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Old 08-13-2016, 11:59 PM
 
2,513 posts, read 2,526,201 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Robyn55 View Post
So what are you going to do next year? Assuming you use Turbotax. Intuit told us XP users it will not allow us to install/download TT next year on an XP computer (although we'll be able to access TT "in the cloud" - which I didn't want to do). That was what got me started in terms of buying a new system. I suspect my banks/brokerage firms will be following suit in terms of limiting XP access to accounts not too far down the road.

Note that I use an even older money management program than you do. Managing Your Money (for DOS). It's a 16 bit program that won't work on a 64 bit operating system. I am currently running it and another old program on an XP laptop. If anyone knows - would DOSBox allow me to run this program on a Windows 10 64 bit computer?

BTW - I'm a little unclear in terms of exactly what computer(s)/operating system(s) you're using.

Finally - I'm kind of agnostic when it comes to the old/new discussion/argument. There are a couple of things I have/like that are old. But some new ones that I like too. I sure wouldn't want to go back to the days of my first computer. An IBM 5120 (for my office):

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/IBM_5120

Talk about not-user friendly. And it was - especially by today's standards - hideously expensive too (I paid about $20,000 - which would be about $58,000 adjusted for inflation). Robyn

*A tax program is one program that has to be updated every year.
It's worth a try to try DOSBox to see if it runs "Managing Your Money for DOS" on Windows 64-bit. It runs so many many many other old DOS programs (as listed on their website at DOSBox, an x86 emulator with DOS under the "Compatibility" hypertext link) . . . so why wouldn't it run "Managing Your Money for DOS" as well? It won't cost anything to download DOSBox and try it out and learn by experience if you can (it is a free open source program). If it does run on a 64-bit computer, you can give up using your old XP laptop just for running that program.
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Old 08-14-2016, 12:10 AM
 
Location: Richardson, TX
11,346 posts, read 17,884,106 times
Reputation: 28842
Quote:
Originally Posted by Bo View Post
I know a couple of blind people who use computers. One of them has real difficulty mastering a graphical interface, but he's perfectly content working in the command line, with a screen reader.

People who design web sites need to realize that there are people who might be reading them who are fully dependent on the site's text for understanding the site's content.

Web accessibility is definitely being encouraged/taught to web designers today. https://www.w3.org/WAI/intro/accessibility.php

To those who prefer to continue using older software/browsers/operating systems for various reasons, I won't argue with you, but don't be surprised as many website features become less and less usable over time.
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Old 08-14-2016, 07:06 AM
 
Location: Amelia View
4,244 posts, read 12,772,939 times
Reputation: 3801
Quote:
Originally Posted by Robyn55 View Post
So what are you going to do next year? Assuming you use Turbotax. Intuit told us XP users it will not allow us to install/download TT next year on an XP computer (although we'll be able to access TT "in the cloud" - which I didn't want to do). That was what got me started in terms of buying a new system. I suspect my banks/brokerage firms will be following suit in terms of limiting XP access to accounts not too far down the road.
That's what started the issue for my father. His desktop is XP, his laptop is Win 7 (not sure if 32 or 64 bit). His laptop had neither Quicken nor TurboTax, and it was a bit of a problem installing them fresh on his laptop and transferring files from his desktop to his laptop. With TurboTax he had help from customer service, but with Quicken his best solution was to purchase a new piece of software and start from zero (i.e. his previous years' files he left on the desktop). For some of us the transfer process is easy, but for him it felt too complicated, and he said it's fine that he has to start from scratch.

Quote:
Note that I use an even older money management program than you do. Managing Your Money (for DOS). It's a 16 bit program that won't work on a 64 bit operating system. I am currently running it and another old program on an XP laptop. If anyone knows - would DOSBox allow me to run this program on a Windows 10 64 bit computer?
Laughing! I remember that DOS program! My first computer came with it, but also came with MSMoney which is what I originally used. I came up in the world when my XP laptop arrived with Quicken installed.

Quote:
BTW - I'm a little unclear in terms of exactly what computer(s)/operating system(s) you're using.
My father: XP on his desktop, Win 7 on his laptop.
Me: XP on one laptop, Win 7 64bit on another laptop, Win 7 64bit on my desktop.

