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I wanted to say that I've encountered the term "free thinkers" on this forum a lot. All from people based in Colorado. Is this a common term in Colorado? I remember the word from 60s movies but it took me more than a little by surprise to see it used so frequently when referring to Californians. In trying to define the term I would think that most people would consider America a country of "free thinkers" and not limit it to a specific state. I hope I don't sound preachy, I really don't mean to. Most of the posts here are great or helpful, or at least funny, but some are so angry. I don't want to move to Colorado but you don't see me throwing out nasty comments about it. Give Southern California a break, it's a great place to live.
LA Girl
I think free-thinkers refers to the common sterotype of Californians as a bunchy of limp-wristed peaceniks who meet in coffee houses wearing black turtlenecks, thin wirey glasses, and the perfunctory goatee.
For the record, I don't believe that about Californians. In fact, I would say Ronald Reagan (Simi Valley) is more representative of SoCal than the peaceniks. In LA, Santa Monica, etc. you'll find the coffee guys--but outside of that you find an area markedly similar to Colorado. It's like people thinking Boulder--little old Boulder--is anything like Colorado. Totally unfair sterotype.
Thanks, Mike, I think a deep breath is needed. I wanted to say that I've encountered the term "free thinkers" on this forum a lot. LA Girl
LA Girl, thanks for the kind words. IMO, the term "free thinkers" was never very specific and at this point has no more meaning than "on sale" or "new and improved." Some people use the term to connote an idle, mindless, wavering or flittering butterfly existence. Other use it to describe those who are open minded, and able to discuss, consider and weight alternatives, or are not mindless sheeple following some pied piper's rigid orthodoxy (whether economic, political, social or religious orthodoxy). And Rawlings' post reminds me of the old stereotype of free thinkers as non-conformists. (Nothing wrong with "non-conformity" as long as no laws are broken. Hell, if we all liked the same things this would be a dreary existence.)
I like people who think for themselves and if that is a free thinker, so be it. I do not like people who have a knee jerk response to things and just recite old rote doctrine, trite expressions or stereotypical thinking.
s/Mike from back east....long-winded as usual.....
Well, I guess by some conservative posters I am a free-thinking beatnik, peacenik, Colorado loving liberal New Mexican Hispanic. Whew, after I catch my breath on that, I will say Mike is right; what a boring world this would be if we were all cast from the same mold.
Could you tell me why so many Californians leave such beauty and the ocean to boot just to live in Colorado?
I'm wondering the same. I am lost without the Ocean not to mention the altitude sickness. It is beautiful in CO though and I will miss it. I love my house and the weather. I just don't feel alive without the pull of the Ocean. I'm from Long Island which I don't love but it is surrounded by water...
So, the point is that California grew too fast, got overrun with immigrants and transplants, became less than desirable, and the natives want to move to someplace like Colorado--so it grows too fast, gets overrun with immigrants and transplants, becomes less desirable, and the natives want to leave . . . I get it.
And you wonder why so many of Colorado natives dislike Californians and other transplants?
Just for the record, we are all transplants in America. Colorado is still sparse because it's not on the coast. A lot of people would like to be able to hop on a boat at will....just in case a plane is not handy during a melt down or something.
I'm wondering the same. I am lost without the Ocean not to mention the altitude sickness. It is beautiful in CO though and I will miss it. I love my house and the weather. I just don't feel alive without the pull of the Ocean. I'm from Long Island which I don't love but it is surrounded by water...
You'll be fine...so much here to love and enjoy.
Wife and I are on the "ding" service from SW Airlines. We just got $100 round trip airfares to FL & DC area. We decided we could live here, save $2,000 per month on a mortgage versus CA prices, and the savings MORE than cover a few trip home to Bal'mer (Charm City) for crabcakes and crab imperial and softshell crabs...in fact, will be eating that stuff this Saturday night.... Point is, live here, save a fortune on housing compared to NY or CA or FL, take a few trips and you'll still come out WAY ahead.
I just ran a search and the cheapest 3 bedroom home in Orcutt is $329,000, and Santa Maria is $300,000. Those are basic 3 bed/1 bath older homes. So $100,000 a year even there doesn't by much. Not to mention everything else is California costs about 30-50% more. Gas is almost a dollar more than the rest of the country. Groceries are more, entertainment is more, etc.
Not to mention that wherever you go there is always hoards of people around. Forget having a decent conversation with someone, chances are they don't speak english. The school system basically sucks. They tax you on everything. It seems like there is also too much greed in California. Everyone wants to suck every dime out of you.
There is little sense of community. Neighbors barely say hello. When I go to the store, I feel like leaving because the teenagers use such foul language all the time.
It takes you a half hour to get to Safeway any time of any day, and it's only a mile away. Then once I get there, there are about 200 people in line and 3 registers open. Then when I walk back out to my car, there are people soliciting for people to buy stuff.
Living that close to the beach to me isn't that important. Usually it's too cold or polluted to go in the water anyway. The weather is Colorado is pretty much the same as California, except the winters get a little colder. They have a lot of sun and nice weather 8 months out of the year. The other 4 are perfect for skiing.
I'll take Colorado; where my neighbors are friendly, I can buy a home a nice home for under $300,000, I can hold an intelligent conversation with people who have decent family values; over California anyday.
Once my tour is complete here I'm gone. I'll come back to visit once every 3 years.
This sounds much like our reasons for leaving FL and going to CO. We want to live where the air is clean. Where the cost of our 3 bedroom condo can actually buy us enough land to plant a garden. Where I can walk outside at night and not worry about being mugged. Where you have actual neighbors and community instead of "the B**** that lives downstair," and the rest of our neighbors that we don't even know.
