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Old 05-01-2010, 04:30 PM
 
8,317 posts, read 25,777,680 times
Reputation: 9132

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The last thing Colorado needs is more stupid-*** development. That is one of the major things that got us into the economic mess we now confront. The kind of crap real estate development that Josseppie crows about is really not productive investment. In fact, it actually saps scarce capital from truly productive businesses.

I still consider any stats on economic improvement a "dead cat bounce." I attribute much of it to what I call "anticipatory spending." By that, I mean that people are moving ahead some purchases that they would have made at some future point to now because they feel that inflation is about to soar out of control. I, myself, have done some of that, replacing some aging appliances, etc. while the new appliances are heavily discounted and before commodity price and energy cost inflation sends their cost skyrocketing (steel is already starting to seriously inflate). The problem with that kind of spending is that it is essentially economic activity borrowed from the future and is a one-time stimulus that actually leads to a more pronounced economic contraction at some future point. Finally, the GDP numbers also include all of that federal "stimulus" money sloshing around--which is highly likely to ignite near-hyperinflation down the road, further debase the US currency, and add exponentially to the yoke of public debt that every succeeding generation of Americans is going to have to bear. All of that is hardly anything to celebrate. But, economic ignoramuses will celebrate anything, rather than admit how badly the US economy has been destroyed by the very things they continue to promote and support.

Last edited by jazzlover; 05-01-2010 at 04:57 PM..

 
Old 05-02-2010, 11:36 AM
 
Location: Pueblo - Colorado's Second City
12,173 posts, read 20,952,639 times
Reputation: 4258
Quote:
Originally Posted by jazzlover View Post
The last thing Colorado needs is more stupid-*** development. That is one of the major things that got us into the economic mess we now confront. The kind of crap real estate development that Josseppie crows about is really not productive investment. In fact, it actually saps scarce capital from truly productive businesses.
I would agree that cities like Colorado Springs and Denver do not need new large developments with tech parks as they have them but Pueblo does not. A fact that is always noted in here when people ask how easy it is to find a job and the answer is usually "look in Colorado Springs or Denver as Pueblo lacks in that area". This new tech park, one that the developers will promote, will change that and level the playing field so when people ask about new jobs here I will be able to say "yes look at the Pueblo Springs Tech Park" and even downtown as more development there should cause more development in downtown. That will help Pueblo and even Colorado Springs get out of this recession.
 
Old 05-03-2010, 08:06 AM
 
9,830 posts, read 19,523,464 times
Reputation: 7597
Quote:
Originally Posted by Josseppie View Post
By definition when there is 3 consecutive quarters of growth in the GDP the economy is out of a recession. That happened when the GDP grew by 3.2% in the 1st quarter. Why is that important to us in Colorado? That is because there are many large and small developments where the developers are waiting on the national economy to improve before they start. One large devlopment is Pueblo Springs that is 24,000 acres and when it starts will create thousands of construction jobs then bring in thousands of primary jobs to southern Colorado helping the economy of two of the states largest MSA's, Pueblo and Colorado Springs.

This is the news report of the GDP:

Gross domestic product, the broadest measure of economic activity, rose at a 3.2 percent annual rate in the first three months of the year, the government said Friday. That was the third straight quarter of increase, driven by a rise in spending by American consumers and increased business investment.

The link: washingtonpost.com

Now obviously the Colorado economy has a long recovery ahead but being out of the recession is a good mile stone.
The recession is over!

Well at least from where I and my friends are sitting, if anything, business has gotten worse. I'd like to say otherwise, but I can't and it's not for a lack of everyone trying to drum up business.
 
Old 05-03-2010, 08:10 AM
 
9,830 posts, read 19,523,464 times
Reputation: 7597
Quote:
Originally Posted by Josseppie View Post
I would agree that cities like Colorado Springs and Denver do not need new large developments with tech parks as they have them but Pueblo does not. A fact that is always noted in here when people ask how easy it is to find a job and the answer is usually "look in Colorado Springs or Denver as Pueblo lacks in that area". This new tech park, one that the developers will promote, will change that and level the playing field so when people ask about new jobs here I will be able to say "yes look at the Pueblo Springs Tech Park" and even downtown as more development there should cause more development in downtown. That will help Pueblo and even Colorado Springs get out of this recession.
Really I think the best thing to do is to base everything off of actual stuff that has happened and is in the bag.

