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Old 03-15-2018, 02:07 AM
 
32 posts, read 6,875 times
Reputation: 47

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Things you should know about me . . .

1) I hate DELL computers.
2) I hate Windows 10
3) I really MISS MY Windows Media Center (R.i.P) !!
4) Im at a novice level and very interested in creating 3D rendering/animation cartoon style short films kind of like "family guy"/"Simpsons" but much more realistic.
5) I must have a built in TV Tuner. The coaxial cable input literally. (Not an adapter, Card, or 3rd party accessory like Haupagge, etc.)
6) I like racing games and free world exploration games. Not so much 1st person shooters like "Call of Duty". So please keep this in mind and consider the refresh rate , F.rames P.er M.inute necessary.
7) Every computer in my life had a bad RAM issue going on which would never be properly diagnosed (as some say it may have been the motherboard and not the RAM). Arrrgh!

With that being said...Am i crazy for considering a new build without* Windows 10 ?

Im staying with 7 just because Microsoft took out and is no longer 'supporting' / 'offering' the classic Windows Media Center introduced in XP. For those not familiar it was a program where you could record live tv before DVR boxes from cable cable companies where even thought of or popular. It really paved the way but got sidelined because DRM and copyright nonsense from what i believe.

-------------------------

Note: Guys i dont want this to turn into a Windows 10 vs 7 debate. If you can convince me as to valid reasons i should consider it. Thats cool. Although a simple google search will clearly show most people prefer 7 over 10.
--------------------------

Soooo....

Let's start with the obvious as i would like to keep this organized.
Step 1: The "tower" aka "case"
good breathability/ ventilation to prevent overheating maybe even one that lights up with cool light pattern and clear case ?

I especially value the feedback of anyone has a custom build and appreciate any links to parts, etc.
Feel free to post any advice you have for me, things you may have done wrong, etc so that i can learn from those mistakes.

Budget: $800-900

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Old 03-15-2018, 10:13 AM
 
Location: Greensboro, NC
5,894 posts, read 4,419,350 times
Reputation: 3934
Quote:
Originally Posted by IcebergIzm View Post
Things you should know about me . . .

1) I hate DELL computers.
2) I hate Windows 10
3) I really MISS MY Windows Media Center (R.i.P) !!
4) Im at a novice level and very interested in creating 3D rendering/animation cartoon style short films kind of like "family guy"/"Simpsons" but much more realistic.
5) I must have a built in TV Tuner. The coaxial cable input literally. (Not an adapter, Card, or 3rd party accessory like Haupagge, etc.)
6) I like racing games and free world exploration games. Not so much 1st person shooters like "Call of Duty". So please keep this in mind and consider the refresh rate , F.rames P.er M.inute necessary.
7) Every computer in my life had a bad RAM issue going on which would never be properly diagnosed (as some say it may have been the motherboard and not the RAM). Arrrgh!

With that being said...Am i crazy for considering a new build without* Windows 10 ?

Im staying with 7 just because Microsoft took out and is no longer 'supporting' / 'offering' the classic Windows Media Center introduced in XP. For those not familiar it was a program where you could record live tv before DVR boxes from cable cable companies where even thought of or popular. It really paved the way but got sidelined because DRM and copyright nonsense from what i believe.

-------------------------

Note: Guys i dont want this to turn into a Windows 10 vs 7 debate. If you can convince me as to valid reasons i should consider it. Thats cool. Although a simple google search will clearly show most people prefer 7 over 10.
--------------------------

Soooo....

Let's start with the obvious as i would like to keep this organized.
Step 1: The "tower" aka "case"
good breathability/ ventilation to prevent overheating maybe even one that lights up with cool light pattern and clear case ?

I especially value the feedback of anyone has a custom build and appreciate any links to parts, etc.
Feel free to post any advice you have for me, things you may have done wrong, etc so that i can learn from those mistakes.

Budget: $800-900

Well, you know what you want to do on the system, but what applications are you going to be using to do these graphic animations? What are the system requirements for such? It's OK if you want to run Windows 7, but again, you need to look at the basic system requirements for everything you need application wise. The requirements for your OS. The requirements for each application you plan to run (you don't have to get specific in terms of browsers or anything like that, but the heavy duty stuff you plan to do.) And then, at least double the system resources for that stuff. For instance, if an application says it needs 2GB of RAM and at least the fastest i3 processor out there (dual core), you probably want to go 4GB or RAM (any video stuff I'd say you need to go at least 8GB of RAM or more) and move up to i5. I would imagine, however, anything graphics related, you're going to want i7 and you're going to want 8-16GB of RAM.
Having said that, I do video editing on my Macbook Pro with an i7 processor, but I currently only have 4 GB of RAM in the machine and even just doing video editing in iMovie is very laggy. 8 to 16 GB of RAM would probably be what I would need in order to run something like Adobe Premiere or Final Cut Pro. My assumption, anything that is 3-D rendering is going to need a hefty system. I don't know if $900 is going to be a sufficient budget for such, but it would really help to know what application you plan on using to create your 3-D cartoon.
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Old 03-15-2018, 10:17 AM
 
Location: Raleigh, NC
2,296 posts, read 3,489,851 times
Reputation: 3012
I'm in my 5th (or +?) generation DIY system, so I have a bit of experience.

