Is Columbus the next "mega-city" of the midwest? (Mansfield: school, association)

[jbcmh81]

Originally Posted by pontiac51

While I do believe that Columbus will be the next Midwest city to reach a million people, it will be a long long time before Columbus becomes a "mega-city". And if it does happen, Columbus won't get its' due respect because of the other 2-C's. Remember, Ohio is very unique because it has many big cities that are close together. More to the point, Ohio is the only state in the Midwest that has three major cities. Furthermore, Ohio is the only state in the country that has its' top 3 major cities within 250 miles of each other. Because of this, each of the 3 cities has to share some of the spotlight with the other two. Indianapolis, Detroit, Chicago, Minneapolis, and Milwaukee don't have to worry about that. And the fact the each of Ohio's major cities starts with the same letter probably causes confusion with some people.

I'm thinking that if Columbus ever did become a mega city, by the time it got there, it would have left Cleveland and Cincinnati far behind. I would think it would have just a bit more respect at that point.

Chicago also starts with a C. I don't think anyone's confusing Chicago with the 3-Cs. No more than London and Louisville are confused.

[ColdAilment]

Originally Posted by pontiac51

While I do believe that Columbus will be the next Midwest city to reach a million people, it will be a long long time before Columbus becomes a "mega-city". And if it does happen, Columbus won't get its' due respect because of the other 2-C's. Remember, Ohio is very unique because it has many big cities that are close together. More to the point, Ohio is the only state in the Midwest that has three major cities. Furthermore, Ohio is the only state in the country that has its' top 3 major cities within 250 miles of each other. Because of this, each of the 3 cities has to share some of the spotlight with the other two. Indianapolis, Detroit, Chicago, Minneapolis, and Milwaukee don't have to worry about that. And the fact the each of Ohio's major cities starts with the same letter probably causes confusion with some people.

You believe Columbus will overtake Indianapolis? Indianapolis is already at 830,000.

[jbcmh81]

Originally Posted by ColdAilment

You believe Columbus will overtake Indianapolis? Indianapolis is already at 830,000.

The city itself likely will considering that Columbus city is growing more than 2x faster. The metro areas have more similar growth rates, but Columbus' is larger at the moment.

[pontiac51]

Originally Posted by jbcmh81

Chicago also starts with a C. I don't think anyone's confusing Chicago with the 3-Cs. No more than London and Louisville are confused.

Does Illinois have 2 other major cities that start with a C? Obviously, I was referring to Ohio's 3-C's!!!

[JoeP]

City populations are irrelevant in most instances. Cities aren't cities, they're metropolitan areas. One can't compare city A vs city B based on the happenstance of political boundaries.... going by city populations, Jacksonville is by far the "biggest" city in FL, San Francisco isn't even the 2nd largest city in CA and cities like DC and Boston are much "smaller" than Columbus or Jacksonville.

[msamhunter]

Originally Posted by JoeP

City populations are irrelevant in most instances. Cities aren't cities, they're metropolitan areas. One can't compare city A vs city B based on the happenstance of political boundaries.... going by city populations, Jacksonville is by far the "biggest" city in FL, San Francisco isn't even the 2nd largest city in CA and cities like DC and Boston are much "smaller" than Columbus or Jacksonville.

Why do people always try this. It's not just "political." It is actually more economic as those borders determine who pays what to where. Dublin doesn't have the same budget as Columbus, does not share the same city police department as Grove City outside of County Sheriff's but again, that's at the county level and not municipal. They don't pay for each others schools or infrastructure needs nor have the same representation at the local and state levels. I know people try to make it simplistic (to try and bolster arguments).

MSA has always been a rather poor representation because it's just a collection of counties and far flung counties of any given area tend to actually be more rural and while in the MSA because its county just happens to sit there sits outside of the actual Urban Area of said MSA. Not uncommon for the county closest to the core city to have a more dense suburban style relationship and the opposite end of that same county have literally no association with the core city.

UA would be a better metric.

[bjimmy24]

Originally Posted by msamhunter

Why do people always try this. It's not just "political." It is actually more economic as those borders determine who pays what to where. Dublin doesn't have the same budget as Columbus, does not share the same city police department as Grove City outside of County Sheriff's but again, that's at the county level and not municipal. They don't pay for each others schools or infrastructure needs nor have the same representation at the local and state levels. I know people try to make it simplistic (to try and bolster arguments).

MSA has always been a rather poor representation because it's just a collection of counties and far flung counties of any given area tend to actually be more rural and while in the MSA because its county just happens to sit there sits outside of the actual Urban Area of said MSA. Not uncommon for the county closest to the core city to have a more dense suburban style relationship and the opposite end of that same county have literally no association with the core city.

UA would be a better metric.

