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Old 08-23-2016, 07:28 PM
 
Location: Columbia, SC
6,528 posts, read 13,701,636 times
Reputation: 1775

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Quote:
Originally Posted by Mtnluver8956 View Post
You still have to get in a car if you live in the vista or anywhere in the CBD. That's why they have parking garages and surface parking lots. It's a burb mixed use development. Not saying it's a bad concept, im saying they should rather focus on their CBD rather. Maybe build up and not out? The street level target and apple store is a really good example of great urbanization. it's in the heart of downtown and contains retail and housing. I like ben's public-private partnership for the two towers on united ways old site, maybe something like a juiced up epicenter Also, the developers developing the target and apple store and apartments are from Manhattan.
You have to get in a car to walk a mile? Really?
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Old 08-23-2016, 07:38 PM
 
589 posts, read 393,599 times
Reputation: 102
Quote:
Originally Posted by Mtnluver8956 View Post
You still have to get in a car if you live in the vista or anywhere in the CBD. That's why they have parking garages and surface parking lots. It's a burb mixed use development. Not saying it's a bad concept, im saying they should rather focus on their CBD rather. Maybe build up and not out? The street level target and apple store is a really good example of great urbanization. it's in the heart of downtown and contains retail and housing. I like ben's public-private partnership for the two towers on united ways old site, maybe something like a juiced up epicenter Also, the developers developing the target and apple store and apartments are from Manhattan.
I will give you that it will take a long time to build out, and a trolley system would solve the problem with cars. Columbia had a huge non-taxed parcel of land they needed to fill in and bull street is an excellent opportunity to have centralized retail in a city where retailers need a central location to take advantage of higher end retail in a metro that has spread out wealth. The Apple Store and CityTarget would be cool, but I am not sure either actually would want to locate at the student apartments. We shall see though. I would welcome it if they were to locate there.
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Old 08-23-2016, 07:43 PM
 
27,752 posts, read 24,774,360 times
Reputation: 16474
Quote:
Originally Posted by Mtnluver8956 View Post
You still have to get in a car if you live in the vista or anywhere in the CBD. That's why they have parking garages and surface parking lots. It's a burb mixed use development. Not saying it's a bad concept, im saying they should rather focus on their CBD rather. Maybe build up and not out? The street level target and apple store is a really good example of great urbanization. it's in the heart of downtown and contains retail and housing. I like ben's public-private partnership for the two towers on united ways old site, maybe something like a juiced up epicenter Also, the developers developing the target and apple store and apartments are from Manhattan.
No you don't HAVE to get in your car to get to Bull Street from the Vista or along Main; it's not a far walk at all. However it's not something most people are likely to do in the absence of street-front active uses all along the way.
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Old 08-23-2016, 08:11 PM
 
Location: Raleigh, NC
2,729 posts, read 1,083,126 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Mutiny77 View Post
No you don't HAVE to get in your car to get to Bull Street from the Vista or along Main; it's not a far walk at all. However it's not something most people are likely to do in the absence of street-front active uses all along the way.
Exactly. More money the taxpayer will be responsible for. Could have been simple and focused on the CBD, but things always got to be complicated I guess.
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Old 08-23-2016, 10:16 PM
 
27,752 posts, read 24,774,360 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Mtnluver8956 View Post
Exactly. More money the taxpayer will be responsible for. Could have been simple and focused on the CBD, but things always got to be complicated I guess.
Bull Street represents an opportunity to put a large chunk of non-taxable property on the rax rolls, so developing the property is an absolute no-brainer--especially in a city like Columbia that already has so many tax-exempt properties.

But what do you mean "more money the taxpayer will be responsible for" in relation to the part of my post that you emboldened?
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Old 08-24-2016, 08:24 PM
 
Location: Irmo, SC
1,369 posts, read 1,292,860 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by waccamatt View Post
You have to get in a car to walk a mile? Really?
Most, well, all of the people I hang out with would absolutely **** themselves if I mentioned walking a mile. Anywhere. Its either too hot or too cold. And when the weather is perfect, then a mile is too long to walk.


It reminds me of people in my neighborhood that drive to the pool when their house is less than 100 yards away. I don't understand it.
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Old 08-24-2016, 09:06 PM
 
Location: Columbia, SC
6,528 posts, read 13,701,636 times
Reputation: 1775
Quote:
Originally Posted by smithgn View Post
Most, well, all of the people I hang out with would absolutely **** themselves if I mentioned walking a mile. Anywhere. Its either too hot or too cold. And when the weather is perfect, then a mile is too long to walk.


