 'em. This simply because even with petrol currently at $4 to $5 per gallon, you may never see its likes again. The best of times in this may have been several years ago when, around Albuquerque, NM at least, petrol could be had for 99¢ per gallon.

Future technology may allow for driving anything you like for little cost in fuel, but other parameters may well be different. Which is what brought this to mind. The era of the great American road trip may be coming to a close. Not just because of fuel prices but also due an ever increasing population, more traffic, and fewer and fewer places where true freedom reigns. Then also if conditions become more critical it could become politically incorrect to take the excursions many Americans grew up believing they naturally deserved by no more than being born.

This not to say I'm advocating wasting resources. But kind of, yes. Call it pure hedonism. A last chance. With 3% of the world's population using 25% of its resources, we've become quite adept at this sort of thing. And a certain pleasure we may be forced to reluctantly give up. The future isn't entirely bleak, and it could be after some adjustment we may find that doing more with less, surprisingly, affords an even better and more comfortable lifestyle. But the road there might have lots of pot holes. Something, by the way, many municipalities in the US can no longer afford to repair.

So fire up that big V-8 engine. Waste it like there is no tomorrow, because in this scenario daybreak comes sooner than you might like. And even if adopting some small fuel efficient hybrid out of necessity, you know in your heart of hearts that given the chance you'd be far happier running it over and off the road with your huge pickup.
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Old 07-17-2008, 06:36 PM
 
Location: Colorado Springs, CO
2,221 posts, read 5,245,953 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Idunn View Post
The era of the great American road trip may be coming to a close. Not just because of fuel prices but also due an ever increasing population, more traffic, and fewer and fewer places where true freedom reigns.
I don't think so. Miles logged on vacations are nothing in comparison to the miles accumulated in the daily commute of the average American. The great American Road Trip is alive and well...and now since I live in Colorado, that road trip is much shorter as I travel to the many and varied places of interest in this state.

If fuel prices are really having an effect on travel, then traffic will decrease, not increase. And as to the number of places where "true freedom reigns"--that sounds like liberal self-flagellating crybaby poppycock to me. If you think freedom doesn't reign in the U.S., you must not get out of the country much.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Idunn View Post
Then also if conditions become more critical it could become politically incorrect to take the excursions many Americans grew up believing they naturally deserved by no more than being born.
Anyone who makes life's choices based on political correctness is an intellectual weakling. Political correctness is nothing more than quasi-codified mob influence.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Idunn View Post
So fire up that big V-8 engine. Waste it like there is no tomorrow, because in this scenario daybreak comes sooner than you might like. And even if adopting some small fuel efficient hybrid out of necessity, you know in your heart of hearts that given the chance you'd be far happier running it over and off the road with your huge pickup.
I own both an SUV and a 45 mpg diesel car. The SUV is 3.5 years old and has 13,000 miles on it. But when I need to get up or down a hill in the snow, or take 4 people and their gear on a camping trip into the mountains, it's a necessity. My 6 year old car has 28000 miles on it. Better to conserve by intelligent choices on housing location than by driving the latest hybrid clown car on the same long commute. Some of those Prius owners are gonna fly right out of their Birkenstocks when they see the $3500 bill for their first battery change.
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Old 07-17-2008, 07:01 PM
 
11,715 posts, read 40,309,597 times
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Well said, Bob. People may take less trips but its not like the road trip is dead. And since fuel prices affect air travel too, I think people might be more likely to drive than fly, especially when they have kids since airlines charge by the seat and auto fuel consumption is affected very little by an extra couple of passengers.

And I lol at most Prius drivers too. Most people simply don't drive enough to make the added cost worth it in fuel savings. If they were really "green", they'd buy a slightly used Corolla. But alas, buying a Prius is more about making a political statement than economics. You're right about the batteries. No rechargable battery technology lasts forever and that's going to be a rude awakening when they start dying.
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Old 07-17-2008, 08:16 PM
 
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Years of cheap fuel has made most Americans into morons in both where they live and what they drive. Those folks are going to discover the folly of both in pretty short order. Bob is absolutely right in saying that people should be worrying about living close to where they work a lot more than trying to trade for a Prius. I now live less than a mile from my work, and I can work from home on some days. Sure does save on fuel.

I tend to keep the vehicles I have bought quite a long time (usually at least 10 years), and I usually buy used. In the last 30 years, I have only bought one vehicle that got worse fuel economy than the vehicle it replaced--one my then-wife wanted. Haven't made that mistake again--wife or car.

It infuriates me that Americans don't have the choices in fuel-efficient vehicles that people in most other countries do--especially diesel-powered vehicles. I have spent much of my life around diesel engines, and today's are better and cleaner than ever, but--because the US would not adopt the quite-strict-enough European diesel emission standards, Americans can't buy those vehicles. We act like a 60 mpg vehicle is pie-in-the-sky for some far-off future day, but Europeans have a wide selection of them to drive right now. And a number of them sold there are made by American auto manufacturers. Just another case where we have our heads up our ***es in this country.

