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Old 06-26-2014, 05:32 AM
 
6 posts, read 4,786 times
Reputation: 20

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BBC News - Which country has the highest tax rate?

American Middle Class No Longer World's Richest - New York Times

US Middle Class No Longer Most Prosperous in the World - Telegraph

Those on low incomes or who have children can also apply for further tax credits in many European countries such as the UK.

Tax Credits UK

Tax Credit Calculator - UK

Furthermore the US has three levels of taxation Federal, State and Local and that's before you take in to consideration such things as the massive amounts of student debt and vast college fees, then you have the massive amounts paid in terms of health insurance. By the time you take all these things and many other US Taxes in to consideration the US is not that tax free.



Last edited by Old Bailey; 06-26-2014 at 05:49 AM..
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Old 06-26-2014, 06:37 AM
 
Location: Ubique
4,052 posts, read 2,931,408 times
Reputation: 2492
Quote:
Originally Posted by Leisesturm View Post
Ever hear about the Stockhom Syndrome? I mean... sheesh.. you've been butthurt by an insurance company yourself but you still encourage me to bend over for some degredation of my own... thank you, no.
No, I don't want you to do anything. But, don't come to me, take my and kids' Insurance away either. But you are, aren't you?


Quote:
Originally Posted by Leisesturm View Post
Your brother has been paying $220/mo for how long now? And if and when he needs medical insurance he has to first satisfy a $5K deductible. Then there are the inevitable uninsurable procedures... like anesthesia... ...
Since 2010. 3 annual visits are covered. One annual check up. Anesthesia is covered, just like everything in-hospital procedure, after the $ 5000, in case there is major event. In case he is unfortunate to need it, like a responsible adult, he has planned for it and will not go bankrupt.


Quote:
Originally Posted by Leisesturm View Post
And, no I could not afford even a 'low' premium like $220/mo
$ 220 though is for the couple in Connecticut, not just for him. For you alone, in Oregon, which should be cheaper than CT, I venture to say, you would pay $ 150 for similar policy.

If you make less than $ 25k in NY, you qualify for Medicaid, which we middle-class taxpayers pay for your free Healthcare. If you make more than that (2k net a month), you should be able to afford $ 150 for Health Insurance, unless you choose not to.

Yet, that is not enough. You want to destroy the healthcare for a family with kids, but for what?? When I was younger, there were times I didn't have coverage either. But I never thought "scorched earth" -- " fu... ck it, I don't have insurance, so I will go out there and destroy it also for others, family with kids, sick people, etc."

If you can't afford $ 150 a month for Health Insurance, then go deliver pizza a few times a week, and don't be destructive and sadistic to others.


Quote:
Originally Posted by Leisesturm View Post
I blame the U.S. for continuing a culture of passing the costs of everything to the Middle Class.
Go educate yourself before you attack your country. Go read the Forbes article I linked to. Europe's middle class and poor shoulder a much higher share of welfare than US.

Of course, I agree that US middle-class is getting squeezed. But, the solution is not to squeeze it more, like European countries are doing.
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Old 06-26-2014, 06:52 AM
 
Location: Ubique
4,052 posts, read 2,931,408 times
Reputation: 2492
Quote:
Originally Posted by Old Bailey View Post
This BBC article says that many European middle class pay more tax than US. Isn't that the point you are trying to refute?

I agree with my city's Marxist rag. Yet, what NY Times does not tell you, is that US middle-class has been decimated while Govt has exploded, while our Liberties, and Competitiveness have shrunk. Why? Do they, or don't they have a relationship?

In fact, US now lags some Welfare European countries in liberties, economic freedom, and competitiveness. Yes, we have this mirage of Europe, which is not the reality in Europe.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Old Bailey View Post
Furthermore the US has three levels of taxation Federal, State and Local and that's before you take in to consideration such things as the massive amounts of student debt and vast college fees
Student debt? It was the Govt policies that exploded this. Can you deny it?


