[Highpointer]

Originally Posted by JayCT

As for your comments on parks and libraries, all I can say is "what are you talking about???". I have been to Phoenix and did not see any parks that I would say were great (and yes I did check around). I saw a very large sprawling (and sorry to say IMHO fairly unattractive) city with a few (very few in fact) parks here and there. The parks were very nice but not much more than what I see here in CT. Maybe I missed something but I highly doubt it.

Phoenix has the largest municipal park in the USA - South Mountain Park. Also, I have seen many amenities in the parks of my hometown, Tempe, that are not in the parks in the Connecticut towns where my sister and parents live. There are many outstanding parks in Tempe, Phoenix, and other cities and town of the Phoenix area.

Ken Akerman
Tempe, AZ

[skytrekker]

The Phoenix-Tempe Metro Crime rate is among the worse in the nation. Traffic is horrible. The sprawl is mindless, air pollution is horrific.


The quality of life IMHO does not compare in any way to New England. Spent time there 7 years ago- it was HOT, dusty, and culturally

barren. Yup the parks may be pretty- but beyond that-nothing.

[wanderintonc]

Well, Raleigh does have the highest percentage of population holding PHD degrees, that is a fact. Since I don't have one myself, I don't really care-I look forward to Raleigh for many other reasons. I hope my kids will choose to go to college in one of that area's many schools.

[Highpointer]

Originally Posted by skytrekker

The quality of life IMHO does not compare in any way to New England. Spent time there 7 years ago- it was HOT, dusty, and culturally

barren. Yup the parks may be pretty- but beyond that-nothing.

Why are so many people moving to Arizona, and more people are moving out of New England than are moving into New England? If you ever visited Arizona in a month like December, January, or February, and compared the weather and what you could do in those months with the weather and what one could do during the same time of year in New England, then one would find it hard to leave Arizona.

I know that the Phoenix area is hot, but there are nearby high-elevation towns such as Prescott, Flagstaff, and Payson that offer great ourdoor recreational opportunities and a respite from the summer heat.

Ken Akerman

[skytrekker]

Highpointer

with all due respect- population influx can have its down sides as well. Nasty sprawl, increased crime, bad traffic, poor schools and inadequate or lacking local infrastructure because governments have kept taxes so low- there is not enough money for the needed improvements.

Just because people flock to a specific location, does not mean they will A. be Happy B. Have a high quality of life.

As for climate- Yes the weather in Phoenix and Tucson from November to April is pleasant compared to New England and the northern tier of states.

However as I found out its from May to October when the region becomes an oven like inferno. Dry heat or not is still very uncomfortable- I frankly would rather take 3-4 months of cold weather then nearly 6 months of cloudless sunny, hot 100-120 degree weather endlessly.

Also I may add for the near future, because of global warming/climate change the weather In AZ is likely to become even hotter and drier causing more problems for the residents and new comers. Water will become an even larger variable.

In 10-15 years many areas of the southwest could actually see outmigration because of the extreme weather conditions for 6 months of the year. While weather in New England for the same reasons will increasingly see milder winters and longer springs through Autumns.

Yes Prescott and Flagstaff are very pleasant because of elevation- but it also extremely expensive.

Lastly on an intangible such as quality of life and education
Arizona ranked near the bottom of all states CT ranked in the top 5. People may be flocking to the state; however that does not mean it will be good for them.

[JayCT]

Originally Posted by Highpointer

Why are so many people moving to Arizona, and more people are moving out of New England than are moving into New England? If you ever visited Arizona in a month like December, January, or February, and compared the weather and what you could do in those months with the weather and what one could do during the same time of year in New England, then one would find it hard to leave Arizona.

I know that the Phoenix area is hot, but there are nearby high-elevation towns such as Prescott, Flagstaff, and Payson that offer great ourdoor recreational opportunities and a respite from the summer heat.

Ken Akerman

The vast majority of Arizona's population come from California. They are moving to escape excessively high housing costs and taxes. Yes I will admit that a couple of months of the year that Arizonia weather is nicer than New England, but the rest of the year the heat is obscene. Definitely not for me. I do not understand why people would rather deal with several months of unbearable heat rather than a few snow storms. The weather here in NE isn't that bad, IMHO. Jay

[JViello]

Originally Posted by Highpointer

Why are so many people moving to Arizona, and more people are moving out of New England than are moving into New England?