Shenanigans. Columbus has a population about 175,000 greater than Boston. The city limits of Boston are 48 sq miles of land, Cbus is 217 sq miles of land. But anyone who has been to both cities for 5 minutes knows which one is "bigger." It really is purely political line drawing. Surrounding cities think they can govern themselves better, which they are allowed to do. Older cities have this happen a lot more, where towns in the same area developed at the same time, but one became dominant (usually due to a better location for natural resources or a body of water). In some cases, like Brighton and Allston in Boston, those towns are annexed to the city. But not every surrounding city is so keen to give up their "independence." However, you're quite mistaken if you think people from, let's say, Cambridge, don't spend a lot of time and money in Boston. Surrounding areas are very much interconnected, even if they are not within a political boundary.

[msamhunter]

Originally Posted by bjimmy24

Shenanigans. Columbus has a population about 175,000 greater than Boston. The city limits of Boston are 48 sq miles of land, Cbus is 217 sq miles of land. But anyone who has been to both cities for 5 minutes knows which one is "bigger." It really is purely political line drawing. Surrounding cities think they can govern themselves better, which they are allowed to do. Older cities have this happen a lot more, where towns in the same area developed at the same time, but one became dominant (usually due to a better location for natural resources or a body of water). In some cases, like Brighton and Allston in Boston, those towns are annexed to the city. But not every surrounding city is so keen to give up their "independence." However, you're quite mistaken if you think people from, let's say, Cambridge, don't spend a lot of time and money in Boston. Surrounding areas are very much interconnected, even if they are not within a political boundary.

Land size is irrelevant. If a person does not want to live within a certain municipal boundary, they will not no matter how large or how small the geographic area is. Most common practice is white flight which still happens today. If Detroit all of a sudden annexed an additional 20 sq mi of wayne county, those people within that 20 sq mile radius would pack up and move even if it meant taking a loss on their homes. Another way of looking at it is when Boston had more people than CBus being 48 sq mi, no one said a thing. If land size didn't matter then, it doesn't matter NOW as there's' always other factors involved in population growth and decline.

However, you're quite mistaken if you think people from, let's say, Cambridge, don't spend a lot of time and money in Boston. Surrounding areas are very much interconnected, even if they are not within a political boundary.

So. A lot of people in Dublin spend a lot of time and money in Columbus so nothing special going on there. Suburbanites tend to do that worldwide. Doesn't negate the fact of where they choose to pay their taxes year after year which supports local schools, police departments, infrastructure, libraries, etc. It is squarely an economic value there. A non resident doesn't have to eat at a restaurant and pay a restaurant tax in said visiting city. When people choose where to set up their domicile, it is a conscious choice knowing a lot of their income will go towards things specific for their area such as local libraries, roads and schools.

No one said surrounding areas weren't interconnected. What I said was,

far flung counties of any given area tend to actually be more rural and while in the MSA because its county just happens to sit there sits outside of the actual Urban Area of said MSA. Not uncommon for the county closest to the core city to have a more dense suburban style relationship and the opposite end of that same county have literally no association with the core city.

The NE is a lot Denser so your far flung areas are really far flung. Columbus is a midwestern town where you do not have to go far to reach the far flung. Perfect example, Jasper County Indiana is part of the Chicago MSA. When you talk about Chicago, you talk about its urban qualities both city and burb, except they're not talking about Jasper County because there's nothing urban about it, there's nothing suburban about it. It's 100% rural just like Newton County is 100%, another county in the Chicago MSA. Just about everything south of Crown Point in Lake County, IN is rural. So while those counties are part of the MSA, they are not part of the Urban Area which is why I distinctly said, UA was a better metric than MSA.

[JoeP]

Why do people always try this. It's not just "political." It is actually more economic as those borders determine who pays what to where. Dublin doesn't have the same budget as Columbus, does not share the same city police department as Grove City outside of County Sheriff's but again, that's at the county level and not municipal. They don't pay for each others schools or infrastructure needs nor have the same representation at the local and state levels. I know people try to make it simplistic (to try and bolster arguments).

That's where city boundaries matter - in local issues, but have very little relevance in discussions or comparisons to other cities.

MSA has always been a rather poor representation because it's just a collection of counties and far flung counties of any given area tend to actually be more rural and while in the MSA because its county just happens to sit there sits outside of the actual Urban Area of said MSA. Not uncommon for the county closest to the core city to have a more dense suburban style relationship and the opposite end of that same county have literally no association with the core city.

It's not a poor representation. They are not perfect, but working on a county level works better than some carved area by other means.

Yes some far flung areas are included in many metros, but largely they are suburban areas of bordering counties.

[motorman]

Maybe all of us are overlooking one VERY important fact about Columbus. No matter what its present "city boundaries" are or whether it will ever be a "mega-city" in the far-distant future, one thing I think we can all agree upon (right now, this VERY instant!) is that Columbus is truly the most important, dynamic, cultural and interesting city in...Central Ohio. (Do I hear an "Amen"?!)