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Old 06-30-2014, 03:57 PM
 
Location: Bretagne, FRANCE
192 posts, read 270,100 times
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Ameriscot: I used to live in beautiful, wonderful Glasgow. The healthcare there was 'pure deid brilliant'. (So was everything else.)
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Old 06-30-2014, 04:10 PM
 
Location: Gorgeous Scotland
4,095 posts, read 5,546,625 times
Reputation: 3351
Quote:
Originally Posted by Juliette La Bretonne View Post
Ameriscot: I used to live in beautiful, wonderful Glasgow. The healthcare there was 'pure deid brilliant'. (So was everything else.)
Aye! I'm doon the water from Glasgow but go to the city often. Brand new huge and amazing hospital being built! Southern General.
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Old 06-30-2014, 04:15 PM
 
Location: Vallejo
21,876 posts, read 25,146,349 times
Reputation: 19074
Quote:
Originally Posted by Juliette La Bretonne View Post
Bull-sh-it. No one is taxed at 75%, not even French high-earners like me.
Actually, yes, they are. Effective rate is probably lower because not all the income is taxed at that rate, but 75% is the highest rate in France. Apparently you just don't earn enough to get hit by it or aren't aware that you're being hit by it since it happens indirectly.
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Old 06-30-2014, 06:59 PM
 
16,590 posts, read 8,610,160 times
Reputation: 19411
Quote:
Originally Posted by i_love_autumn View Post
The latest Commonwealth report on health care ranks the US last among 11 countries — again.
The latest look at the U.S. health care system compared to other rich countries shows — yet again — that the United States comes in dead last.

No surprise here.

We're Last! Again! U.S. Health Care Ranks Poorly - NBC News
No surprise that the Commonwealth Fund which is left wing and supports universal healthcare would come to such conclusions.
I wonder if you would equally post a link to a conservative organization that opposed socialized medicine and ended it with "no surprise here"?
All one needs to read is their mission statement or other paragraphs like;

"Some politicians have held up other countries’ health systems as examples of what they don’t want for the U.S., but the report finds countries with nationalized medical systems outperform the U.S. on all the measures."

Talk about biased reporting. While some countries do have some better aspects to their systems, they also are flawed and not as good as ours in others. A prime example is how long those in the UK have to wait for doctor visits and if they need a significant pprocedure they can wait months to get it. that is hardly an example of outperforming the USA.
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Old 06-30-2014, 07:04 PM
 
14,400 posts, read 14,306,076 times
Reputation: 45727
Quote:
Originally Posted by Vector1 View Post
No surprise that the Commonwealth Fund which is left wing and supports universal healthcare would come to such conclusions.
I wonder if you would equally post a link to a conservative organization that opposed socialized medicine and ended it with "no surprise here"?
All one needs to read is their mission statement or other paragraphs like
;

"Some politicians have held up other countries’ health systems as examples of what they don’t want for the U.S., but the report finds countries with nationalized medical systems outperform the U.S. on all the measures."

Talk about biased reporting. While some countries do have some better aspects to their systems, they also are flawed and not as good as ours in others. A prime example is how long those in the UK have to wait for doctor visits and if they need a significant pprocedure they can wait months to get it. that is hardly an example of outperforming the USA.
What's really no surprise is to see the debating style of those who oppose universal health care. Same old, same old. You reject an endless list of studies that show the deficiencies in American health care while never offering any studies that show the opposite.

OK, guys here's a challenge. Show me a list of all studies that show that American health care is the best system in the world. I don't mean for heart transplants or for advanced cancer treatment. I mean "overall". In terms of treating all medical conditions, let's see your proof of where the medical system in this country ranks among all the nations.

The real problem is that your against the idea of universal health care. So, it doesn't matter what the studies show.
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Old 06-30-2014, 09:16 PM
 
Location: Ubique
4,317 posts, read 4,206,586 times
Reputation: 2822
Here is an unbiased Study of comparing Canadian and American Healthcare (pre-ACA):

1- More people report themselves to be in excellent health in the U.S.

2- Both countries score the same on overall health index and pain indicator.

3- Americans have a higher incidence of depression.

4- Women's screenings for Mammograms, Pap-Smear: 86% of US women vs 73% of Canadian Women have had mammograms.

5- US has more MRIs and CT Scanners per capita.

6- US is more successful in detecting and curing cancer.

7- Unmet needs is 11% in Canada and 14% in US. In Canada, primary cause for unmet needs is waiting times. For US it is cost.