It reminds me of people in my neighborhood that drive to the pool when their house is less than 100 yards away. I don't understand it.
I think we know why SC has one of the highest percentages of obesity in the country. It takes about 20 minutes to walk a mile.
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Old 08-25-2016, 04:05 AM
 
115 posts, read 134,357 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Mutiny77 View Post
No you don't HAVE to get in your car to get to Bull Street from the Vista or along Main; it's not a far walk at all. However it's not something most people are likely to do in the absence of street-front active uses all along the way.
This is exactly right. It's not about the distance...it's the exact walk AND WHETHER OR NOT ITS ENTERTAINING/ENJOYABLE. Too many empty spots and large intersection to cross. Your choice is to walk through dormant streets (as far as entertainment is involved) or along a very busy and wide road "Bull" with no stops along the way. Now, me saying this doesn't mean you can't fathom doing it... What it means is most people aren't going to. You have to create an area that lends itself to the "walk-ability" that is being spoken of. Who is gonna leave the convention center and walk to a bar on Bull street for a drink before hitting up Main and then back to the vista? Is this a challenge we are discussing or are we trying to create something enjoyable? In ten years or however long it will be when Bull Street is done it will be wonderful and walkable like the Vista finally is now. To me walkable is when you are just headed in a direction and "ducking in" to places that look cool or have a good vibe while walking kind of "aimlessly". I can't speak for others on this subject but would challenge that even they wouldn't make this trek afoot often.
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Old 08-25-2016, 10:08 AM
 
27,752 posts, read 24,774,360 times
Reputation: 16474
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Originally Posted by Sonatco View Post
This is exactly right. It's not about the distance...it's the exact walk AND WHETHER OR NOT ITS ENTERTAINING/ENJOYABLE. Too many empty spots and large intersection to cross. Your choice is to walk through dormant streets (as far as entertainment is involved) or along a very busy and wide road "Bull" with no stops along the way. Now, me saying this doesn't mean you can't fathom doing it... What it means is most people aren't going to. You have to create an area that lends itself to the "walk-ability" that is being spoken of. Who is gonna leave the convention center and walk to a bar on Bull street for a drink before hitting up Main and then back to the vista? Is this a challenge we are discussing or are we trying to create something enjoyable? In ten years or however long it will be when Bull Street is done it will be wonderful and walkable like the Vista finally is now. To me walkable is when you are just headed in a direction and "ducking in" to places that look cool or have a good vibe while walking kind of "aimlessly". I can't speak for others on this subject but would challenge that even they wouldn't make this trek afoot often.
I agree; Columbia just isn't yet at the point where one would walk aimlessly between districts because they aren't connected by means of active street-front uses. That's even true of Main Street and the Vista; forget walking from the convention center to Bull Street, how about walking from the convention center to a bar on Main? Sure some folks will do it but not a lot. I'm reminded of a convention I was at in Columbia a couple of years back with events happening at the convention center and the arena, and I was hanging with some people from out of town at Damon's (that tells you how long ago it was). Someone remarked about how there was "nothing to do" and I said of course there are things to do and listed some; a friend of mine provided clarity when he said, "I think he means for people who are here without a car." Of course there have been many improvements since then, particularly within the Vista itself, but there's still work to be done as far as 'stitching' it all together, and it's good that some projects are happening along Assembly north of Gervais that are helping in that regard. There will need to be more though, and getting those parcels developed at the Assembly/Gervais intersection would accelerate those efforts greatly.
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Old 08-25-2016, 02:08 PM
 
332 posts, read 190,200 times
Reputation: 61
Quote:
Originally Posted by Mutiny77 View Post
I agree; Columbia just isn't yet at the point where one would walk aimlessly between districts because they aren't connected by means of active street-front uses. That's even true of Main Street and the Vista; forget walking from the convention center to Bull Street, how about walking from the convention center to a bar on Main? Sure some folks will do it but not a lot. I'm reminded of a convention I was at in Columbia a couple of years back with events happening at the convention center and the arena, and I was hanging with some people from out of town at Damon's (that tells you how long ago it was). Someone remarked about how there was "nothing to do" and I said of course there are things to do and listed some; a friend of mine provided clarity when he said, "I think he means for people who are here without a car." Of course there have been many improvements since then, particularly within the Vista itself, but there's still work to be done as far as 'stitching' it all together, and it's good that some projects are happening along Assembly north of Gervais that are helping in that regard. There will need to be more though, and getting those parcels developed at the Assembly/Gervais intersection would accelerate those efforts greatly.
Benjamin threw an idea out years ago that I think would eventually be a great way to weave together multiple neighborhoods: a greenway. The route he discussed would run from the Vista (I believe), past the historic homes on Taylor, and eventually toward Bull Street Commons. Honestly the sheer size of the area between Gervais and Assembly and Elmwood Bull Street is so vast that there may never been a very interesting route. What has helped Greenville has been channeling people onto one path- in their case Main Street. Assembly and Gervais are the two primary arteries in downtown. I think the city could really help connect the Vista with the CBD and Five Points if it improved the pedestrian experience along Gervais. Any of these improvements will take quite a while though. At least USC is helping by constructing nicer buildings along Assembly and Gervais.
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