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Old 12-27-2016, 08:00 PM
 
Location: Point Loma, San Diego, CA
2,349 posts, read 1,656,832 times
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So it seems the cities in western Ohio, Northern Indiana had their money ready when opportunity came knocking. Whether leadership in Columbus wants to connect their city by passenger rail to America's third city seems ambiguous, at best:

Columbus-Chicago passenger rail moves ahead, slowly | The Columbus Dispatch

IMO, even this train maxed out at around 100 mph, and had only three departures/arrivals a day, there would be nothing but a huge upside for Columbus. The Blue Jackets are dominating the NHL right now, why not up your game even more Columbus? Business people visiting Chicago from Asia and Europe (who likely use rail every day of their lives at home) would see that connection to Columbus during their down time at Union Station, people visiting friends, family, doing work on the train, etc. The possibilities are endless.


If I were Columbus, I would be standing in line at the crack of dawn, money in hand, eagerly wanting to proceed. Who knows if an opportunity like this will come again?
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Old 12-28-2016, 10:03 AM
 
Location: Columbus, OH
981 posts, read 864,570 times
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I agree, Columbus should be all over this.
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Old 12-29-2016, 02:20 PM
 
Location: Mexico City, formerly Columbus, Ohio
15,941 posts, read 15,235,950 times
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I guess the positive is that you started another thread about it instead of clogging up the development one. So kudos.
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Old 12-29-2016, 04:43 PM
 
Location: Point Loma, San Diego, CA
2,349 posts, read 1,656,832 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by jbcmh81 View Post
I guess the positive is that you started another thread about it instead of clogging up the development one. So kudos.
This one deserves its own thread.
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Old 01-03-2017, 11:36 PM
 
Location: Cbus
1,720 posts, read 1,630,702 times
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I personally would love to see this happen. Unfortunately Ohio has a pretty conservative state government that is very hostile to public transit. We couldn't even link our three largest cities so Chicago might be a pipe dream unfortunately.

"Gov. John Kasich killed a plan by former Gov. Ted Strickland to link Columbus to Cincinnati and Cleveland by high-speed passenger rail, saying he was concerned the project would be too expensive and wouldn’t draw enough riders."
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Old 01-06-2017, 12:10 PM
 
881 posts, read 813,032 times
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The mistake people make with these trains is that they are trying to use them for some of their urban planning fantasy ideas instead of designing them to make them convenient for travel. Nobody wants to embark and disembark Downtown. Traffic is a mess and there is no travel infrastructure in place. The travel infrastructure is in place at the Airport, which is designed to move a lot of people in and out of Columbus.

Where do you park your car economically before you board the train? And what do you do once you get to your downtown destination? Where do you rent a car? Where do you find an affordable hotel? You will find neither of these options convenient to you in Downtown Chicago or Downtown Columbus. I'm sure they have a rental agency somewhere Downtown, but it's nothing like the convenience of how you rent a car at the airport. Have you been to Downtown Fort Wayne? Don't bother. Fort Wayne is a nice city, but Downtown is absolutely NOT a destination.

Bottom line is that the urbanists want to use these things as a toy to further their utopian urbanist fantasies. That is the road to failure.

For these things to work, they have to be designed for convenience and efficiency. And if you design things from a practical standpoint, you design it to go through Indianapolis or Toledo. And like the MegaBus, you only stop at Indianapolis to pick up people, not at every city in between.

Last edited by PerryMason614; 01-06-2017 at 12:19 PM..
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Old 01-06-2017, 04:29 PM
 
Location: MPLS
1,068 posts, read 1,209,209 times
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Anyone saying, "Nobody wants to embark and disembark Downtown." doesn't know what they're talking about. People would ride between both downtowns which are the centers of both metros. There's a good reason both Union Stations are located in the downtowns (was in Columbus' case and will be if ever rebuilt). Even Megabus and Greyhound are located there, despite not being restricted to railroad tracks, because it makes the most sense.

Speaking of buses, the planned train would be roughly twice as fast as the bus (it simply shouldn't take about 8 hours to go from Chicago to Columbus). Columbus does now have a downtown-airport COTA route in place which would connect would-be train riders the same as bus riders today. The utopian suburban fantasy has proven to be much more costly than the urban one, not only monetarily, but for its tally of human lives.
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Old 01-06-2017, 05:15 PM
 
881 posts, read 813,032 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Mplsite View Post
Anyone saying, "Nobody wants to embark and disembark Downtown." doesn't know what they're talking about. People would ride between both downtowns which are the centers of both metros. There's a good reason both Union Stations are located in the downtowns (was in Columbus' case and will be if ever rebuilt). Even Megabus and Greyhound are located there, despite not being restricted to railroad tracks, because it makes the most sense.