Quote:
Originally Posted by Old Bailey View Post
then you have the massive amounts paid in terms of health insurance.
I explained this a few pages back. First, it is more than other developed countries, but not a lot more.

Secondly, our constricted, inefficient Insurance-based system has "fluff" costs, which cost us dearly.

Thirdly, what Marxist rags, like NY Times and Mother Jones never tell you, is that we have higher birth rates than most developed countries. Births are very expensive.

And there are other reasons.
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Old 06-26-2014, 06:56 AM
 
Location: Ubique
4,052 posts, read 2,931,408 times
Reputation: 2492
For lovers of Canadian Healthcare -- a few pages back I asked them to explain some things, yet I hear crickets. Again:

1- How do they explain the higher Health Income Gradient in Canada than US?

2- How do they explain that according to studies and surveys, US consumers like their Healthcare (pre-ACA) more than Canadians like theirs?

3- Why is Canada doing the Coefficient Reforms, and what is that going to cause to the Provinces?
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Old 06-26-2014, 07:00 AM
 
Location: Gorgeous Scotland
4,123 posts, read 4,577,439 times
Reputation: 3262
Quote:
Originally Posted by alphamale View Post
No we're not.
Yes, you are.
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Old 06-26-2014, 07:05 AM
 
Location: Ubique
4,052 posts, read 2,931,408 times
Reputation: 2492
I see that many commenters here link to Marxist rags. I would advise you to educate yourself. Go to the horse's mouth. Go read EU reports. Go read Canadian Govt's studies and reports. Go read NHS and British Govt predictions, advisories.

At various times, I have provided links to these Horse's mouths. Regardless of our own American fascination with a Europe's mirage, molded by rags, such as Mother Jones, NY Times, Huff Post, and Daily OWS emails, -- the reality is very different, often dark, and about to get ugly. No one tells you about institutionalized senior outmigration from Germany, Britain, etc. for example. Wait times statistics, rationing schemes, etc. etc.

Go hear from the horse's mouth, get educated with the facts and reality, and not delusion and mirage.
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Old 06-26-2014, 08:33 AM
 
8,306 posts, read 8,583,412 times
Reputation: 25929
Quote:
Originally Posted by Henry10 View Post
I see that many commenters here link to Marxist rags. I would advise you to educate yourself. Go to the horse's mouth. Go read EU reports. Go read Canadian Govt's studies and reports. Go read NHS and British Govt predictions, advisories.

At various times, I have provided links to these Horse's mouths. Regardless of our own American fascination with a Europe's mirage, molded by rags, such as Mother Jones, NY Times, Huff Post, and Daily OWS emails, -- the reality is very different, often dark, and about to get ugly. No one tells you about institutionalized senior outmigration from Germany, Britain, etc. for example. Wait times statistics, rationing schemes, etc. etc.

Go hear from the horse's mouth, get educated with the facts and reality, and not delusion and mirage.
I could respond to you with data that rejects many of the points you made. Surveys show that citizens of many countries are more satisfied with their health care systems than Americans are.

I'm choosing not to respond though.

When you refer to newspapers like the "New York Times" as a "Marxist rag", you put yourself out in deep right field. There really is no basis for conversing further about this subject. You have your mind hopelessly made up and aren't going to be convinced of anything.

One thing I notice all the time though. Right wingers very seldom cite article or studies. Instead they talk about "a friend they know" or refer to things that are "common knowledge".

Americans don't want or need lectures about the "evils of socialism". Its an insult to our intelligence. What we want is a health care system that doesn't shut millions away from services because of its cost. How we get there is becoming unimportant.
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Old 06-26-2014, 10:06 AM
 
Location: Portland, OR
9,594 posts, read 9,427,321 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Henry10 View Post
No, I don't want you to do anything. But, don't come to me, take my and kids' Insurance away either. But you are, aren't you?
I already told you, its not insurance. It is a proxy payer system where you designate an incorporated entity to pay for medical procedures on your behalf. I may be a raving Liberal but I don't agree with Obamacare. But Obama doesn't want your stupid insurance. Where did you hear that? You couldn't possibly fall into that group of people that lost their policies (now reinstated) because they weren't really legal or adequate or in anyway benefited the policy holder. Ingrate. You should be glad Obama made sure there were at least minimum standards for what constituted "insurance". Instead you try to tell me with a straight face about your "brother" ____ing out $220/mo. for "insurance" that won't kick in for anything less than a major medical crisis. What does he do the rest of the time???


