Columbus vs RTP, NC (Cleveland, Hubbard: condos, high crime, houses)

[QCP]

Originally Posted by GeminiGal

Agreed. I feel like I have become this "cheerleader" for Columbus, and being a recent transplant here it is kind of weird.

The people I've met here are not representative AT ALL of those on this forum. Everyone I've met here, native or transplant, is very happy with central OH. Maybe thats why Cbus is like the "stepchild" of OH, it actually has been doing things right and other parts of the state are falling behind.

Even in this horrible economy, I can see that Columbus is better able to handle the crisis, partly because most of that migration South has come to a halt and hurt places like Atlanta & Charlotte. The Triangle is holding it's own for now but I hear the tech jobs are starting to get hit. Frankly, I hear more RE and unemployment horror stories from down South than I have been witnessing here in Cbus.

I often wondered what would happen when the love affair with moving South went sour. I just wish folks would get there life straight where they are at, rather than move expecting it to be better on the other side. Often times, its not.

I am a native Cincinnatian and I agree with your assessment of Columbus, especially compared to the rest of Ohio. Growing up C'Bus was really nothing but the city you drove by to get to another city. But as an adult, I look at it and wonder why. To me, it is by far the best city in Ohio. Yeah, it may lack the coolness factor that some of the older cities has to offer (I hear the same thing said about Charlotte), but it makes up for it in substance and a nice standard of living. While I tend to view most of Ohio as stale, stagnate and even somewhat depressing, I find Columbus to be quite the opposite. I don't understand why it continues to so greatly under-valued by fellow Buckeyes. I would imagine the fact that it is the only large city in Ohio that has been built around white-collar industry has something to do with it.

[streetcreed]

I am a native Cincinnatian and I agree with your assessment of Columbus, especially compared to the rest of Ohio. Growing up C'Bus was really nothing but the city you drove by to get to another city. But as an adult, I look at it and wonder why. To me, it is by far the best city in Ohio. Yeah, it may lack the coolness factor that some of the older cities has to offer (I hear the same thing said about Charlotte), but it makes up for it in substance and a nice standard of living. While I tend to view most of Ohio as stale, stagnate and even somewhat depressing, I find Columbus to be quite the opposite. I don't understand why it continues to so greatly under-valued by fellow Buckeyes. I would imagine the fact that it is the only large city in Ohio that has been built around white-collar industry has something to do with it.

This is an amazing post! You have many excellent points here. Yes, it seems many from outside the midwest and NE love Columbus and dismiss Cleveland.

I agree it is because Columbus was the medium sized "boring" city before and now it isn't and they either are ignoring the great changes or have negative feelings towards a newer city, Columbus, in the middle of Ohio that has doubled in metro size and now have urban redevelopment that surpasses once greater cities.

Many friends of mine that have been in Columbus for a long time constantly say they how the city is night and day compared to the 80s and early 90s. Back then downtown had no nightlife, the short north didn't exist, and the Arena District (now hoping with nightlife for hours every night) was a dead area with some warehouses. Columbus has made great strides in the realm of urban nightlife, living, and local retail/art. Of course all of this is possible due to huge, but well paced, economic white collar 80s and 90s growth.

[HuskerDu]

Originally Posted by streetcreed

This is an amazing post! You have many excellent points here. Yes, it seems many from outside the midwest and NE love Columbus and dismiss Cleveland.

I agree it is because Columbus was the medium sized "boring" city before and now it isn't and they either are ignoring the great changes or have negative feelings towards a newer city, Columbus, in the middle of Ohio that has doubled in metro size and now have urban redevelopment that surpasses once greater cities.

Many friends of mine that have been in Columbus for a long time constantly say they how the city is night and day compared to the 80s and early 90s. Back then downtown had no nightlife, the short north didn't exist, and the Arena District (now hoping with nightlife for hours every night) was a dead area with some warehouses. Columbus has made great strides in the realm of urban nightlife, living, and local retail/art. Of course all of this is possible due to huge, but well paced, economic white collar 80s and 90s growth.

[rant] As someone who grew up, in part, around the area during the time, I can assure you that the Short North did exist back then and had much more character than it does today. The Cap is now losing businesses on a regular basis and the Arena District, with it's countless chain establishments geared towards lower-end suburbanites and 20-somethings, have almost completely diminished any prospect for long-term charm to the immediate north. Don't get me wrong, I love the fact that the Short North was finally realized as one of the few gems of Columbus, but the recent development has gotten out of hand and the businesses that are now going into the expansion to the south can lead to nothing but eventual decline. I give it 10 years until my kid will be coming back to me with horror stories similar to current ones you hear about the OSU Campus or 161/Busch Blvd. It's already starting to happen. [/rant]

[rijn_in]

I'm going to make a trip to Columbus when my travel schedule permits and review the Columbus centered blogs. I'm also going to make a trip to the Triangle area in investigate Raleigh and Durham. I hope to do both trips back to back then pull the trigger on a rental. Right now I'm leaning towards Raleigh for the weather, location and work. I'm holding off my final choice because Columbus is more of a city with nice urban/older living areas around its downtown that greatly interests me. I've received enough positive and negative feedback that will allow me to look closely at specific areas and qualities for each area.