Speaking of buses, the planned train would be roughly twice as fast as the bus (it simply shouldn't take about 8 hours to go from Chicago to Columbus). Columbus does now have a downtown-airport COTA route in place which would connect would-be train riders the same as bus riders today. The utopian suburban fantasy has proven to be much more costly than the urban one, not only monetarily, but for its tally of human lives.
You're still living in the 19th and early 20th century if you are using the Union Stations as an example. The job of the train is to move people quickly and efficiently. That means you need the infrastructure of parking, hotels, rental agencies, long term parking, etc. Those are the things that you find at an AIRPORT, which is also designed to move people quickly and efficiently.

Yes, the MegaBus goes downtown but the MegaBus serves a small number of people and those people are not business travelers (where the money comes from). A business traveler does not want to futz around downtown unless he has business there.

Not everybody is going downtown. Most people aren't going to go downtown, in fact. If they want to go downtown, they can grab local transportation FROM THE AIRPORT. If you want a SEPARATE CHOO CHOO from the airport to downtown, fine. But don't slow up my high speed train to feed your urbanist fantasy.

Again: Fast, efficient, cheap or people won't use it. I want to park fast, park cheap, get on the train and go. Downtown is not efficient and too expensive for that.
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Old 01-07-2017, 12:03 AM
 
Location: Point Loma, San Diego, CA
2,349 posts, read 1,656,832 times
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Some very "Columbus" responses have populated since I posted this thread I see.


There is a city named Columbus in Wisconsin that has a fully functioning Amtrak station to serve a city of 5000 people. What is that Columbus wrong about and this Columbus right about?

It seems to me that this is not about being one step ahead of the times, trying to be innovative with high speed supertrains and driverless cars, but just getting caught up a little with the rest of civilization with basic city infrastructure that has been a global staple of transit since the 1800's (like a train).

150 years ago, cities were made or broken by being connected to a train or being overlooked by the rail companies. Yes, I realize the times have changed, but I don't think they've changed as much as people want to think they have.
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Old 01-07-2017, 01:45 PM
 
881 posts, read 813,032 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Losfrisco View Post
Some very "Columbus" responses have populated since I posted this thread I see.


There is a city named Columbus in Wisconsin that has a fully functioning Amtrak station to serve a city of 5000 people. What is that Columbus wrong about and this Columbus right about?

It seems to me that this is not about being one step ahead of the times, trying to be innovative with high speed supertrains and driverless cars, but just getting caught up a little with the rest of civilization with basic city infrastructure that has been a global staple of transit since the 1800's (like a train).

150 years ago, cities were made or broken by being connected to a train or being overlooked by the rail companies. Yes, I realize the times have changed, but I don't think they've changed as much as people want to think they have.
Read my previous comment regarding the realities of train travel. I don't think true high-speed train connectivity between the big cities is a bad idea. But these trains should be designed with the traveler in mind and not for the reasons that train proponents want, which is mostly to feed their social engineering and neo-urbanist fantasies.

If you want to get to Columbus, Wisconsin by plane, you fly to Chicago or Milwaukee or Minneapolis and rent a car or find another way to get to your destination. The 747 doesn't stop in Columbus, Wisconsin to drop you off! You don't stop at every single little podunk town along the way, slowing the train up to the point where you might as well drive there.

That's what people need to keep in mind when it comes to trains. If I were designing a train, it would go from the Columbus Airport to the Dayton Airport to the Indianapolis Airport and then to Chicago Midway, maybe with a stop in either Gary or West Lafayette, and then Chicago O'Hare further west.

I wouldn't go through Lima and Fort Wayne because there are not enough people along the way going to Chicago and points in between to justify the cost. I also don't think there are a lot of people in Columbus who want to go to Lima or Fort Wayne, whereas there are people in Columbus who want to go to Dayton and Indianapolis, and vice versa.

Maybe You could also have a Pittsburgh-Columbus-Findlay-Toledo-Detroit leg. I can see demand there. I don't see any demand from Columbus to Lima to Fort Wayne to South Bend to Chicago unless it somehow connects with the Detroit - Toledo train going to Chicago.

Again, if you want a train into downtown once you arrive in a city you can have commuter rail from the airport. But don't slow up my high speed train. That defeats the purpose.

Last edited by PerryMason614; 01-07-2017 at 02:25 PM..
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