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Old 09-02-2014, 08:55 AM
 
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People with Ebola who get supportive care early enough seem to be doing pretty well and the death rate is, what, about 60 percent for all in the current outbreak? No evidence that the experimental medication made the difference for those two who survived (and one African doctor who got it didn't survive. Hardly a fair test).

Of course there aren't "cures for every disease." Who one earth would really believe that?
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Old 09-02-2014, 06:51 PM
 
Location: Floyd Co, VA
3,311 posts, read 4,857,193 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by brightdoglover View Post
People with Ebola who get supportive care early enough seem to be doing pretty well and the death rate is, what, about 60 percent for all in the current outbreak? No evidence that the experimental medication made the difference for those two who survived (and one African doctor who got it didn't survive. Hardly a fair test).
Here is what Doctors Without Borders had to say to the United Nations today: (it ain't looking good)

United Nations Special Briefing on Ebola | MSF USA

and this first person account of someone there:

http://www.doctorswithoutborders.org...-spray-bottles
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Old 09-02-2014, 09:33 PM
 
Location: New Mexico
3,493 posts, read 1,433,123 times
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Default The writing on the wall

Quote:
Originally Posted by Pinealley View Post
Kinda weird that the Ebola Virus, comes up all of a suddenly at this time during this batch of weapons of- err, vaccines. Out of all times it's this time period, in history lol. OK

Yeah, and Nobel thought that dynamite made warfare too destructive, and Oppenheimer and the crew at Los Alamos and throughout the Manhattan Engineering Project came to think that nukes made warfare too final.

Yes, we could put an end - or near enough - to the incursion of Ebola, Marburg, etc. viral diseases. It would mean we would no longer go into jungles, unexplored forests, isolated populations, etc. to find ores, biologics, drugs, raw materials of various sorts - to exploit for our industrial technic society. But of course, that's not going to happen.

Any more than hippos, elephants, rhinos, etc. can be saved. As long as there's an extraordinarily high financial/cultural value placed on their horns, their days are numbered. We can save representative DNA samples, and perhaps some day we can reconstitute them. Same for tigers, leopards, cheetahs, the great apes - pass in review, friends.

We'll be lucky to transition off red meat to some other protein source before we drive the majority of the wild/domesticated meat animals, fish, ocean mammals, birds to oblivion. I recall a small prophetic novel, Doctor Rat, by Kotzwinkle?

Time to get cracking.
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Old 09-09-2014, 10:56 PM
 
784 posts, read 1,635,784 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by southwest88 View Post
Yeah, and Nobel thought that dynamite made warfare too destructive, and Oppenheimer and the crew at Los Alamos and throughout the Manhattan Engineering Project came to think that nukes made warfare too final.

Yes, we could put an end - or near enough - to the incursion of Ebola, Marburg, etc. viral diseases. It would mean we would no longer go into jungles, unexplored forests, isolated populations, etc. to find ores, biologics, drugs, raw materials of various sorts - to exploit for our industrial technic society. But of course, that's not going to happen.

Any more than hippos, elephants, rhinos, etc. can be saved. As long as there's an extraordinarily high financial/cultural value placed on their horns, their days are numbered. We can save representative DNA samples, and perhaps some day we can reconstitute them. Same for tigers, leopards, cheetahs, the great apes - pass in review, friends.

We'll be lucky to transition off red meat to some other protein source before we drive the majority of the wild/domesticated meat animals, fish, ocean mammals, birds to oblivion. I recall a small prophetic novel, Doctor Rat, by Kotzwinkle?

Time to get cracking.
considering the overwhelming majority of red meat sold and eaten is this country is NOT wild game, I highly doubt us transitioning off red meat will do ANYTHING to differ the mammal population roaming the country.

You do what you gotta do, But i'm going to enjoy a steak and there's no reason to look down on someone for their personal dietary choices.
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Old 09-10-2014, 02:46 PM
 
Location: Las Vegas, NV
2,761 posts, read 2,260,513 times
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Old 09-16-2014, 02:45 AM
 
Location: Big Island of Hawaii & HOT BuOYS Sailing Vessel
4,757 posts, read 1,737,461 times
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Default Yes you can catch Ebola on an airplane

Please learn from mistakes below. A whole plane load must be quarantined in hotel till cleared

On July 20, 2014 a group of 7 Liberians arrived at Lagos airport. The trip from Monrovia involved 2 flights and 1 stopover. One of the 7 in this group should not have been there. He was supposed to be in isolation. He was infected with the Ebola virus. His name was Patrick Oliver Sawyer and he had a dual Liberian-American citizenship. Sawyer's sister had died just 12 days earlier from the disease. Sawyer had taken her to the hospital. Hospital staff say he failed to follow safety procedure. The hospital believe his actions help cause the infections and deaths of 6 staff members. [1] [2] [3] [4]

Sawyer was supposed to remain in isolation for at least 21 days. However, after only 12 days, he was at the Monrovia airport and already ill. Liberia's Finance Minister had granted approval for Sawyer to go with the 6 other Liberians to a conference in Calabar Nigeria. The minister was not aware Sawyer was ill or in isolation.[5]

The 7 Liberians were going to a conference of a 15-member nation group called ECOWAS . It was being held in Calabar. That city is 750 km away from Lagos. One more flight was necessary to get there.

Sawyer was a "burly" man. When Sawyer arrived he was weak after bouts of vomitting and diahorea. Five airport handlers and the other Liberians helped Sawyer into a car and he was taken to First Consultants Hospital. Sawyer denied being around anyone that suffered from the disease. No special precautions were taken on his initial examination. The doctor that admitted him into the hospital listed him as a potential malaria case. [6] Sawyer asked to be tested for malaria and HIV.

