U.S. CitiesCity-Data Forum Index
Go Back   City-Data Forum > General Forums > Science and Technology > Computers
 [Register]
Please register to participate in our discussions with 2 million other members - it's free and quick! Some forums can only be seen by registered members. After you create your account, you'll be able to customize options and access all our 15,000 new posts/day with fewer ads.
View detailed profile (Advanced) or search
site with Google Custom Search

Search Forums  (Advanced)
Reply Start New Thread
 
Old 06-21-2011, 09:53 PM
 
16,308 posts, read 25,273,417 times
Reputation: 8302

Advertisements

Quote:
Originally Posted by dkf747 View Post
I'm thinking we should be complaining about the heavy handed way law enforcement does their job rather than complaining about someone who does not secure their wifi. I don't know why we accept cops doing that when it isn't necessary. It's kind of nice that my neighbor leaves their wifi open.
Sadly that is a result of the fear caused by 9/11. Federal, state and local law enforcement use it as justification to cross the line from being the protector of rights to the oppressor of rights. But that's a whole different topic for a different forum.

Like laws requiring seat belts, I suspect we will see laws requiring wireless be secured.
German Court Says You Must Secure Your WiFi Or You May Get Fined | Techdirt

Or;
"A recent case in 2011 illustrates this point. A New York resident had his house raided by the police because they suspected that he was downloading child pornography. However, the resident was not responsible for the activity, but rather his neighbor who was logged into the man’s unsecured account. While the resident was not found guilty, he was still involved in the legal process because he did not protect his account with a password. " Wi-Fi Network Criminal Liability | LegalMatch Law Library
Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message

 
Old 06-21-2011, 09:55 PM
 
16,308 posts, read 25,273,417 times
Reputation: 8302
Quote:
Originally Posted by Vegas Joe View Post
What is to prevent that person from driving to the local McDonalds or Starbucks and downloading music, porn or whatever? Does the FBI go in and arrest the Manager at McDonalds?
See #46 above.
Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message
 
Old 06-22-2011, 09:08 AM
 
28,648 posts, read 40,622,302 times
Reputation: 37346
Quote:
Originally Posted by Vegas Joe View Post
What is to prevent that person from driving to the local McDonalds or Starbucks and downloading music, porn or whatever? Does the FBI go in and arrest the Manager at McDonalds?
Quote:
Originally Posted by Asheville Native View Post
See #46 above.

Yeah, why bother to read all the posts before dropping in an already asked and answered question?
Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message
 
Old 06-23-2011, 10:58 PM
 
8,426 posts, read 9,999,075 times
Reputation: 10785
But even 'securing' wi-fi doesn't prevent one from hacking into the network. It slows them down, but it's still possible. Are they going to make laws to require a certain password strength and encryption level? Say I secure my network with the password "password". Yeah it'll get hacked. And someone does something illegal on it. So would I still be held liable? That's why I hate those types of laws. It's like prosecuting a car owner who didn't lock the car door and gets his car stolen. Not smart on his part, but he shouldn't be held legally liable.
Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message
 
Old 06-24-2011, 12:26 AM
 
3,118 posts, read 3,934,613 times
Reputation: 2869
There really is no concern about getting caught up if someone does something illegal on a "borrowed" network. There are ways to determine which machine performed the activity. So while there is a risk of temporary inconvenience while it gets sorted out, the odds of being convicted are relatively slim.

At my house, my network card picks up 9 wireless networks (it's a powerful card). 1 is completely open, 3 use WEP, 4 use WPA, and I use WPA2. The open one speaks for itself, the 3 WEP networks I could get into in about 10 minutes, but I have specialized skills. The WPA networks would take too long to be worth the trouble. The only risk these 4 people take is to themselves, since leaving their network open like that exposes their information to theft, not so much a concern about something illicit that could happen on the network.

I used to have a sequestered subnet that I would leave open @ a bandwidth allocation of 56k speeds for passers-by to use as sort of a community benefit, but I caught someone trying to VLAN hop so I had to close it off. Idiots always gotta ruin it for others.
Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message
 
Old 06-24-2011, 09:52 AM
 
28,648 posts, read 40,622,302 times
Reputation: 37346
Quote:
Originally Posted by Xanathos View Post
There really is no concern about getting caught up if someone does something illegal on a "borrowed" network. There are ways to determine which machine performed the activity. So while there is a risk of temporary inconvenience while it gets sorted out, the odds of being convicted are relatively slim.