Quote:
Finally - I'm kind of agnostic when it comes to the old/new discussion/argument. There are a couple of things I have/like that are old. But some new ones that I like too. I sure wouldn't want to go back to the days of my first computer. An IBM 5120 (for my office):

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/IBM_5120

Talk about not-user friendly. And it was - especially by today's standards - hideously expensive too (I paid about $20,000 - which would be about $58,000 adjusted for inflation). Robyn
I'm with you on this, quasi involved in the old/new discussion/argument. I'm not one who is stuck in the past. I'm neither stubborn nor resistant to change. In fact, most times I say change is good. But not always, not when change for the sake of change doesn't enrich my life. If something comes down the technology pike that is truly useful, I'm willing to suffer any learning curve.

Quote:
*A tax program is one program that has to be updated every year.
Yes indeed that is a must. It's just a shame that updates cannot accommodate all users. My father is a senior with very simple returns which is why he does his own. But being a senior also means limited funds, and purchasing new equipment to keep up with TurboTax's required OS is a hardship.
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Old 08-14-2016, 07:21 AM
 
Location: Ponte Vedra Beach FL
14,628 posts, read 18,270,440 times
Reputation: 6728
Quote:
Originally Posted by UsAll View Post
It's worth a try to try DOSBox to see if it runs "Managing Your Money for DOS" on Windows 64-bit. It runs so many many many other old DOS programs (as listed on their website at DOSBox, an x86 emulator with DOS under the "Compatibility" hypertext link) . . . so why wouldn't it run "Managing Your Money for DOS" as well? It won't cost anything to download DOSBox and try it out and learn by experience if you can (it is a free open source program). If it does run on a 64-bit computer, you can give up using your old XP laptop just for running that program.
I tried it - and it does work. Kind of. I get basic functionality - but lose the ability to customize things like the DOS window appearance. Unless I go into the DOSBox config file and start playing around with things like the appearance options. I seem to have lost my mouse pointer as well (just get the "box" pointer that you move around with keyboard keys). FWIW - I freaked out a little when I couldn't figure out how to get out of the DOS window. Then I remembered the DOS magic word - "exit" .

I may play around with the program a bit when I have more time and feel like relearning DOS. No hurry because there's another program I have to run on my XP laptop - an old stock charting program. Also discontinued and no manufacturer support. The problem there is a bear. Namely that the graphics drivers don't work in any version of Windows after XP (even when you use compatibility mode). I've never found anyone who could get the program to work on Windows 7 or later. The Y2K "patch" for this program may be an issue down the road too (the program runs on a Julian calendar and the Y2K patch is only supposed to be good until 2022 - seemed like a long ways away in 2000). Guess these are some projects for rainy days for the next X years . Robyn
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Old 08-14-2016, 07:45 AM
 
Location: Ponte Vedra Beach FL
14,628 posts, read 18,270,440 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by mawipafl View Post
...Yes indeed that is a must. It's just a shame that updates cannot accommodate all users. My father is a senior with very simple returns which is why he does his own. But being a senior also means limited funds, and purchasing new equipment to keep up with TurboTax's required OS is a hardship.
If money is an issue - or he doesn't want to upgrade his XP desktop or use his Windows 7 laptop - then he can always use the online version of Turbotax:

https://ttlc.intuit.com/questions/29...ade-windows-xp

So at least there's an option. When it comes to online access to things like bank and brokerage accounts - on line bill payment - or similar - there probably won't be any options for XP users.

FWIW - I think MSFT has done a pretty good job over the decades in terms of "backwards compatibility". It supported XP for 13 years - which is an eternity when it comes to technology. Robyn
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Old 08-15-2016, 12:31 PM
 
Location: Mableton, GA USA (NW Atlanta suburb, 4 miles OTP)
11,319 posts, read 22,745,181 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Robyn55 View Post
FWIW - I think MSFT has done a pretty good job over the decades in terms of "backwards compatibility". It supported XP for 13 years - which is an eternity when it comes to technology. Robyn
That depends on what you're comparing it to.

