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Old 11-15-2011, 01:08 PM
 
Location: Dallas, TX
31,777 posts, read 25,279,703 times
Reputation: 12236

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Quote:
Originally Posted by cheesecurd View Post
"these monstrosities" as you put it make it possible for you to go to a store...
I didn't know people like you were using stop light cameras to get around.
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Old 11-15-2011, 02:32 PM
 
62 posts, read 56,892 times
Reputation: 25
Quote:
Originally Posted by heetseeker View Post
All cameras should be burned. Anti American c##p. Ho rah for the police state.
And get rid of all the police and fire departments too...what do need them for? Damn fascists!
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Old 11-15-2011, 08:17 PM
 
Location: Texas
5,070 posts, read 9,076,702 times
Reputation: 1632
Quote:
Originally Posted by heetseeker View Post
All cameras should be burned. Anti American c##p. Ho rah for the police state.
Saves property and lives.
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Old 11-16-2011, 08:57 AM
 
Location: Northern MN
3,869 posts, read 13,327,374 times
Reputation: 3581
How does recording the event save lives or property.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Brian.Pearson View Post
Saves property and lives.
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Old 11-16-2011, 09:18 AM
 
Location: Dallas, TX
31,777 posts, read 25,279,703 times
Reputation: 12236
Quote:
Originally Posted by Brian.Pearson View Post
Saves property and lives.
Not necessarily. In fact, I've noticed people trying to speed through, to pass the light as soon as they can. While many, jam on brakes rather abruptly. I was a witness to an accident that entailed the sequence above. "Property" is probably at a greater risk with lights, IMO.

As for life, may be. But then, I believe that traffic accidents for running lights happen because people are in another world at the time and the only purpose the camera serves is take pictures of the aftermath.
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Old 11-16-2011, 10:47 AM
 
Location: Texas
5,070 posts, read 9,076,702 times
Reputation: 1632
Quote:
Originally Posted by snofarmer View Post
How does recording the event save lives or property.

Saving lives
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Old 11-16-2011, 10:49 AM
 
Location: Texas
5,070 posts, read 9,076,702 times
Reputation: 1632
Quote:
Originally Posted by EinsteinsGhost View Post
Not necessarily. In fact, I've noticed people trying to speed through, to pass the light as soon as they can. While many, jam on brakes rather abruptly. I was a witness to an accident that entailed the sequence above. "Property" is probably at a greater risk with lights, IMO.

As for life, may be. But then, I believe that traffic accidents for running lights happen because people are in another world at the time and the only purpose the camera serves is take pictures of the aftermath.
Some are just plain idiots.
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Old 11-16-2011, 11:38 AM
 
40,212 posts, read 41,799,403 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by EinsteinsGhost View Post
Not necessarily. In fact, I've noticed people trying to speed through, to pass the light as soon as they can. While many, jam on brakes rather abruptly. I was a witness to an accident that entailed the sequence above.
This would illustrate what I'm talking about, the camera can impede the normal flow of traffic. Normally this is a judgment call and in some cases going through the red light is safest way to proceed if for example the other option is to slam your brakes on. Now we have another variable where the camera plays a factor and the driver instead of doing what is safe takes actions to prevent getting a ticket. Again the cuse of most accidents is anything that disrupts the normal flow of traffic like someone pulling up to a light and stopping abruptly.
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Old 11-16-2011, 11:53 AM
 
Location: Texas
5,070 posts, read 9,076,702 times
Reputation: 1632
Quote:
Originally Posted by thecoalman View Post
This would illustrate what I'm talking about, the camera can impede the normal flow of traffic. Normally this is a judgment call and in some cases going through the red light is safest way to proceed if for example the other option is to slam your brakes on. Now we have another variable where the camera plays a factor and the driver instead of doing what is safe takes actions to prevent getting a ticket. Again the cuse of most accidents is anything that disrupts the normal flow of traffic like someone pulling up to a light and stopping abruptly.
That's why the red light cameras are programed to ignore the people doing the right thing by running the red light. That way they don't get slammed in the rear. That leeway is a life saver, not to mention a money saver.

It could be different in other towns, but in my town and as well as in the Dallas area, it is the same.
From "Safelight"
The first 17 cameras installed in January of 2007 now have two years of post implementation data and our analysis shows the following before and after results:
  • 61% average reduction in intersection accidents caused by red light running (http://www.dallascityhall.com/pubsafe/safelight.html - broken link)
  • 30% average reduction in intersection accidents of all types (http://www.dallascityhall.com/pubsafe/safelight.html - broken link)
  • 100% of the intersections showed reductions in red-light accidents (http://www.dallascityhall.com/pubsafe/safelight.html - broken link)
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Old 11-16-2011, 12:05 PM
 
Location: Dallas, TX
31,777 posts, read 25,279,703 times
Reputation: 12236
Quote:
Originally Posted by Brian.Pearson View Post
That's why the red light cameras are programed to ignore the people doing the right thing by running the red light. That way they don't get slammed in the rear. That leeway is a life saver, not to mention a money saver.

It could be different in other towns, but in my town and as well as in the Dallas area, it is the same.
From "Safelight"
The first 17 cameras installed in January of 2007 now have two years of post implementation data and our analysis shows the following before and after results:
  • 61% average reduction in intersection accidents caused by red light running (http://www.dallascityhall.com/pubsafe/safelight.html - broken link)
  • 30% average reduction in intersection accidents of all types (http://www.dallascityhall.com/pubsafe/safelight.html - broken link)
  • 100% of the intersections showed reductions in red-light accidents (http://www.dallascityhall.com/pubsafe/safelight.html - broken link)
There are studies that suggest an increase in accidents as well, and that accidents have declined regardless of camera being in place, or not.

The biggest problem with such enforcements is that cameras don't think. They don't take into account how a person or the vehicle will react to conditions. On many occasions, it might be safer for vehicle to go when the camera would record it as a violation, and that requires judgment call on a person who would review the case. In one case, a similar call resulted in a challenge thrown out of the court, because the camera and the person analyzing agreed, but the details didn't. This person was turning at a light, after yielding... the camera took multiple shots showing the person took several seconds to go through and when it was safe. Yet, he received this ticket, and had to go through the nuisance of challenging it.
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