All that "projected" nonsense is a shot in the dark.
 
Old 05-03-2010, 08:35 AM
 
Location: Wherabouts Unknown!
7,764 posts, read 16,835,798 times
Reputation: 9316
I won't even venture a guess as to wether or not the recession is over, not will I make any predictions about the future. I will say that based on my personal experience, things are looking brighter. I recently recieved a nice salary bump after my salary had been frozen for three and a half years. It's hard to take the doom and gloom forecasts too seriously when something like that transpires. Of course I've been preaching that attitude and expectation have a strong impact on shaping the future, so perhaps my relatively optimistic attitude played a part in attracting a salary increase into my life. I have never denied that the economy sucks but I haven't harped on it day after day like some of the hard core doom and gloomers in this thread. Additionally, I have not searched the internet far and wide to find articles to post, about the latest round of layoffs and/or service cutbacks, tax raises etc. That sh*t just happens, so it makes no sense to keep focusing on it ad infinitum. If you are comfortable living in a world of perceived scarcity, by all means keep hanging out there, but kindly stop spreading your dis-ease to the rest of the planet.
 
Old 05-03-2010, 10:12 AM
 
Location: Pueblo - Colorado's Second City
12,173 posts, read 20,952,639 times
Reputation: 4258
Quote:
Originally Posted by wanneroo View Post
Really I think the best thing to do is to base everything off of actual stuff that has happened and is in the bag.

All that "projected" nonsense is a shot in the dark.
Isn't that what we do in this thread, try to figure out what is going to happen with the economy with the best available information? Thus, Pueblo Springs is a actual development that has a master plan and a developer saying once the national economy recovers they will start looking at it as a possible way to help southern Colorado recover once it starts. So its only natural to look at it to see how it can help souothern Colorado get out of the recession.
 
Old 05-03-2010, 02:16 PM
 
Location: Colorado Springs, CO
2,221 posts, read 4,735,758 times
Reputation: 1696
Quote:
Originally Posted by CosmicWizard View Post
I won't even venture a guess as to wether or not the recession is over, not will I make any predictions about the future. I will say that based on my personal experience, things are looking brighter. I recently recieved a nice salary bump after my salary had been frozen for three and a half years. It's hard to take the doom and gloom forecasts too seriously when something like that transpires. Of course I've been preaching that attitude and expectation have a strong impact on shaping the future, so perhaps my relatively optimistic attitude played a part in attracting a salary increase into my life. I have never denied that the economy sucks but I haven't harped on it day after day like some of the hard core doom and gloomers in this thread. Additionally, I have not searched the internet far and wide to find articles to post, about the latest round of layoffs and/or service cutbacks, tax raises etc. That sh*t just happens, so it makes no sense to keep focusing on it ad infinitum. If you are comfortable living in a world of perceived scarcity, by all means keep hanging out there, but kindly stop spreading your dis-ease to the rest of the planet.
One need only look at front-page articles about Greece, whose deficit spending isn't much worse than ours, to get an idea of what can happen...in fact what is increasingly likely to happen. And there's no European Monetary Union or IMF to rescue us when we hit the wall.

Lots of sheeple are still able to remain comfortable with the Fed and Treasury continuing to load a heaping helping of Hopium into their bongs.

A trillion dollars of borrowed money is trickling into the US economy...gee, let's party on without giving a second thought of what the consequences of having to pay that back with interest are going to be.

At least here in Colorado, and especially here in Colorado Springs, we're not committing financial suicide with nearly the same reckless vigor as our countrymen in California or the dark overlords in FedGov. Maybe we'll have something left to live off of when the state seccesions begin in earnest. Doubtful, but maybe.
 
