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DanaT ... try to read a little more carefully, especially if you are a pilot (or wannabe) ... it's a 182, Instrument Qualified, with an older panel of NARCO avionics.
1) I stated that I do those flights in clear weather after the storms have cleared/passed. Under no circumstance do I fly IFR (or even marginal VFR) conditions in the mountains with any GA aircraft (including twins), no matter how well equipped. Nor will I fly in the mountains in the dark, as that reduces my "outs" unacceptably in case of emergency. I choose my flight paths in the mountains to allow the maximum opportunities for gliding to a good landing spot if the need should arise, and constantly monitor my situation so that I know where I'd turn to if need be as a first response.
We could have a very long conversation about the reasons and speculate why some mountain flights have ended in less than good outcomes. Even the best (hey, did you hear about Sparky Imeson a week or so ago?) can make mistakes. There's obviously a risk factor to flying light aircraft in the mountains, and one should be trained and proficient with appropriate equipment to minimize the risks. Not everybody always meets those thresholds, and sometimes the odds stack up against them to less than a good outcome. There but for the grace ....
2) I'm a little more careful with my motor than some. Right now, there's 2,800 hours on the cases of my O470R, and the most recent annual required two cylinders to be topped (68's with the rest 72's). With a borescope inspection of the inside of the motor, oil filter checking, the internals of the motor are healthy and I'm good to go for quite awhile.
The news in GA is that 470's bottom ends are proven good for around 4,000 hours, as long as they're flown cool and not abused. They will require cylinder topping to get that far, but that beats the heck out of 1,500hr majors just because there's a number in a book which was determined by a guess way back when. Of course, if the bird's flown commercially, then the TBO figure prevails per regs. If you've been following the published studies lately ... you'd know that the statistics are showing more engine failures shortly after major overhaul than failures from running past TBO.
3) I fly to the same mountain airports that the commercial traffic does. If I can't get a ride along from friends in the area, there's rental cars, shuttle buses, courtesy cars. But in summer months, I have used my folding mountain bike to go from Aspen's airport to stay with friends up in the Castle Creek area ....
4) You do sound like somebody I'd risk my airplane and my safety for just to pick up on the street in front of your house! Not!
5) Yes, I'd agree that sometimes after major Front Range snowstorms, the fastest and safest way to Vail (or Aspen, or Steamboat or Telluride) just might be a $200 plane ticket to the mountains and then the shuttle bus to the ski area. Especially when it's one of those days when the roads are snarled with weekend ski traffic and it's a 3+ hour drive just to Vail with the tunnel traffic in stop and go and sliding around all the way starting back at Idaho Springs, or maybe I-70 is closed down and you're heading over Loveland Pass and the back ways to Vail.
6) We got off on the tangent of the economics of living in the Colorado mountain towns because another poster asserted that "everybody's rich" up there. It's quite apparent that the poster has never lived in those communites because ... despite a glitzy surface sheen of a few wealthy people who own property there ... most of the people who actually live year around there as their home in those communities are not wealthy. And that goes for a lot of mountain towns where there's no glamour of the rich and famous ... many people up there are paying the price of living in the Colorado mountains, which means just getting by. It's not uncommon for people to share housing and work multiple jobs just for the dream of having an opportunity to ski now and then. The truth of living in the mountains is the places where the jobs are is in the expensive areas. Leadville is cheap right now, for example ... because most jobs are accessed by commuting every day. Montrose isn't cheap, and there aren't a lot of jobs ... but you don't hear about it as a "rich and famous" place ... most folks living there aren't "rich".
Anyway, as I pointed out ... none of this is particularly relevant to the OP's question about "needing a Jeep" to be able to get around in a Colorado mountain town. The answer is still ... no they don't.
you do a marvelous job of taking things out of context and commingling my responses to other posters.
But the net result is still the same ... you verify that an SUV can be expensive and isn't needed to get around.
I, too, used a tired 1967 Porsche 912T with snow tires for a year in Vail and it worked just fine. Actually a pretty decent snow car for it's time, except that the heater/defroster couldn't keep up with both demands simultaneously. You either had heat or a clear windshield. Replaced it with a 2002 BMW and had a good heater, and decent snow performance. Replaced that with a Saab, then an Audi 4000CS quattro ... which opened my eyes to a super AWD snow car that really could go all weather and turned in 28 mpg with a lot more features (cruise, heated mirrors, heated seats) than my prior cars.
Anyway, thanks for agreeing that one doesn't need a Jeep in a Colorado mountain town.
What is your definition of "just getting by"? Lets see. Private aircraft. Porsche. BMW. Audi. Saab?
That sounds like the poor trustifarians that live in Boulder that barely get by..
For what its worth, I would actaully like to live in (or near) Leadville. The reason why it is expesnive is that there are no jobs. I think the good jobs left when the moly mine cut back.
Also, there is another point that you are forgetting. Living in Vail, you probably could get by without car of any type. It is small. If, however, you live someplace where you have to drive any distance, a 4x4 in the winter, while not required, is advantagous.