At my house, my network card picks up 9 wireless networks (it's a powerful card). 1 is completely open, 3 use WEP, 4 use WPA, and I use WPA2. The open one speaks for itself, the 3 WEP networks I could get into in about 10 minutes, but I have specialized skills. The WPA networks would take too long to be worth the trouble. The only risk these 4 people take is to themselves, since leaving their network open like that exposes their information to theft, not so much a concern about something illicit that could happen on the network.

I used to have a sequestered subnet that I would leave open @ a bandwidth allocation of 56k speeds for passers-by to use as sort of a community benefit, but I caught someone trying to VLAN hop so I had to close it off. Idiots always gotta ruin it for others.
I must have one hell of a powerful network card as mine at my house picks up 12.
Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message
 
Old 06-24-2011, 10:58 AM
 
16,308 posts, read 25,273,417 times
Reputation: 8302
Quote:
Originally Posted by Xanathos View Post

At my house, my network card picks up 9 wireless networks (it's a powerful card). 1 is completely open, 3 use WEP, 4 use WPA, and I use WPA2. The open one speaks for itself, the 3 WEP networks I could get into in about 10 minutes, but I have specialized skills. The WPA networks would take too long to be worth the trouble. The only risk these 4 people take is to themselves, since leaving their network open like that exposes their information to theft, not so much a concern about something illicit that could happen on the network.
A powerful card , more likely you have a card that meets the WiFi standards and 9 nearby networks. (receiving requires sensitivity, not power )

10 minutes to hack WEP. The force is weak within your special skills. People with literally no networking skills can hack WEP is less. They have learned how to use Google and read. 10 minutes if you include downloading and burning Backtrack Live CD.
Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message
 
Old 06-24-2011, 11:08 AM
 
16,308 posts, read 25,273,417 times
Reputation: 8302
Quote:
Originally Posted by 11thHour View Post
But even 'securing' wi-fi doesn't prevent one from hacking into the network. It slows them down, but it's still possible. Are they going to make laws to require a certain password strength and encryption level? Say I secure my network with the password "password". Yeah it'll get hacked. And someone does something illegal on it. So would I still be held liable? That's why I hate those types of laws. It's like prosecuting a car owner who didn't lock the car door and gets his car stolen. Not smart on his part, but he shouldn't be held legally liable.
You are correct, NOTHING is absolutely secure.

However, between MAC filtering, WPA2 w/strong passstring, not broadcasting SSID, etc., it can be made more difficult than the aveage amature hacker looking for a free access or just to create a little mistchief can overcome. Unless they have a personal vendetta against you personally, they are going to move on to easier targets.

Of course if your SSID, your routers password, your encryption key are all your dogs name, expect to be hacked.
Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message
 
Old 06-24-2011, 11:36 AM
 
2,182 posts, read 4,708,241 times
Reputation: 1206
Quote:
Originally Posted by Asheville Native View Post
Of course if your SSID, your routers password, your encryption key are all your dogs name, expect to be hacked.
I'm way smarter than that, I use 1234567 cause whos gonna guess that, right? ..........right?







(before someone jumps my ass and misses my sarcasm/jest, I use passphrases, like "I've lived on 17th street." - capital letters, special characters, numbers, spaces, punctuation)
Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message
 
Old 06-25-2011, 05:49 AM
 
3,118 posts, read 3,934,613 times
Reputation: 2869
Quote:
Originally Posted by Tek_Freek View Post
I must have one hell of a powerful network card as mine at my house picks up 12.
I guess it's worth pointing out that I live in Mercer Island Washington, so there's a considerable distance between houses (to say nothing of the ambient interference that is just part of life in the Seattle area). My laptops, for example, can only pick up 3. If you live in an apartment complex, sure, you can pick up half a building.
Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message
Please register to post and access all features of our very popular forum. It is free and quick. Over $68,000 in prizes has already been given out to active posters on our forum. Additional giveaways are planned.

Detailed information about all U.S. cities, counties, and zip codes on our site: City-data.com.


Reply
Please update this thread with any new information or opinions. This open thread is still read by thousands of people, so we encourage all additional points of view.

Quick Reply
Message:

Over $104,000 in prizes was already given out to active posters on our forum and additional giveaways are planned!

Go Back   City-Data Forum > General Forums > Science and Technology > Computers
Similar Threads
Follow City-Data.com founder on our Forum or

All times are GMT -6. The time now is 09:44 PM.

© 2005-2019, Advameg, Inc. · Please obey Forum Rules · Terms of Use and Privacy Policy · Bug Bounty

City-Data.com - Archive 1, 2, 3, 4, 5, 6, 7, 8, 9, 10, 11, 12, 13, 14, 15, 16, 17, 18, 19, 20, 21, 22, 23, 24, 25, 26, 27, 28, 29, 30, 31, 32, 33, 34, 35 - Top