I don't necessarily hate SUV's, either. I have an old 4WD that I keep around for when my work or an occasional backcountry trip requires one. But, for example, it just makes no sense for the likes of some single 20-something childless woman to be driving a 7-passenger SUV back and forth to the gym and tanning salon. That's a marketing job by the auto makers to sell what is profitable to them to a gullible public thinking they are buying "status" or "coolness."
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Old 07-17-2008, 09:10 PM
 
Location: Colorado Springs, CO
2,221 posts, read 5,245,953 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by EscapeCalifornia View Post
And since fuel prices affect air travel too, I think people might be more likely to drive than fly, especially when they have kids since airlines charge by the seat and auto fuel consumption is affected very little by an extra couple of passengers.
Airline travel is soon going to be both cost-prohibitive and hard to come by. The major US airlines, most of which went through bankruptcy and reorganization in the post-9/11 era, all built their reorg plans based on oil at around $60 a barrel. They cannot survive in anything that looks like their current form with fuel costs this high for this long.

My youngest son is taking Amtrak on his journey to college next month. I'm heading to Chicago for a family get-together in the fall, and I will also probably take Amtrak.
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Old 07-17-2008, 09:59 PM
 
Location: Foot of the Rockies
90,316 posts, read 120,147,178 times
Reputation: 35920
Unfortunately, Amtrak takes too long for the average family's 1 wk vacation. I am going to DC later this summer; I do not want to spend 4 days on a train coming and going. I worked too hard to get that vacation time. I want to be there and I want to go to the beach!

A friend of mine bought a Prius, not because she is status conscious (she is anything but), but b/c of the fuel economy. It got totaled in an accident, and she and her DH replaced it with a conventional car. I never really heard why.

My single, 20-something daughter wants to buy a hybrid Ford Escape when she graduates from grad school and gets a job. I really don't think it is that demographic that is buying the SUVs. It's more the 30-something married mothers. In my day, we 30 something moms drove mini-vans.
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Old 07-17-2008, 10:10 PM
 
11,715 posts, read 40,309,597 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Katiana View Post
Unfortunately, Amtrak takes too long for the average family's 1 wk vacation. I am going to DC later this summer; I do not want to spend 4 days on a train coming and going. I worked too hard to get that vacation time. I want to be there and I want to go to the beach!
True. At current airline prices, it still makes sense for my wife and I to fly between Orange County and Denver rather than drive. Driving requires a night in a hotel, fuel, meals, and more importantly 4 travel days round trip. Since the flight is only two hours each way, I save at least two days during which I can make enough to pay for the tickets. (I'm self employed and don't get paid for not working.) Not to mention the miles put on the car and the hours spent behind the wheel.
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Old 07-17-2008, 10:24 PM
 
Location: Burque!
3,556 posts, read 10,181,837 times
Reputation: 859
Quote:
Originally Posted by Katiana View Post
Unfortunately, Amtrak takes too long for the average family's 1 wk vacation. I am going to DC later this summer; I do not want to spend 4 days on a train coming and going. I worked too hard to get that vacation time. I want to be there and I want to go to the beach!

A friend of mine bought a Prius, not because she is status conscious (she is anything but), but b/c of the fuel economy. It got totaled in an accident, and she and her DH replaced it with a conventional car. I never really heard why.

My single, 20-something daughter wants to buy a hybrid Ford Escape when she graduates from grad school and gets a job. I really don't think it is that demographic that is buying the SUVs. It's more the 30-something married mothers. In my day, we 30 something moms drove mini-vans.
Buddy of mine bought the Escape Hybrid last year... it's done better than he hoped (@32mpg average)... as for the mini-van crowd:

Chrysler to build hybrid minivan? - AutoblogGreen
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Old 07-17-2008, 10:49 PM
 
Location: Foot of the Rockies
90,316 posts, read 120,147,178 times
Reputation: 35920
Quote:
Originally Posted by rybert View Post
Buddy of mine bought the Escape Hybrid last year... it's done better than he hoped (@32mpg average)... as for the mini-van crowd:

Chrysler to build hybrid minivan? - AutoblogGreen
That's good news. We're kind of reserving judgement on her buying this car. I'm beyond the mini-van now. I have a Honda CRV. I like it!
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Old 07-17-2008, 10:55 PM
 
Location: Burque!
3,556 posts, read 10,181,837 times
Reputation: 859
Yeah... we're hoping our VW and Mitsubishi pieces of junk hold out until the Volt!

Otherwise maybe a diesel this or that.
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