Old 05-03-2010, 08:05 PM
 
Location: Pueblo - Colorado's Second City
12,173 posts, read 20,952,639 times
Reputation: 4258
Quote:
Originally Posted by Bob from down south View Post
One need only look at front-page articles about Greece, whose deficit spending isn't much worse than ours, to get an idea of what can happen...in fact what is increasingly likely to happen. And there's no European Monetary Union or IMF to rescue us when we hit the wall.

Lots of sheeple are still able to remain comfortable with the Fed and Treasury continuing to load a heaping helping of Hopium into their bongs.

A trillion dollars of borrowed money is trickling into the US economy...gee, let's party on without giving a second thought of what the consequences of having to pay that back with interest are going to be.

At least here in Colorado, and especially here in Colorado Springs, we're not committing financial suicide with nearly the same reckless vigor as our countrymen in California or the dark overlords in FedGov. Maybe we'll have something left to live off of when the state seccesions begin in earnest. Doubtful, but maybe.
I have been paying attention to Greece and to be honest its impossible to compare their economy to the economy of the United States, even the economy of Colorado is different. In fact I was watching a CNN show last weekend and the editorial was from a journalist in Europe who gave a nice break down of what the U.S. did right during the current recession and what Europe did wrong and how in the end the world still looks to the U.S. even if at times people get up set with some of the polices.

This was a little national centric but keep in mind the United States is by definition out of the recession and the Colorado economy is showing signs of being ahead of the national economy in the recovery and everything points to Colorado emerging as one of the states that will benefit from the recession as people and companies realize the benefits of moving here over the expensive coasts. That is why new tech and industrial parks are being developed so as the country begins the recovery and a move to renewable energy Colorado should have a great 4th quarter 2010 that will move into a great decade.

Last edited by Josseppie; 05-03-2010 at 08:19 PM..
 
Old 05-03-2010, 08:27 PM
 
8,317 posts, read 25,777,680 times
Reputation: 9132
We may actually see some temporary improvement in the economy--but here is how it is being accomplished: Some trillions of dollars of new borrowed money being injected into the economy. Think of those borrowed dollars this way--they are the dreams, aspirations, possibilities, and potentials being expropriated from future generations--some not yet born--and being p***ed into the wind en masse in one big spending orgy today. Yes, all that "funny money" may temporarily stimulate things, but then what? Then the bill has to be paid--in reverse--by expropriating wealth--either by inflation or taxation--from all those people following us. I find no joy, comfort, morality, or decency in that prospect--yet people like Josseppie celebrate it like the Second Coming. If a recovery in Colorado's economy is predicated on prostituting ourselves and future generations for one more big good-time economic orgy, I want no part of it. I'm no angel, but I see no reason to go jump in bed with devil, just for the promise of one short-term good time. I'm just not that selfish. Being "out of the recession" means nothing positive to me when it is predicated on a total economic lie foisted upon the American people by corrupt people intent only on promoting their own selfish interests or political survival.

Last edited by Mike from back east; 05-04-2010 at 11:54 AM..
 
Old 05-04-2010, 09:05 AM
 
9,830 posts, read 19,523,464 times
Reputation: 7597
Quote:
Originally Posted by Josseppie View Post
I have been paying attention to Greece and to be honest its impossible to compare their economy to the economy of the United States, even the economy of Colorado is different. In fact I was watching a CNN show last weekend and the editorial was from a journalist in Europe who gave a nice break down of what the U.S. did right during the current recession and what Europe did wrong and how in the end the world still looks to the U.S. even if at times people get up set with some of the polices.
While not exactly the same, there are many similarities both the USA and Colorado have with Greece. Bloated public sector with bloated pay and benefits for those employees, excessive spending, cronyism, wasteful spending, excessive entitlements and so on.

I think if you can't see that you are not living in the real world. What happened in Greece can happen here and IS happening with states like California. Colorado and the rest of the country might not be far behind.

If one examines the Great Depression from 1929-1941, there were plenty of signs of life at times and upticks in the market at times. But the government right now is repeating many of the mistakes that kept us in a depression then with higher taxes on us and bloated spending on wasteful projects.
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