I'm a Buckeye at heart with a lot of family in Cincinnati, Indianapolis, Dayton, etc. So Columbus would be great for reconnecting with family and friends. I just want to pick a place that matches my life and enjoy. My current lease ends in July. I have some time to visit, choose then return for a targeted rental search.

Gil

[rijn_in]

Please send me information for good Columbus blogs (outside of the ones already posted).

[streetcreed]

] As someone who grew up, in part, around the area during the time, I can assure you that the Short North did exist back then and had much more character than it does today. The Cap is now losing businesses on a regular basis and the Arena District, with it's countless chain establishments geared towards lower-end suburbanites and 20-somethings, have almost completely diminished any prospect for long-term charm to the immediate north. Don't get me wrong, I love the fact that the Short North was finally realized as one of the few gems of Columbus, but the recent development has gotten out of hand and the businesses that are now going into the expansion to the south can lead to nothing but eventual decline. I give it 10 years until my kid will be coming back to me with horror stories similar to current ones you hear about the OSU Campus or 161/Busch Blvd. It's already starting to happen.

I think your opinion is of interest. Yes, the Short North did exist before, but then it was known for drive by shootings, boarded up retail, and was called the Short North because of its high crime activity.

I know very few who can argue that the short north of the past is better than the place it is today. The Short North is a success story and we both agree on that, but I do also sometimes miss the little quirky places that were around a few years ago.

However, The Short North has very low retail vacancy and has seen a shift from art galleries to galleries with clothing/local fashion boutiques (with some owned by local designers.)

And the Short North actually has more art galleries than it did 10 years ago. They are just spread out between 5th and goodale. Before they were concentrated between Hubbard and Goodale (a 1/3 of the linear distance.)

Last, your arugment that the short north is lacking development northward is not true. As we speak, in this failing ecnonomy, the northern section of the short north has infill occurring at high rates. A 8 story condo building is going up with ground floor retail just blocks from my house.

Also, many bars/shops have expanded up northward and urban oriented chains like American Apparel have taken up shop while historic buildings become apartments/condos. This is occurring past the Short North up to the Gateway area.

To finish some of the chain activity that moved into the Short North in 1006 has decline or retreated. Coldstone Creamery left in 07 and was replaced by fine dining and a martini bar. The rent increases that were common in the housing bubble have stablized and local establishments (a mix of galleries, restaurants, coffe shops, and fashion shops) have taken root and seen very few closings.

My worst fear for the area is the current economy. Even though Columbus is seeing less job loss numbers than other metros, high end areas like the Short North are usually the first to take a hit in an economic down turn.

[Tenzo]

Originally Posted by streetcreed

it was known for drive by shootings, boarded up retail, and was called the Short North because of its high crime activity.

Actually, I think it was called the Short North because it was just North of the city center. Or Short of the North end.

I'm not sure the phrase "Short North" brings to mind high crime.

[Tenzo]

Originally Posted by rijn_in

Please send me information for good Columbus blogs (outside of the ones already posted).

Columbusunderground.com

[NC_MVP]

Columbus and RTP are both great areas. I grew up 40 minutes away from Raleigh and I have seen the major transformation in just the last 15 years. I have some friends that live in Columbus that I visit once a year. They are trying to get me to relocate there and I just may consider it once the economy turns around. RTP has better weather for sure (in the winter) but I think one would be happy in either city.

[streetcreed]

Actually, I think it was called the Short North because it was just North of the city center. Or Short of the North end.

I'm not sure the phrase "Short North" brings to mind high crime.

Ya its kind of an interesting story. Back in the glory days of the original Short North, before industrial decline and suburban development, the area was a Greek neighborhood, Italian, and Columbus' main immigrant groups (like German/ WASP) in Victorian Village.

The area was referred to as Italian Village or Victorian Village. The name Short North didn't really catch until the 60s and 70s, (as is my understanding from those who have been here much longer and local journalists.)

The term was invented because the area is the "short" area between Downtown and the Ohio State University campus, and just "north" of downtown.

People wanted to get through the "short north" as quick as possible and police cruisers knew the area for its high crime and by the 80s gang activity by the "Short North Posy."

Of course today the Short North is one of the revered success stories of midwest urban neighborhood gentrification.

Not only because the adjacent neighborhoods have been turned around but because the retail strip was rejuvenated by local artists, entrepreneurs, local restaurants, and now local fashion designers and retail owners.

This local retail mix keeps the neighborhood sustainable with local grocery options in walking distance with the North Market. Also, the area still has a number of apartments and options that keep it from being 100 percent homogeneous and still moderately diverse, in sexual orientation, income, and race.