DIY comes in two general levels:
1) You provide the general or specific specifications or components to a local computer shop, (I've used Interex when doing a friends for them), and they acquire and install it all. The benefits for this are:
* Their experts can provide suggestions,
* The assembly is done by them, and
* The main unique service they can provide is they can do a Burn In, where they run software on the completed assembly that 'severely exercises' the components, for say 100 hours, as a way to accelerate electronic failure. If such happens, for electronics it almost always happens pretty soon. Doing this lets you spot that 5% or so, bad parts from the factory, and the shop will replace them for free and start over. Better that happens with the shop than at your home after a week or so.

Of course, you'll pay a bit more. They may be able to find better discounts than you can on some of the components, but will have a charge for assembly and testing.

Graphic Card(s) (GCs): Here is where you'll probably spend most of your research time, as there are so many, with a huge range of capabilities. Also, with the bit-coin mining surge, the higher end ones are hard to find as individual components.
* I've seen some suggestions that it may be cheaper to buy a pre-built computer system, complete with high-end graphic cards, just because those firms had already pre-purchased the graphic cards before the price explosion. (This is why this paragraph is here, and not below the motherboard selection tips).
* A point, especially for those interested in using an external TV, is having an HDMI (High Definition Multimedia Interface). This may come from an on-motherboard graphics card, or more advanced quality output from your graphics card.
* Get a graphic card with enough on-board RAM for your needs. Do the research on this.
* Decide if you have enough need for super-powered graphics to get dual GSs (that work in parallel). Double the cost, but huge bump in performance, for gaming and other graphic intensive work.
* Choose what quality sound you want, if you're going to external speakers with or without their own amplifiers.

2) If you have the knowledge (or the time to research, and acquire the knowledge), of what specific components you want, the you can get them from Amazon, Egghead, and other sources individually, and assemble it yourself.
This will take a bit of your time, or even more time, depending on how much you know about what you want, and how much you know about what would provide that.
The good news is that there are websites out there that help you choose. Like

https://www.tomsguide.com/
https://www.cnet.com/topics/desktops/buying-guide/
Google "which motherboard to buy" and "which CPU to buy"

A few Lessons Learned:
Casing: Decide if this computer is The One and that you won't be upgrading or tweaking it much. If so, then get the casing that "just" holds your devices. If you expect to upgrade and tweak a lot over the next few years, then get a larger casing. I got the biggest one I could get, and have loved the space inside that lets me swap out drives, cards, etc, without having to hire a 5-year old's hands due to space limitations.
* Mine even have removable drive bays, that hold the internal hard disk drives in sub-assembly frames that then mount inside the casing. Makes for much easier HDD swapping.
* Mine also has a nice feature for the surface devices. It has mounting rails. You screw the plastic rails guides onto the sides of the optical drives that will mount for external access, slide them into the rails and the drives snap into place. You can do the screwing while the drive is outside the case. Then reach inside and plug in the data and power cables.
* Also, the bigger cases can have additional fans, which is nice. If possible, get the fans with dust screens as mine just loads up with dust, and that's bad for components that generate heat and need to loose it. (CPU, RAM chips, Graphic Cards mostly).

Power Supply: Figure out how much power (watts) all your installed components will consume, total it all, and then buy a power supply at least 2 steps above that. This is to have a safety factor, and upgradability, and generally keep it cooler. Make sure you check what kind and number of power cables it provides for connecting to internal devices such as Hard Drives, Blu-Ray burners, Graphic Card extra power connections.

CPU: I'd stick with Intel or AMD. The known big firms. I found which one was the absolute top rated best performance CPU, and then got the one that was the one it had just replaced. Big cost savings for only a minor performance jump.

Motherboard (MB):
* First criteria is that it has to match the form-factor accepted by the casing. Super easy as the mounting and screw patterns are very standardized. Just be sure they both match the same standard.
* Next, it MUST have the CPU socket style that your CPU came with. Another easy criteria, but also a must.
* Next criteria to consider is the internal buss type, and the external and internal buss connections. PCI, PCIx, SATA, SATA6, M2. What you need depends on how many, of what type, you need to get. IE: You want your boot drive to be the fastest, either SATA6 or even M.2, (see SATA vs M.2 SSD - [Solved] - Storage - Tom's Hardware ) and perhaps it's a SSD (solid state disk drive, or hybrid) not just an iHDD. The faster the data transfer rates, the higher the cost of the card, or course.
* some MBs will also have 'bells and whistles' to allow for, or facilitate over-clocking, having extra gauges on the casing (like fan speed, CPU and other location temp gauges, etc.)
* Count up the number of external devices you plan on connecting, and see if you MB can support them. IE: count the number of back-panel and front-panel USB 2 and USB 3 ports it has. (Here's a good time to decide if you want to make the jump to USB 3c, the 3 that's got a symmetrical plug and will be "The Standard" for all non-Apple computer devices from now on, but is currently annoying if you have a lot of old-style you need to connect). Note: external USB 2 and USB 3 hubs are cheap and easy to buy and upgrade, if you forecast future external devices.
* A minor point is the connection method for your mouse and keyboard. Some are USB 2, some are
* Most motherboards will come with an on-board network circuits and plug. Almost all will be 1 or 10 Gigabit (thousand bit per second speed), but confirm this.
* Decide if you need the MB to have more exotic output ports, like eSATA (external SATA), and/or Firewire, and/or DVI for a legacy monitor, and/or Optical output to stereo systems. I chose mine to have a PS/2 connection for my 10+ year old beloved (read indestructible) keyboard.
* A real nice feature some MB manufacturer provide is software that simplifies driver software upgrades for the MB and other devices like the GC.