Quote:
Originally Posted by Henry10 View Post
$ 220 though is for the couple in Connecticut, not just for him. For you alone, in Oregon, which should be cheaper than CT, I venture to say, you would pay $ 150 for similar policy.

Big freaking whoop. $150/mo. I can find a lot better use for $150/mo than to mail it off to some "insurance" company worth billions. For which I get absolutely jack.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Henry10 View Post
If you make less than $ 25k in NY, you qualify for Medicaid, which we middle-class taxpayers pay for your free Healthcare. If you make more than that (2k net a month), you should be able to afford $ 150 for Health Insurance, unless you choose not to.

Yet, that is not enough. You want to destroy the healthcare for a family with kids, but for what?? When I was younger, there were times I didn't have coverage either. But I never thought "scorched earth" -- " fu... ck it, I don't have insurance, so I will go out there and destroy it also for others, family with kids, sick people, etc."
I have a friend. They worked for 17 years in a NY bureaucracy. You may know that African Americans don't exactly have a whole lot of choice who they work for? So this friend was getting their $35K/yr. and as they lived with another adult in a similar situation they were doing all right. Then there was a change in management. A new supervisor took over the unit and I suppose it was major understatement to say that there was negative simpatico between them and the new boss. They quit after a few months of the torture. After 6 months without a job things were getting tight. So they went back to school and got a certificate in a niche specialty of their skill-set. The very next postion paid in the 80K range and eight years later they are making over six figures and still have 15 or so years till retirement. They are very grateful to that supervisor from hell who made them start all over.

Someday you will thank people like me who agitated for a UHC that is more like UHC is implemented in every other place it is implemented. You don't have insurance. You are not protected from bankruptcy... your brother maybe... snort... you just think that after a lifetime of spouting right wing nonsense you will lose street cred if you start thinking and speaking more sensibly. Be at peace Henry10. Obama does not want your guns and he does not want your "insurance". Neither do I. But please note: this thread was not started by me. I have not even posted more than five or so times in the over 300 posts here. MANY people do not think the U.S. offers health outcomes commensurate with the cost of care! You can ignore the one or the few as being nut jobs, what do you say when there are millions clamoring for change? How do you disregard the collective opinion of millions? I get that your 1% masters can do it. How do YOU do it?

H
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Old 06-26-2014, 12:14 PM
 
Location: Myrtle Creek, Oregon
11,050 posts, read 11,460,740 times
Reputation: 17206
Quote:
Originally Posted by DowntownDenizen View Post
You are making no sense. There are pharmaceutical companies in every country. And they are all for profit.

The article is about the healthcare system. Not pharmaceutical companies.
Did you forget that Congress made it illegal for us to go to Canada to get our prescriptions filled? It sure cut the legs out from under medical tourism.
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Old 06-26-2014, 12:25 PM
 
Location: Myrtle Creek, Oregon
11,050 posts, read 11,460,740 times
Reputation: 17206
Quote:
Originally Posted by qwertyasdf View Post
I heard it on the radio news this afternoon. It was told like it was factual. And my post is not total bs because I also said I would rather get sick in the US than anywhere else in the world. Now, I know for sure that's a fact, so therefore my post was not "total" bs, as you, so all-knowingly and self-assuredly claim.
That was not news, it was a propaganda program disguised as news. Shows like that have been banned in Canada because it's illegal to intentionally lie on a quasi-news show there.

FYI, including all local taxes, the maximum personal tax rate in Germany, which is the most heavily taxed country in the EU, is 42%. You may notice that this is lower than the US maximum tax rate. Thanks to the VAT, businesses pay a much higher tax rate than they do in the USA.
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