8- Americans are more likely to report that they are fully satisfied with the health services they have received and to rank the quality of care as excellent.

9- Surprisingly, they find that the health-income gradient is actually more prominent in Canada than in the U.S.

As conclusion Report states that:

"The authors conclude that while it is commonly supposed that a single-payer, publicly-funded system would deliver better health out-comes and distribute health resources more fairly than a multi-payer system with a large private component, their study does not provide support for this view."

Comparing the U.S. and Canadian Health Care Systems

About the source, which liberals will discard, as un-vetted by NBC, Mother Jones, and Huffington Post:

The National Bureau of Economic Research (NBER) is an American private nonprofit research organization "committed to undertaking and disseminating unbiased economic research among public policymakers, business professionals, and the academic community."[1] The NBER is well known for providing start and end dates for recessions in the United States.

The NBER is the largest economics research organization in the United States.[2] Many of the American winners of the Nobel Memorial Prize in Economic Sciences were NBER Research Associates. Many of the Chairmen of the Council of Economic Advisers have also been NBER Research Associates, including the former NBER President and Harvard Professor, Martin Feldstein.


The NBER's current President and CEO is Professor James M. Poterba of MIT.
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Old 06-30-2014, 10:48 PM
 
Location: Ubique
4,317 posts, read 4,206,586 times
Reputation: 2822
And there is more...

Care Rationing in Germany, a Socialized Healthcare System on the verge of collapse -- The Voters Must Decide: Stop Rationing Health Care!

Swiss Health Rationing -- http://www.swissinfo.ch/eng/health-r...unch/32474424:

From the report:

"The Swiss healthcare system faces two major challenges. First, costs are steadily increasing and already around one third of the Swiss population needs financial aid to pay their health insurance bills.


The other concern is the lack of healthcare personnel trained in Switzerland. There are, for example, currently only 22.1 new doctors every year joining the workforce for 1,000 practising physicians, a figure that would have to be 50 per cent higher just to maintain current staffing levels.


These factors would tend to encourage some form of medical rationing. But few doctors are prepared to entertain the idea openly, even if some of them admit that de facto rationing is already taking place simply because of a lack of staff."

Britain:

How the UK rations health care | Public Radio International


"Today, 95 percent of Britons get their care through the government-run program. In order to provide care to everyone, the government says it must place limits on the care it provides. It must ration.

Limits to Care


"We have a limited budget for health care, voted by Parliament every year, and we have to live within our means," said Michael Rawlins, chairman of a government agency called the National Institute for Health and Clinical Excellence (NICE)."


"Inhumane Deportation" of seniors to Eastern Europe and Asia: Germany 'exporting' old and sick to foreign care homes | World news | theguardian.com



From this UK article The Impact of an Ageing Population on the Economy | Economics Help

"Government Responses to an Ageing Population

  1. Increase participation rate. Make it easier for people past 65 to keep working.
  2. Raise the retirement age. The government have already proposed an increase to 67. The retirement age could automatically be linked to life expectancy.
  3. Increase the importance of the private sector in providing pensions and health care. However this may cause increased inequality if people can’t afford private pensions.
  4. Increase tax to pay for pension costs. But, many governments already have limited budgets.
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Old 06-30-2014, 11:30 PM
 
Location: Ubique
4,317 posts, read 4,206,586 times
Reputation: 2822
Last thing for now -- I would like to see how European countries will parade their UHC systems, when we pull our defense dollars from Europe, and let them spend their own money.

With a rapidly aging society, anemic GDP growth, dramatic increases on their own military. Let's see then how their UHC fares.

No wonder Netherlands king says welfare era is over, and Danes are talking about the age-integrated society (read: work till you die).
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Old 07-01-2014, 02:11 AM
 
Location: Dublin, CA
3,807 posts, read 4,275,649 times
Reputation: 3984
Quote:
Originally Posted by coffeendonuts View Post
Yes, we should have universal healthcare and even extend the healthcare to illegal aliens. How inhumane are we?
You pay for it. You write the checks to pay for this "universal healthcare." You won't. As a typical, lying, hypocritical socialist in this country. None of you will. You want all these great programs, so long as someone else pays for them and, moreover, YOU benefit from them.

Pay for it yourself or shut up.
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Old 07-01-2014, 12:00 PM
 
Location: Annandale, VA
5,094 posts, read 5,174,352 times
Reputation: 4233
This article is baloney. How many from those "better" systems died trying to ACCESS treatment and where not counted in the survey????
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