Here's a good picture of all the different types of past and current ports: https://www.electronicshub.org/types-of-computer-ports/

Transfer over from your previous system:
I've saved a bunch of money by cannibalizing a lot of my previous system:

External UPS. A must. You need quality power filtering, and a battery that can give you time to do a controlled shut-down, rather than a pull-the-plug power off. My UPS (by APC Corp) has software I installed that talks to the battery unit via USB cable that detects a power outage and will tell my system to do a controlled shut-down, all automatically. Choose your battery size for a reasonable powered duration. I got real conservative for this and instead of 5-10 minutes power supply, I paid just a bit more to handle 30+ minutes. APC also has a very comforting warranty if it doen't protect my system.
Various internal devices: I always get a new system with the OS installed, so it's a clean system and not just a relocated snarl of aged installed/removed software from my old. But the other data drives can be relocated super easy. As long as you're MB has the internal connections and you have the right cables, it only takes minutes to swap. Likewise optical drives (CD, DVD, Blu-Ray players, burners). I also reused my very comfortable mouse and keyboard, and external USB-3 hub for some external Hard Disk Drives I already had.

Final
Thoughts:

DIY will take several man-hours of research time, and will involve a bit of risk of you damaging parts if you try to mis-install them, but it lets you get a system that's closer to your ideal and may save you a few bucks.
Once you do a system DIY, you learn most of what you'll need for the next upgrade.
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Old 03-20-2018, 07:59 AM
 
Location: Cleveland, Ohio
11,825 posts, read 13,966,567 times
Reputation: 8068
You need to up your budget.
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Old 03-27-2018, 04:46 PM
 
295 posts, read 232,900 times
Reputation: 386
You asked a lot but I'll only touch on 2 of them.

1. Requiring a TV tuner builtin will yield you with little to no results. MB manufacturers just aren't going to include this in their boards cause very few people want it. You'll want a separate card anyways so you can pick and choose which ones have the options you want.

2. There are other options to Windows Media Center that are still supported and going strong. Try looking into Kodi and MediaPortal.
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Old 03-29-2018, 04:41 PM
 
7,155 posts, read 3,912,101 times
Reputation: 6719
Quote:
Originally Posted by Peregrine View Post
You need to up your budget.
Agreed, or lower expectations.

The problem with not going Windows 10 is that over time there will no longer be drivers for new hardware, or the OS won't be able to take full advantage.

Windows 7 is nearly 9 years old now.

If OP is dead set on a Win 7 system then I'd get some used parts like a Z97 Motherboard, 16GB DDR3 (or 32GB), 4790K OC'd to 4.5+.

And scrap the idea of an inbuilt TV tuner. That will limit things so much as to cripple anything else and I can't recall seeing many motherboards with them in the past 8-10 years.

And as far as my experience to OP, I've been building systems for nearly 30 years, from the 8088 through the latest i7 series. Probably 100+ systems if I stopped to think of it.
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Old 03-30-2018, 08:22 PM
Status: "¡Vaya Con Dios!" (set 27 days ago)
 
Location: Europe
4,244 posts, read 635,581 times
Reputation: 867
Quote:
I must have a built in TV Tuner. The coaxial cable input literally.
Its fantastic.
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Old 03-30-2018, 08:28 PM
Status: "¡Vaya Con Dios!" (set 27 days ago)
 
Location: Europe
4,244 posts, read 635,581 times
Reputation: 867
Quote:
I really MISS MY Windows Media Center (R.i.P) !!
You mean windows media maker? No media center into Win XP imbedded
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Old 03-31-2018, 11:09 AM
 
Location: Cleveland, Ohio
11,825 posts, read 13,966,567 times
Reputation: 8068
OP seems to have abandoned this thread. I'd say we're done here until he comments again.
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Old 03-31-2018, 02:03 PM
 
Location: Not far from Fairbanks, AK
16,724 posts, read 29,321,260 times
Reputation: 12539
All the answers can be found at "youtube.com"

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=XE58q8OHvdI

Another:

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=7D50mMbxB8o

3D rendering?
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ZDI6ZBAcNYE
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