On July 21, 2014 Sawyers condition did not improve, new tests were made.

Early July 22, 2014 an ECOWAS official came to the hospital so Sawyer could catch the connecting flight to Calabar. [7] The official was told he was too ill to travel. However, a senior official at the conference in Calabar confirmed the other 6 made it to Calabar.


On July 23, 2014 Liberia attempted to recall the 7. Many calls came into the hospital.

On July 25, Patrick Sawyer died in the hospital and was found by Dr. Igonon. Her personal account was delayed owing to the fact she was fighting an infection from Sawyer.

On the afternoon of August 19, 2014 Physician Ameyo Adadevoh, who realized Sawyer was not truthful, died from the Ebola virus disease and left behind her little sister who contracted the same disease from her.

On August 22, 2014 a doctor in Harcourt, 150 km from Calabar died from the Ebola Virus disease. He was secretely treating a Nigerian representative of ECOWAS now facing manslaughter charges.

[8].

Jump ^ Sawyer taken on arrival to hospital, All Africa, August 20, 2014
Jump ^ Precise number contacts unkown, Daily Mail
Jump ^ Victims may sure, This Day Live
Jump ^ Front Page Africa, author Rodney D. Sieh, July 31, 2014
Jump ^ Femi Fani-Kayode: Ameyo Adadevoh and the Ebola conspiracy - DailyPost Nigeria Physician Ameyo Adadevoh: Ebola, Nigerian Daily Post, date August 24, 2014]
Jump ^ [ Photo: Ebola: Second doctor infected by Patrick Sawyer survives: Read her full story | Naija.io Admittance doctor story as told by Dr. Ada Igonon, September 15, 2014]
Jump ^ [Toyeen B's World: Photo: Ebola: Second doctor infected by Patrick Sawyer survives: Read her full story Full report Dr. Ada Igonon
Jump ^ Diplomat faces charges, Nigeria Daily Post, August 31, 2008
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Old 09-16-2014, 11:12 AM
 
Location: Portland, OR
9,601 posts, read 9,448,188 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by pbmaise View Post
Please learn from mistakes below. A whole plane load must be quarantined in hotel till cleared
WTF? Learn what? That diplomats often throw their weight around and put innocents in harms way? don't board an aircraft if you suspect that a diplomat is on it who has bullied TSA into allowing him to fly while infectious? Just what was the point of this post exactly?
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Old 09-16-2014, 11:27 AM
 
Location: Portland, OR
9,601 posts, read 9,448,188 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by SobreTodo View Post
Sounds suspect. I wouldn't be surprised if the same people that treat or cure these diseases are the ones that put it out themselves. The medical industry is always trying to experiment and make money by any means necessary.

There are cures for every disease. Don't let propaganda fool you otherwise.
Actually there are very few cures for any disease. Big Pharma is as bad as you think but for totally the wrong reason. There is no need for B.P. to manufacture disease and incubate populations with it. They make TONS of money making palliate agents for a variety of ailments and maladies that afflict people with disposable income or access to proxy payer (insurance) systems. Real disease they don't concern themselves with. Vaccines are not cures. Even the lauded Polio vaccine was not a cure. It wouldn't actually do much for someone who already had the disease. Neither will an Ebola vaccine.

H
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Old 09-16-2014, 11:31 AM
 
Location: Portland, OR
9,601 posts, read 9,448,188 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Hopes View Post
Since Eboli has such a high speedy death rate, it essentially burns itself out if it's contained. They should close all the borders and airports and let it do it's thing. As inhumane as it sounds, less people will die.
They are doing exactly that. We aren't talking about isolated East African villages, however. Neither are we talking about the hyper-efficient 90% kill rate of the older Ebola Zaire. One of the affected countries has a population of 6M. You try containing that many people when they realize whats afoot!
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Old 09-16-2014, 11:48 AM
 
Location: Type 0.7 Kardashev
10,577 posts, read 6,853,394 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Leisesturm View Post
They are doing exactly that. We aren't talking about isolated East African villages, however. Neither are we talking about the hyper-efficient 90% kill rate of the older Ebola Zaire. One of the affected countries has a population of 6M. You try containing that many people when they realize whats afoot!
Indeed. The three main countries involved in the outbreak are Guinea, Sierra Leone and Liberia. The land borders of Guinea and Sierra Leone, excluding the borders with each other and Liberia (which only has land borders with the other two countries) exceeds 2000 miles. And these are not controlled borders - they're often unmarked, and span rainforest, mountains, and sprawling wetlands. Neither these countries nor those bordering them possess the military capacity to seal these borders to any great degree, to say nothing of the several hundred miles of coast between these countries.

I'm not particularlty worried about this epidemic reaching the West. The virus itself might, but the primary problem in Africa is the lack of a medical infrastructure required to isolate these outbreaks early on.

However, back to Africa - the situation there is rapidly becoming catastrophic.
http://www.nytimes.com/2014/09/13/world/africa/us-scientists-see-long-fight-against-ebola.html?_r=0

And while the modern medical industry of Western countries such as in Europe and North America probably protects those places from a pandemic, most of Africa, much of the Middle East and Asia, and to a lesser extent Latin America remains vulnerable to seeing widespread outbreaks as increasing numbers of infected by as-yet-not-symptomic people flee West Africa.

The number of cases and deaths is probably in its infancy. The only question seems to be whether it will be brought under control before they reach into six or seven figures or beyond. And even if the West remains free of this plague, the potential global political and economic repercussions are very real.
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