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Old 02-27-2014, 12:05 PM
 
1,009 posts, read 1,561,461 times
Reputation: 846

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I got an SSD for my laptop (which has windows 8 on it) because the 5400 rpm drive doesn't do the core i5 justice. I didn't think I'd have nearly this much trouble

So, my laptop (HP Envy) came with reinstallation discs. Great, I'll use them to put windows 8 on the SSD.

NOT! You can't use the reinstallation discs unless windows 8 is already present on the target drive.

Alright, so I chat it up with HP support. I ask how I can get a reinstallation disc for my laptop so I could replace the hard drive. This was the response from my helpful HP tech friend:

Quote:
The HP OEM OS that HP has shipped with this computer is designed by HP and it would only get installed and work on a HP hard drive or SSD only , this is accordance with the copyright laws and I understand your concern but we are just simple technicians and what we can do is provided you the best possible technical information.You cannot use the HP OEM operating system on any 3rd party hard drive or SSD.The reason to this is HP tattoos the hard drive and the OEM OS so that 3rd party companies cannot misuse our operating system or misuse our hardware and use them on some other products.We at HP support believe in assisting our valued customers to their complete satisfaction; however, there are times and instances where product specific limitation gives us no choice.You can use the HP hard drive as your primary and then use the SSD as your secondary data storage unit.
That's right. I cannot use an OEM version of windows 8 on any other drive than the one that is already in my laptop. Could I clone the drive to the SSD? Maybe. What about partition size issues? Maybe make my current Win8 install partition the size of the target SSD? Seems like a PITA.

What MS and these OEMs are trying to do is absurd. The fact that I can't use my legal, legit copy of windows on another hard drive due to "piracy concerns" is ridiculous, because they're quite literally pushing me towards pirating their software to fix my issue! There's no way in hell I'm going to go buy another copy. They can kiss my white ass.

In short, F*** Microsoft and their crap OS. I will find a way around it, and it probably won't be legal, because I will not be forced to buy a product that I already have (notice I didn't say OWN, cause I don't feel that I do at this point).

Also, I'm not putting linux on the laptop. I need programs that do not have linux variants available to me. Please spare me the linux parade.

I'd love it if I could downgrade to Win7. Can't though.

Quote:
Hewlett-Packard is typical: It does not support downgrades of consumer-grade Windows 8 PCs to Windows 7. But if you buy a machine loaded with Windows 8 Pro, you can make the jump. HP's policy is based on Microsoft's licensing terms, which support downgrade rights only to new PCs preloaded with Windows 8 Pro, the version of Windows designed for business.
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Old 02-27-2014, 01:38 PM
 
10,752 posts, read 17,997,204 times
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What I suspect your problem is, is that the bootable media that you have doesn't actually have any recovery data on it, it likely just starts the recovery from a hidden partition on the hard drive. An OEM license does not forbid you from reinstalling on a replacement hard drive, it's just the method HP provided doesn't work on a blank drive. I would try imaging the old drive, then run a recovery if you still want to on the SSD, keeping in mind to make sure the partitions are properly aligned once copied to the SSD.
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Old 02-27-2014, 02:15 PM
 
1,009 posts, read 1,561,461 times
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That's typical of recovery media, they have hidden partitions that is used for the reinstall. The problem is I cannot use any form of media that exists to legally reinstall my copy of windows 8 on my SSD cleanly unless I purchase it, along with a new key.

Cloning a large drive to a small one makes me nervous. I don't feel like it's the right way to do it. Potentially the ONLY way to do it... other than installing a black version of Windows 7 or something else. It just pushes me past my acceptance level when a laptop that I paid for is being locked down by manufacturers and MS like this. I'm sure if I bought the hard drive or SSD from HP it'd work fine because they'd probably have me ship the f***in' thing to them so they could reinstall it for me. Cost me an arm and a leg, surely. Money grubbing is all it is. I already paid you once, I shouldn't have to fork up anything else beyond the parts cost in order to make my product work like it should.
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Old 02-28-2014, 10:10 AM
 
Location: God's Gift to Mankind for flying anything
5,370 posts, read 11,272,073 times
Reputation: 4202
Quote:
Originally Posted by adyn View Post
I got an SSD for my laptop (which has windows 8 on it) because the 5400 rpm drive doesn't do the core i5 justice. I didn't think I'd have nearly this much trouble

So, my laptop (HP Envy) came with reinstallation discs. Great, I'll use them to put windows 8 on the SSD.

NOT! You can't use the reinstallation discs unless windows 8 is already present on the target drive.
Not sure if you have the disks that I have for an HP.

I have an HP laptop
Did not come with recovery disks to completely install the whole OS.
Ordered them.
Disk Sleeve, they came in, labeled : 588817-001
Two disks labeled:
1 - System Recovery DVD Windows 7 Home Premium
--- 588819-001
--- Disk 1 of 2
2 - System Recovery DVD Windows 7 Home Premium
--- 588819-001
--- Disk 2 of 2
Then another Disk Sleeve, labeled : 592889-B21
1 - Application and Driver Recovery CD
--- 592890-B21

Then I bought a bigger *faster* drive (originally 300 something Gigs at 5400 RPM, now 500 Gig at 7200 RPM).
Made sure the unit would boot from DVD reader first.
Took the old one out, put the new one in and ran those *special* disks, starting with disk 1 of 2.
Did everything I expected, including making that *secret/hidden* partition to recover in case of *oops*.