I worked on an airline system that was initially written in 1965 when I started my career in 1988, and the software I wrote for most of the first years of my career ran on that system. It was a combination of MASM1100 and Fortran 66.

They finally retired it in 2014. The UNIVAC 1108 software environment that it used ran unchanged since 1965 ... they just adjusted the older proto-TIP environment to newer incarnations of the OS (OS 2200 in this case) when required. The OS and hardware were modern, but the software had no idea.

In my book, 49 years isn't bad for a software environment. 13 is a good start, but needs work.
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Old 08-15-2016, 03:33 PM
 
Location: Ponte Vedra Beach FL
14,628 posts, read 18,270,440 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by rcsteiner View Post
That depends on what you're comparing it to.

I worked on an airline system that was initially written in 1965 when I started my career in 1988, and the software I wrote for most of the first years of my career ran on that system. It was a combination of MASM1100 and Fortran 66.

They finally retired it in 2014. The UNIVAC 1108 software environment that it used ran unchanged since 1965 ... they just adjusted the older proto-TIP environment to newer incarnations of the OS (OS 2200 in this case) when required. The OS and hardware were modern, but the software had no idea.

In my book, 49 years isn't bad for a software environment. 13 is a good start, but needs work.
I think you're talking about custom software used by a large corporation - written in a combination of programming languages -as opposed to an operating system. I suspect the software had to be "tweaked" when operating systems and hardware were upgraded. Which - in this and other corporations that were similarly situated - created some demand for older programmers who knew Fortran and similar. Ada - another old programming language - still seems to be around these days in some large corporate and similar environments (perhaps it's still used at the Department of Defense).

I actually have some software that is maybe 20 years old or so - written in DOS. It still works. Albeit only on a DOS emulator in Windows 10 64 bit because it's a 16 bit program (and it won't print either unless I hook up an old parallel port printer). But most really old software that I have doesn't work/doesn't work very well. Because there's no manufacturer support for the program at all (either because the manufacturer is out of business or it stopped supporting old versions of software after X years). And I don't employ a team of programmers that can "tweak" the software when necessary .

IOW - I don't think the situations are analogous. You're talking about custom software - and I'm talking about an operating system. BTW - is the software you're talking about from Southwest Airlines? I heard something about its software the other day on CNBC. It apparently dates WAY WAY back. But - like you said WRT the software you're talking about - the OS/hardware/etc. are contemporary (because the software has been updated over the decades). Robyn
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Old 08-16-2016, 08:35 PM
 
1,751 posts, read 1,188,959 times
Reputation: 2332
if OS does the job you want there is no need to get the latest OS. only computer geeks think any computer and OS that is over 2 years old is a museum piece.
word processing-win98 is fine xp is overkill
simple photo viewing/ editing win98 is fine
more sophisticated photo editing xp is fine
audio editing even xp is fine
get on the internet xp is fine vista is better
video editing xp is ok vista and win7 is better
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Old 08-17-2016, 06:51 AM
 
Location: Ponte Vedra Beach FL
14,628 posts, read 18,270,440 times
Reputation: 6728
Quote:
Originally Posted by hifijohn View Post
if OS does the job you want there is no need to get the latest OS. only computer geeks think any computer and OS that is over 2 years old is a museum piece.
word processing-win98 is fine xp is overkill
simple photo viewing/ editing win98 is fine
more sophisticated photo editing xp is fine
audio editing even xp is fine
get on the internet xp is fine vista is better
video editing xp is ok vista and win7 is better
Banks/brokerage firms/credit card companies/similar will probably stop supporting Windows XP soon (don't know about Vista). Shopping sites may do the same. One person here has mentioned that his doctor's billing website won't take XP now. The problem is that since there is no security support for Window XP or earlier - any web site that is concerned about security is going to lock out XP/older OS users. Perhaps these changes won't affect you. But they will affect a lot of users. Robyn
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Old 08-17-2016, 07:38 AM
 
1,196 posts, read 709,438 times
Reputation: 3257
George RR Martin (author of "A Song of Ice and Fire" (Game of Thrones) famously uses an old DOS computer and Wordstar 4.0 as a word processor for all of his writing. He's happy not having to worry about viruses and things like that since the computer is not connected to the internet.
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