DanaT ... obviously, you also have not tried to live in any Colorado mountain community. Relatively speaking, Leadville is "cheap" because you need to have work/income somewhere else, generally speaking ... with the mines having closed down.
There's no way that Free Republic of Boulder trust funders have anything in common with the folks who live year round up in the hills.
I've known many who sacrifice much of their life to live that mountain dream of an outdoor lifestyle (skiing and outdoor recreation, seasonally). Living with lots of roomates, driving old cars, working two or three jobs and filling in on projects when they can do that, too .... It's a lot of hours per week when you're ski instructing during the day, sales clerking afterwards, then bartending or waiting tables late into the evening ... all to get home, clean up ... and head out in the early AM to shovel snow or clear roofs. Or working construction 6 or 7 days per week, bartending afterwards, etc. ... all to be able to take a day or two off to ski or head into the hills for some climbing (seasonally). Of course, it's all done with a sense of humor and a party attitude ... or you'll be packing up quickly and leaving because then it's not a lot of fun.
I'd bet that most public school teachers work second jobs, too ... to make ends meet, even if they have a dual income family. There's a reason why so many people get a real estate license, too ... possible income from it as a second job.
All said and done, you can live this lifestyle for as long as you can take it. I know people who did it 30+ years and woke up one day to the realization that they had nothing except an old bucket of a car, a few recreational toys, a few household items, and some clothes in the closet and lots of good memories. No retirement, no savings, no insurance, zipp ... Some moved on ... some accept their choices in life and are still doing it.
Those of you who stay along the Front Range cities and work real 9-5 jobs to have the affluence of an owned home, toys, vehicles, and free time (and funds) for recreation have little concept of the "just getting by" lifestyle in the mountains.
I saved as much as I could out of my income and took advantage of opportunities as they came along ... cars with 100,000 miles on the odo, distress properties, a cash flow squeeze on an airplane, and so forth. I took risks, and could have lost all several times .... just got lucky and weathered it out. Keep in perspective it didn't happen overnight, it's taken 45 working years to reach this point. I recall my paychecks from the late 1960's showing a pay rate of $5.50 per hour .... not a glamorous, high paid job, working as a diesel mechanic ... but I worked everything I could on the side, putting in 70-80 hour weeks for many years.
Thanks to all who answered my questions.. sunsprit and others... believe it or not I am still reading this thread
I am flying into Denver at the end of June - renting a CAR and seeing where it takes me. My first visit to Colorado was primarily eastern Colorado; this one will be primarily the western slope...
There's no way that Free Republic of Boulder trust funders have anything in common with the folks who live year round up in the hills.
It not the Free Republic....
It is the Peoples Republik of Boulder. Keep in mind a "Free Republic" you have freedoms to say what you want. In the a Peoples Republik you can say what you want as long as it mirrors the states (or prevailing) ideology.
My first car when I lived in Colorado was a Triumph Spitfire. Can't get much smaller than that! Rear-wheel drive, lightweight, etc. So in the winter, I'd throw a sandbag in the trunk along with my chains, and while I sometimes had to use those chains, never once got stuck. I think it's a big myth that you HAVE to have 4WD in Colorado. For one thing, my friends out there tell me that it's much the same as when I lived there -- when the weather is too bad, you don't go to work (unless you're in a critical job, like medical). And what do you do with your day off? Get in your car and go party with your friends! I think 4WD is a good safety feature "just in case," but I don't think it's absolutely mandatory in order to get around.
To the original poster: No, you don't need a Jeep, but it can come in handy if you live in gnarly or even marginal terrain. Jeeps are not for everyone. People tend to love them or hate them.
I live at 9,000+ feet in NM on an unplowed dirt road outside a small mountain town. I have a Wrangler and love it. I work at home and drive very little, so the MPG doesn't bother me too much. If I had to drive every day, I might have a second car.
When I first moved here, I had a tiny FWD Toyota. Big mistake. Dug that thing out of snow and mud too many times! While I was digging, my neighbor was coming and going in his Jeep. So I bought one. I have not been stuck since, and I have used the Jeep to pull stuck neighbors out of snow banks.
As for Consumer Reports and other ratings, I stopped reading those years ago. I have learned that you can't truly know a vehicle's reliability without owning one (or perhaps being a mechanic and working on lots of them). Before the Jeep, I had three Toyotas and a Subaru, and guess what. The Wrangler has been more reliable than all of them. Jeeps can run up 200,000 miles on their original engines. Sure, the radios rattle out and the window cranks fall off, but they have a way of not dying.
I drove a Subaru when I lived in Alaska. It was fine on paved roads, but I don't think I'd have one here in the unpaved Rockies.
Back to the original poster: If I were you, I'd just drive what you have. If it becomes a problem, do what you have to do to solve it. No big deal. If you're looking at relocating a perhaps buying a new home, I would put the vehicle much lower on the list of immediate concerns.
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Subarus are good for winter weather. Most people do not live too far from pavement. If you are in a rural isolated area maybe a Jeep is better. However AWD 4 cylinder vehicles are MUCH more efficient than a 4WD vehicle.
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