grand junction (Montrose, Gunnison: fit in, crime, motel)

[jimmy914]

Well, if you're not LIVING downtown, though, you probably won't see it. I lived on the north end of town first, in a very nice condo complex... even started having problems there with neighbors dealing meth. I worked downtown, so when I was ready to buy a house, I wanted to buy downtown so I could walk to work (I LOVED being able to do that! It was worth the criminal neighbors!). I never saw the bad side of what was going on until I moved in. Literally the night I moved in, somebody broad-sided a cop car in front of my house, then bailed out and ran.... so I had like 20 cop cars in front of my house with this man hunt going on. It was a sign of things to come.
What didn't occur to me was the number of rental properties downtown. It's so bizarre, real estate prices were going sky high, but it was like rent hadn't gone up in 20 years... so you had these $300,000 houses that were renting for like $750 a month! So you had drug dealers moving in next to people like me that had just spent a boat load of money on a victorian dream house.
I actually ended up moving because of a combination of job reasons, and our first baby was on the way, and we wanted to be closer to the grandparents and family. But, after we moved, at some point it suddenly occurred to me "oh my gosh, I am SO glad we ended up moving before the kids came!". I can't imagine what it would be like raising kids with some of the neighbors I had.... not to mention the resident homeless population.... another downtown problem.

[jimmy914]

Originally Posted by CosmicWizard

hey 80...as a general rule of thumb, we tend to see whatever we are looking for and we we expect to see. If a person is looking for crap, that's what they tend to see. If a person is looking for things to be grateful for and happy about, that's what they see. Expectation plays a huge part in shaping our perspective.

I don't want to give the impression that I'm bashing GJ... I loved it there. And the crime problem was the ONLY complaint I had about living downtown. It was fantastic being able to walk to work, to the bank, the post office, grocery store, restaurants, everything.... and the neighbors that actually OWNED their homes were some of the greatest neighbors I've ever had. And honestly, the criminal element didn't bother me that much while I lived there, because they generally just attacked each other and left us alone. Never had my house broken into, although my neighbors did. But, you know, now that I have kids, I just think there's a lot to be said for having a place where they can play outside without you watching like a hawk, and you KNOW they'll be fine.
I came to GJ from a place with serious crime, so it's not like it was shocking or anything.... I just expected a town that size to be a little quieter than it ended up being. I'd probably still move back if the situation was right, but I'd probably stay away from downtown this time!

[Crusis]

I'm glad I read this thread, I'm trying to find a place in the Eastern Rockies for my family, and didn't realize that GJ was in the desert area. What I also found out, since I'm new to the site, is that apparently someone looking to move anywhere better not rely on the opinions of the residents because they're often diametrically opposed.

I just got offered a very nice job in OKC, and am turning it down tomorrow because I lived there once before and absolutely hated it. Finding that right place is far more important than a job.

Oh, and thanks, Jimmy. Now that you brought up those break-ins I have another criteria to research. Self-defense and gun laws.

Hmmmm.... too bad Texas doesn't reach up into Wyoming.

[jazzlover]

Originally Posted by Crusis

Hmmmm.... too bad Texas doesn't reach up into Wyoming.

If you want to start a fight, saying that to most long-time New Mexicans, Coloradans or Wyomingites is one really good way to do it.

What's the most beautiful sight in the world to a Coloradan? A Texan headed south with a Californian under each arm!

[Josseppie]

I welcome all new comers to Colorado!

I just ask one favor. Call you friends and family and tell them they need to move here too!!!

[80skeys]

fine and all, but I think I'm being very objective when I say that Grand Junction is a fairly tranquil, safe place. On a scale of 1 to 10 (with 10 worst), I would rank it a 3, meaning that about 30% of comparable American towns are SAFER than Grand Junction, and 70% are LESS SAFE.

My experience with American towns is quite extensive. I've set foot on almost every state of the 50 states, and I've lived in such places as Austin, Brooklyn, Honolulu, Virginia, etc. I've spent time in many cities, large and small, from the Bronx to San Diego, to Stanley, Idaho or San Antonio TX (and no, I was not a military brat).

I respect the folks who are bad mouthing GJ, as I'm sure they have their reasons for doing so. Who am I to say their reasons are not legitimate? However, with all due respect, based on my experience of knowing the U.S. the way I do, I have to say their comments would tend to give an outsider the wrong impression. Downtown GJ is not some hotbed of problematic criminal activity.

As I said above, about 30% of American towns are "safer" than GJ. How does your hometown rank? Well, if you're an average American, then you're living some standard deviation from the middle (50%) which means GJ is more than likely more safe than your hometown.

On the other hand, if you're one of the 30% of Americans on the "safe" end of the scale, then GJ is "less safe" than your hometown.

Originally Posted by CosmicWizard

hey 80...as a general rule of thumb, we tend to see whatever we are looking for and we we expect to see. If a person is looking for crap, that's what they tend to see. If a person is looking for things to be grateful for and happy about, that's what they see. Expectation plays a huge part in shaping our perspective.

[DOUBLE H]

Nobody is doubting what Grand Junction has to offer; hunting, fishing, camping, biking, mountain views, and on and on.

But there things about this area that I've never discussed before. I don't comment a lot about Colorado's economy in general and Grand Junction in particular. I will now.