I do not see why you can not do the same with an SSD disk ?

BTW, Since I also needed the foreign language capability, I upgraded to Win 7 Ult.
No problem by using the Update facility already on the disk, and buying another product key, and then downloading the Win 7 Ult OS.

Somewhere there is a flaw in the HP support system.
Suppose your disk crashes (Physically ! Not some software foul up)
How would you replace the whole OS on that new disk ?

I just went thru something like it with the help of DaveNH

With any new system, you are supposed to make a System recovery disk, and that is usually only one disk. (I know, because I did make one !)
How many disks do you have for a System reinstallation ?
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Old 03-01-2014, 01:03 AM
 
Location: 10110001010110100
6,385 posts, read 10,839,849 times
Reputation: 5589
Adyn, I have a Windows 98se CD that I no longer use, so if you are interested, let me know!


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Old 03-01-2014, 03:56 AM
 
Location: Itinerant
6,772 posts, read 4,371,505 times
Reputation: 5105
Quote:
Originally Posted by adyn View Post
I got an SSD for my laptop (which has windows 8 on it) because the 5400 rpm drive doesn't do the core i5 justice. I didn't think I'd have nearly this much trouble

So, my laptop (HP Envy) came with reinstallation discs. Great, I'll use them to put windows 8 on the SSD.

NOT! You can't use the reinstallation discs unless windows 8 is already present on the target drive.

Alright, so I chat it up with HP support. I ask how I can get a reinstallation disc for my laptop so I could replace the hard drive. This was the response from my helpful HP tech friend:



That's right. I cannot use an OEM version of windows 8 on any other drive than the one that is already in my laptop. Could I clone the drive to the SSD? Maybe. What about partition size issues? Maybe make my current Win8 install partition the size of the target SSD? Seems like a PITA.

What MS and these OEMs are trying to do is absurd. The fact that I can't use my legal, legit copy of windows on another hard drive due to "piracy concerns" is ridiculous, because they're quite literally pushing me towards pirating their software to fix my issue! There's no way in hell I'm going to go buy another copy. They can kiss my white ass.

In short, F*** Microsoft and their crap OS. I will find a way around it, and it probably won't be legal, because I will not be forced to buy a product that I already have (notice I didn't say OWN, cause I don't feel that I do at this point).

Also, I'm not putting linux on the laptop. I need programs that do not have linux variants available to me. Please spare me the linux parade.

I'd love it if I could downgrade to Win7. Can't though.
Have you tried this...
Upgrading Windows with only a product key - Microsoft Windows Help

Here's some info on how to make a backup copy for reinstall...
Microsoft Community - Microsoft Windows

The issue I'm seeing is not Microsoft, it looks like HP attempting lock-in.

I've never used that link personally, but I can't see why it wouldn't work, your Windows Product Key is registered I presume i.e. you've been using Windows Update.
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Old 03-01-2014, 05:22 AM
 
10,752 posts, read 17,997,204 times
Reputation: 10244
Quote:
Originally Posted by Gungnir View Post
Have you tried this...
Upgrading Windows with only a product key - Microsoft Windows Help

Here's some info on how to make a backup copy for reinstall...
Microsoft Community - Microsoft Windows
Neither one of those apply, you can't do a Windows upgrade on an empty hard drive.
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Old 03-01-2014, 07:35 AM
 
Location: NJ Shore
175 posts, read 236,236 times
Reputation: 119
Contact HP for a replacement set of media (Recovery Disks).

There's no reason they should not work on a new HDD/SSD -

OEM + Microsoft Windows Replacement Media (OS DVDs) - Sysnative Forums
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Old 03-01-2014, 12:52 PM
 
1,009 posts, read 1,561,461 times
Reputation: 846
I refuse to pay a dime to that company. I will not pay for media that should have already come with the PC. If they send me what I already have, it's worthless anyway.

I just found out that windows won't let me shrink the partition past 330gb, so I can't even clone the damn thing at this point. Wonderful.

I'm going to do a reinstall on the current hard drive, maybe I can get it to shrink further after that.



Edit: I MAY have found an actual OEM windows 8 ISO from HP that someone's uploaded... Downloading now. The good thing about this is I can try the install and if it doesn't work, i can put the other HDD back into it without losing anything or changing the current drive.

Crossing my fingers. I've downloaded 4 of these already (different sources) and none have worked.

Here's the link if anyone needs it:

Moderator cut: url removed

Last edited by Marka; 03-10-2014 at 04:01 AM..
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Old 03-01-2014, 07:50 PM
 
219 posts, read 366,559 times
Reputation: 540
I would just clone the drive using Acronis. You can use their free 30 day trial period. The fact that you are going from a larger drive to a smaller one is not a problem with Acronis. You will need a USB enclosure for the drive but these can be found cheap. Once you clone the drive and swap them out, you can then use the old drive, and the USB enclosure, as an external drive for back ups. I have done this when upgrading to SSD in a Dell laptop which has the same limitations you are finding with the hp. Nice thing about Acronis, unlike other cloning software, is it will clone all partitions, including the recovery partition. If you bought a Samsung SSD, their software will not clone the recovery partition. Just something to keep in mind.
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