Oceans? Don't know about you folks in CA, but as someone who has lived about 45 minutes from the beach in FL for 12 years now, I've been there maybe 10 times total. Who has time when you're just scrambling to pay the bills?
The things I like about Orlando can pretty much be counted on one hand. We have a good selection of ethnic markets - mostly Oriental and Hispanic. I happen to be a rampaging cook. We have, if you have time, money and energy, some interesting cultural stuff, and a decent arts community. It's a fairly liberal atmosphere, with a minimum of gay bashing and that sort of garbage - we're not gay, but many of my friends are. As a Wiccan, it's also (mostly) a Wiccan-friendly town though being in the bible-belt we have our share of bible thumpers. We have decent access to seafood, though somehow 45 minutes from the ocean, the closest grocery, Winn-Dixie's seafood looks anemic.
Well, I can buy ethnic food on the web. Yeah, I'll have to pay shipping, but I won't have to drive, so it evens out. If I want to go see a play or a museum, Pueblo is only about 45 minutes from where we're moving to, and CO Springs just a bit further. As often as I get to do that, no biggie. Regarding politics/ethics/religion, I'm pretty much quiet regarding those things anyhow, and can do most of the networking I want on the web. Okay seafood may be a challenge, but rainbow trout is tasty as all heck!
I just ran a search and the cheapest 3 bedroom home in Orcutt is $329,000, and Santa Maria is $300,000. Those are basic 3 bed/1 bath older homes. So $100,000 a year even there doesn't by much. Not to mention everything else is California costs about 30-50% more. Gas is almost a dollar more than the rest of the country. Groceries are more, entertainment is more, etc.
Not to mention that wherever you go there is always hoards of people around. Forget having a decent conversation with someone, chances are they don't speak english. The school system basically sucks. They tax you on everything. It seems like there is also too much greed in California. Everyone wants to suck every dime out of you.
There is little sense of community. Neighbors barely say hello. When I go to the store, I feel like leaving because the teenagers use such foul language all the time.
It takes you a half hour to get to Safeway any time of any day, and it's only a mile away. Then once I get there, there are about 200 people in line and 3 registers open. Then when I walk back out to my car, there are people soliciting for people to buy stuff.
Living that close to the beach to me isn't that important. Usually it's too cold or polluted to go in the water anyway. The weather is Colorado is pretty much the same as California, except the winters get a little colder. They have a lot of sun and nice weather 8 months out of the year. The other 4 are perfect for skiing.
I'll take Colorado; where my neighbors are friendly, I can buy a home a nice home for under $300,000, I can hold an intelligent conversation with people who have decent family values; over California anyday.
Once my tour is complete here I'm gone. I'll come back to visit once every 3 years.
First of all, thanks for your service to this great nation. God bless ya.
Second, that was beautifully said! Not only do I completely agree, but if that's the reason that you're coming to Colorado you've made me feel very good about my homestate. Weather, people, friendliness, affordability, family values--you're so right--Colorado is huge on these things and if that's what you're looking for then this is definitely the place.
Well, once again, there seems to be a lot of anger out there from some of you folks regarding California. Luke, I'm sorry you've had such a horrible time in CA. I've lived here for 42 years and I love it. I live in the heart of the San Fernando Valley and it has never taken me half an hour to get to a grocery store or pharmacy that's only 1 mile away from me, lol. But maybe I've been lucky. There do seem to be a lot of people here who always seem to encounter the most traffic, the foulest mouths, the rudest people and I feel for them; they're always bitter and angry. But hey, California isn't for everyone.
As for knowing your neighbors, Lemur, it sounds like you had horrible neighbors in Florida. I've lived in two different neighborhoods in my 42 years here in California and I've known my neighbors; we talk and always wave hello when we see eachother and we rely on each other to look after our homes one of us is out of town. The ones I don't know is because they don't really want to know anyone, but you can find those kind of people anywhere (even in Colorado). I've been to Colorado and, in spite of the fact that I'm moving there (due to my husband) I don't really care for it that much. It's nice, the landscapes are beautiful, the city of Denver has a lot to offer if I want the variety that I will miss from California, the people are nice, the cost of living is better than some states but it's just not me. But it doesn't matter, I'm going to take the same kind of attitude to Colorado that I have in California: You're life is what you make it. You could see graffiti and bad attitudes anywhere (even in Colorado, believe me I've seen it), but I choose to see the good around me where ever I live. Life it too short to be angry all the time. Even though I don't really want to move to Colorado and California will always be my true home it's not worth the effort to bash Colorado and make a list of all the things that aren't good about it like most people have done here about California. I could be that way but I choose not to. It's what you make of it that makes it good or bad. Not everyone can hack it in California, let's not be ugly and bitter about it.
"Dreaming of Hawaii", I envy you! I love Hawaii! Yes, I know CO is not the place for a beach girl but what do you do when your husband is so miserable in L.A. and feels so completely the opposite than you do and finally says he's going to Colorado with or without you? He's as angry and bitter about L.A. as ILUVNM sounds. What do I do? I tell you what I do, I'll move to Colorado with him and see if I can make it work. Like I've said, I believe you create your own life and happiness and I choose to make mine as happy a life as I can. One way of doing that, of course, is to visit my many, many friends and family in L.A. as often as possible! lol. Which will most certainly be when it's snowing, in Colorado. I hate the snow! lol. If that doesn't work out I'll take a page out of your book and move to Hawaii!
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LA Girl
Wow