Frankly, you're clueless. ALL the New England states have had net population gains from 2000-2005 and in fact New Hampshire has grown faster than the national average. So where did you get that notion that we are losing population?

http://quickfacts.census.gov/qfd/index.html

[wanderintonc]

Jviello, Highpointer is correct-more people have moved out of New England than into it, in recent years. The population growth that has occured is due to other factors. He didn't say that the NE is losing population. There have been articles published about this recently, which I would link if I was not so tired at the moment...

[Rich Lee]

Originally Posted by JViello

Frankly, you're clueless. ALL the New England states have had net population gains from 2000-2005 and in fact New Hampshire has grown faster than the national average. So where did you get that notion that we are losing population?

http://quickfacts.census.gov/qfd/index.html

According to this link, every state but North Dakota had a population gain from 2000. However, many of the New England and Mid-Atlantic states had growth rates between 0.0 and 2.0 (New York, Pennsylvania, and Massachusetts). Contrast these figures with those of Nevada (20.8), Arizona (15.8), Georgia (10.8), and North Carolina (7.9) and one can see that the Northeast is shrinking (by virtue of not growing at the same rate) compared to states in other regions. There are many others (Idaho, Texas, and Utah, for example) that are growing at significantly higher rates than the national average.

Another good barometer is the Electoral College as it changes every 10 years.

Eight states gained electoral votes, based on Census 2000 results, since the last presidential election in 2000. Four of these states — Arizona, Florida, Georgia and Texas — each gained two votes. The other four — California, Colorado, Nevada and North Carolina — gained one apiece.

Ten states had fewer electoral votes in 2004 than in 2000. Two states — New York and Pennsylvania — each lost two votes. The other eight — Connecticut, Illinois, Indiana, Michigan, Mississippi, Ohio, Oklahoma and Wisconsin — each lost one vote.

The growth rate for Connecticut is comparable to that of Indiana and Wyoming.

NOTE: the 2004 elections used census data from 2000; the 2000 elections used census data from 1990.

[skytrekker]

Originally Posted by wanderintonc

Jviello, Highpointer is correct-more people have moved out of New England than into it, in recent years. The population growth that has occured is due to other factors. He didn't say that the NE is losing population. There have been articles published about this recently, which I would link if I was not so tired at the moment...

Demographic patterns since the late 1960s and early 70s till now will obviously see the so called 'Sunbelt' states far outstripping areas of the Midwest and most of the northeast in population growth. That is certainly proven in the Demographic and census data, and the change of the electoral landscape, with the gain of political clout of the south, and southwest.

The reasons for this are weather and costs; However in an interesting piece from the AARP (which I belong) did have a map showing 'creeping' climatic zones' with milder temperatures further north compared to 30 years ago .And as I alluded to above climate change is likely going to make all these areas south and west both hotter-much hotter in fact.- in the near future. With more cyclonic storms in the south, and more drought further west.

The climate in the northeast is simply growing warmer. Washington DC is the 'New North Carolina' was something I read in the Washington Post over the winter. The Post article talked about 'zone creep' and how some palms are now growing in the DC area- along with other plants from the south that would have never been tried a few decades ago.

In Connecticut; well in my garden I grew two cold hardy Asiatic fan palms through the winter with minimal protection and they survived and are thriving. I may also add I have had a Giant Sequoia growing on the estate for 3 years.

Other reasons for the so called exodus to the Sunbelt; Cheaper living/lower costs. Well not in Florida. Housing costs in the major metro areas are ALL higher then CT outside of Fairfield county. And taxes are rising. Homeowners Insurance costs thousands in Florida.

AZ has housing costs that are near Hartford's with Phoenix about the same, Tucson and little lower, while Flagstaff and Prescott higher.

California? CT looks like a dime store.
Areas of the mid south still have an advantage over CT- while NC- well we have over and over here beat that into the grown pro and con.

Therefore, its in the stats that the 'Sunbelt' states have seen a fairly large in migration in the last 3 decades or so- that may not continue with as much fervor in the future. And may shift to other areas.

The biggest wild card is climate change- which could render these areas too hot in the very near future. And with costs Soon to reach a near parody with southern New England- a continued migration into these areas may slow and even come to a halt.