This area has been energy boom and bust for years, far more years than the Exxon fiasco of May of 1982. My brother-in-law was working for a division of Stearns Rogers at the time, contracted by Exxon in Parachute. I worked a short time for Peter Kiewit in the area a few months earlier.

The common retort of things moving much too fast for this area has always been downplayed by the current honchos of this area. "Well, we were just as busy during the oil shale days, weren't we"?

No, it wasn't. Yes, there was growth. A revitalized downtown, the Mesa mall are a couple of projects come to mind. But there wasn't that much more housing construction than gradual growth would allow. There was a few projects going on, but not much. And Fruita had no projects going on. There was union as well as non union crafts around the valley, from my best guess was the fall of 1974 is when things kicked into gear.

May of 1982 was the start of the pullout. By 1983 people were exiting this area like gangbusters. The people who are experiencing bad times today are lucky to have an administration who keeps unemployment extensions going. When you file for unemployment and are approved, you draw 26 weeks and if you are still unemployed you can file for an 8 week extension. Then one year to the day you start that process over again. In this case a Republican regime was in the White House and unemployment extensions were not attained.

By 1984 this area was in double digit unemployment. And the banks had more foreclosed homes in their possession than they knew what to do with. By 1986 I'm guessing the housing vacancy rate to be at least 35%, commercial real estate higher. Ever hear of a McDonalds closing up? The one in the Teller Arms shopping center did.

By late 1987 this area was desperate. For months the Daily Sentinel ran pages of ads of bank repo homes. HUD went further as they felt any house with any offer that wasn't TOO insulting was going to get sold. Period. So around early 1988 HUD's listings would be typed at the top of the newspaper page-"Any Reasonable Offer." As far as a recovery from this when most, if not all the houses were eventually sold, I would guess that date would be somewhere around 1990.

[DOUBLE H]

In this post I don't have any sources or internet links to back me up, but I have my two eyes and my memory.

IMHO this area was not very accommodating to the working poor even before the oil pullout, much less after. Public transportation didn't exist here until the Fall of 2001. Don't believe me? Call Mesability transit up. That's what I did recently to double check on when they first started. It aggravated me when this area was classified "metropolitan" around 2000 only to know they did not have public transportation but what really surprised me is they never have had any to begin with. That's what I learned from the city. I just don't understand with the boom that kicked in around 1992 or so as to why an area this size says no to public transportation. Saying they can't afford it?

A construction buddy came to visit me around 1990 or so. He is an ironworker (retired now). Just out of curiosity he went down to the local job service center. He saw a written work order on the employment board (construction trades) for a company calling out for a journeyman connector. He took the work order down off the board and talked to one of the counselors. The counselor called the company for all the particulars. When told the starting rate of pay was $8.50 an hour, my friends eyes bulged out like two hard boiled eggs. He gave the work order to me and said, "I'll wait for you out by the car". The counselor asked me what his problem was. I explained to him what type of ironworker they were wanting. I explained to him of the various crews they are in; welding crew, bolt-up crew, impact wrench crew, rebar tying crew. A connector is over all the other crews hanging iron, up in the air usually five floors up, doing a balancing act with the crane operator with pieces of iron raised up to them up to 40, maybe 50 feet long. The counselor was kind of embarrassed about the comment I made about $8.50 an hour.

But that's what companies do in areas that are really hurting job wise. When they can, they'll lowball you all the way. Why? Because they can.

[DOUBLE H]

By the time 1991 rolled around a lot of acreage got sold in the valley. I'm not quite as negative on growth in the valley as some people but I do NOT want it to get not only out of hand but also get to the point where a young family of four can kiss off the opportunity of the American dream, buying a home. It saddens me that so many fruit trees are gone, I wish I had a dollar for every peach tree dug up. Some of the houses built here are real attractive ranch home setups. They are not gaudy looking behemoths, but just real attractive homes. Then again you have other homes that are so huge that you can fit a hot air balloon inside it.

[DOUBLE H]

I'm guessing 1991 to 1992 to be the year where all of the properties that had been sitting empty for 10 plus years were bought up. But a few years earlier developers were buying the bejeebers out of land-cheap. And the housing boom started to go in crazy mode. IMO new employment basically consisted of craftsmen working on home construction. Energy companies such as Halliburton and Weatherford didn't really have a huge presence here in the valley and wouldn't until the gas prices starting climbing in the early 2000's.

The western slope done a campaign and a half to get people to move here. I have friends in several neighboring states and you would see ads in major newspapers, commercials on tv stations, etc. to get the word out. IMO the topper is seeing signs on the city buses in L.A.

And Californians came in here in droves. There were 50% more Californians moving here than any other state at first. How do I know? I have a good friend who worked nearly 30 years for the state government, in the drivers license bureau. Yep, that's the first place to go when you relocate, or at least one of the first anyway.

Other than the fires, earthquakes, and other problems, a BIG factor was for L.A. people moving were the L.A. riots in the spring of 1992. Several people who live in my area told me just that, that the areas where they had lived in were simmering for action also. They found out about the western slope, took the first offer on their places, and were out of there in a flash. I met a real estate gal in the early 90's who had never heard of Montrose, but wanted to get the H out of the "inferno hellhole" of L.A. Everthing she had was in her car, and drove straight to Montrose. Stayed in a motel for a few days until she could get on her feet, lives there to this day, and never looked back.