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Old 06-24-2014, 04:43 AM
 
261 posts, read 317,863 times
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The other countries are socialized. That's why the US ranks last. If I'm not mistaken. people in those other countries are taxed as much as 75%, if not more. I don't think most Americans really want that much tax coming out of their paycheck. US may rank last in that poll, but I don't think you'll find any better health care, or more advance health care than what we have in the United States. I would still rather get sick in the United States than any other country in the world, hands down over all the rest.
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Old 06-24-2014, 04:45 AM
 
Location: Gorgeous Scotland
4,123 posts, read 4,591,806 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by qwertyasdf View Post
The other countries are socialized. That's why the US ranks last. If I'm not mistaken. people in those other countries are taxed as much as 75%, if not more. I don't think most Americans really want that much tax coming out of their paycheck. US may rank last in that poll, but I don't think you'll find any better health care, or more advance health care than what we have in the United States. I would still rather get sick in the United States than any other country in the world, hands down over all the rest.
75%! Oh please. Total BS.
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Old 06-24-2014, 04:47 AM
 
273 posts, read 249,991 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Cnynrat View Post
I know that the U.S. ranks at or near the top in terms of 5 year survival rates for many common forms of cancer, which is a better measure of the quality of a country's health care system than life expectancy.
No, it's not a better measure. There are hundreds of conditions you could die from. Cancers are but a handful of those conditions. Americans use the cancer argument because it is something cherry-picked to make the American system look better. You have to look at OVERALL results, not just cancer survival rates.

Overall results are measured by things like life expectancy, diabetes rates, etc. Prevention is just as important as survival rates.
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Old 06-24-2014, 04:49 AM
 
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Originally Posted by PedroMartinez View Post
Because practically every "better system" involves me paying for the care of others.
But you pay for the cost of others with the American system as well. In fact, the American government pays more per capita for healthcare (ie., out of your taxes) than countries with universal healthcare.

Thus, if you had Canada's or Britain's systems, you would be paying less for the care of others than you are now.
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Old 06-24-2014, 04:55 AM
 
273 posts, read 249,991 times
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Originally Posted by PedroMartinez View Post
Actually, we weren't the ones who were complaining about changing everything about the system. We were the ones who thought that tweaking the current systems was good, but not griping about how it had to be dismantled to make it "fair", and now it's even worse.

Nobody was being turned away from hospitals. Nobody was dying in the streets because they couldn't get care.

Like I said, I'm all for a system that helps people in need. We had that system. Show me where people were being turned away from emergency rooms.
That's the problem with the American system. So many people have to resort to going to Emergency rooms because they don't have money or insurance. By the time you're going to emergency rooms, it's often too late. If they didn't have to resort to that, they might have been able to prevent the medical problem in the first place.

That's how it works here in the civilized world.
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Old 06-24-2014, 04:56 AM
 
Location: Gorgeous Scotland
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Originally Posted by DowntownDenizen View Post
But you pay for the cost of others with the American system as well. In fact, the American government pays more per capita for healthcare (ie., out of your taxes) than countries with universal healthcare.

Thus, if you had Canada's or Britain's systems, you would be paying less for the care of others than you are now.
Yes, I don't understand how Americans think they aren't already paying for the care of others. It's the most expensive system in the world because it's all about profit and ordering unnecessary tests, etc.

I had pretty good care before I moved away from the US as I had an HMO through my employer. But I did have lots of co-pays on doctor visits and meds and had to pay 10% of my hospital stay for surgery.

I'm glad I'll never have to worry about being an elderly person there who has to pay a huge amount of co-pays on meds. I love Scotland NHS!

And our tax rate is nowhere near 75%!
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Old 06-24-2014, 05:03 AM
 
273 posts, read 249,991 times
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Originally Posted by Labonte18 View Post
And if you take the motivation for profit out of the system.. Where does the motivation for improving the system come from?

Pharmaceuticals would be a good example. If I own a pharm company.. What is my motivation to invest in research and development of a new drug if profit is removed?
You are making no sense. There are pharmaceutical companies in every country. And they are all for profit.

The article is about the healthcare system. Not pharmaceutical companies.
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Old 06-24-2014, 05:07 AM
 
460 posts, read 394,170 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by qwertyasdf View Post
The other countries are socialized. That's why the US ranks last. If I'm not mistaken. people in those other countries are taxed as much as 75%, if not more. I don't think most Americans really want that much tax coming out of their paycheck. US may rank last in that poll, but I don't think you'll find any better health care, or more advance health care than what we have in the United States. I would still rather get sick in the United States than any other country in the world, hands down over all the rest.
It wasn't an opinion poll. The U.S. has good healthcare with subpar access and a cost which dwarfs every other nation on a per-procedure basis. I would rather get sick in any other well developed country than the U.S. I almost went bankrupt during law school (which would have made me ineligible for the loans necessary to finish) because I had to have my appendix out a month before my 1L year and was uninsured at the time (2010). The cost for a half night stay (they kicked me out while unable to walk the next morning!) and the surgery was over 20k. An appendectomy in most other nations is a fraction of that...

As to taxes? Well, other nations are generally taxed more than us, and have more generous social services across the board. That said, there is no nation in the developed world where aggregate tax receipts are over 52% of GDP, and Britain isn't even in the 40% range. The U.S. has the lowest overall tax burden, but that's hardly something to be proud of. We also have the widest income inequality of developed nations, an incarceration rate (per-capita) nearly 10x the average of developed nations, relative and absolute poverty rates far above other developed nations, are the only nation that doesn't guarantee paid maternity leave, the only nation that doesn't guarantee paid vacation, have by far the most expensive medical care (as noted) and yet we see doctors for primary care less often than nearly any other nation, lead the world in medical bankruptcies (as other nations, with the possible exception of Switzerland and some of Germany's system, don't have ANY), etc...
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Old 06-24-2014, 05:08 AM
 
261 posts, read 317,863 times
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Originally Posted by Ameriscot View Post
75%! Oh please. Total BS.
Oh please nothing. You may not agree but no need to be rude. "Total BS". You even have the gall capitalize the linitials in that foul word. What I wrote is not "Total BS".

If you think you're gonna change peoples way of thinking, you ain't gonna change too many hearts or minds with rudeness, I don't care how right or righteous you are or think you are.
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Old 06-24-2014, 05:11 AM
 
Location: Gorgeous Scotland
4,123 posts, read 4,591,806 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by qwertyasdf View Post
Oh please nothing. You may not agree but no need to be rude. "Total BS". You even have the gall capitalize the linitials in that foul word. What I wrote is not "Total BS".

If you think you're gonna change peoples way of thinking, you ain't gonna change too many hearts or minds with rudeness, I don't care how right or righteous you are or think you are.
Your post was obviously an exaggeration, therefore it is bs! Where did you come up with such a ridiculous figure?
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