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banjomike: My marriage has lasted thus far because of the kids.
I got together with my husband when I was 18 and he was 29. I was the more mature one. I continued to be that way...I got more mature, he pretty much stayed the same. Only perhaps he made some better decisions with my guidance than he did with his prior 2 wives. I got pregnant at 19 and again 2.5 years later. We remained unmarried but faithfully committed for 10 years before we finally got hitched. We were getting large tax incentives for not being technically married. But when he went back into the military...well, the more important thing to me was that he WANTED very badly for us to be wed. It wasn't a big thing to me, because we were solid, not going anywhere, why throw away the tax refund for a piece of paper? But I as it was a very meaningful thing to him, I wasn't letting him go off to Iraq without it. So we did the courthouse thing. Well, in practical terms, there are many benefits to being a married soldier. He was allowed housing off post (not in barracks) and we got more money and security in case he died "over there." The main reason he went back in (aside from him really wanting to because he thought it was meaningful) was that he could not hang in civilian jobs. He'd do the job really well, but without the strict discipline of the military rank structure, he'd run his mouth and make everyone mad and get fired. So he went back in hoping to get his 20 and retire...but he didn't make it that long.
Now he's out. He's a disabled vet, his back is messed up. I'm 35 and he's 47 and our kids are teenagers. I'm struggling to retain my stubborn patience with him and with us. He is self-medicating, and not working, and not doing an adequate job of keeping our household in order either. I have to work overtime to keep us afloat financially, and do some of the housework, and all of the grocery (and Christmas) shopping, which I hate by the way (shopping) and I have to maintain our budget and he wants to be able to take his naps and play his games and host large groups of his friends every single weekend. Meanwhile, I have many friends all over the country...my idea of happiness isn't sitting in my basement all the time, it's getting OUT and meeting people and doing things. But that is costly. And when I bring up the fact that our budget is tight and we all need to cut back, he says I'm going to have to make some sacrifices...but he still expects everything he wants to fall into his lap. Really, we spend a roughly equivalent amount of money...he spends small but frequent, I spend frugally except when I want to travel. But who is expected to cut back? I am. He's been unemployed for a year and it has become clear that he expects to never have to work again. Retired at age 46 on account of a sore back, which while I'm sure it hurts, doesn't stop him from doing things he WANTS to do. Fact is, he doesn't like me having my own friends. He is jealous when I give anyone but him or his friends my attention. He is terrified that I'll cheat even though I never have. For me though it's a point of stubbornness...if/when I walk, I want him to know it wasn't because a competing male came along and moved this piece off the board. It was because I have feet and legs and a mind of my own.
I've kept it going through some really hard times before. Because our kids are (in my belief) better off with two parents, even if one of them sometimes provides an example of what not to do. At this point, they are 15 and 13, and they'll be adults before long. Sometimes I think I'll stay with my guy for the rest of his life but more often I think I'll leave once the kids are grown. I can definitely make any kind of sacrifices for them...but I don't feel that I should sacrifice the rest of my life for him. The hard part is that he is so, so dependent that I'm not sure he can get by without me. He's really like an oversized child. I have no idea how he's going to get by with me gone.
Thing is...when we first met, I didn't really want a permanent relationship. I assumed it would be just another boyfriend who would eventually leave. He, on the other hand, clung for dear life and wouldn't let go. The accidental conception of our first son (protection failed) is what has kept me with him. He fell in love with me...I didn't fall in love with him.
If I ever do leave him, I will be very sure not to ever let a man develop serious feelings for me ever again. I'll be done. DONE.
So yeah there are as many different reasons and stories as there are people, I'd imagine.
Fact is, he doesn't like me having my own friends. He is jealous when I give anyone but him or his friends my attention. He is terrified that I'll cheat even though I never have. For me though it's a point of stubbornness...if/when I walk, I want him to know it wasn't because a competing male came along and moved this piece off the board. It was because I have feet and legs and a mind of my own.
That right there is the perfect example of a controlling man.
That right there is the perfect example of a controlling man.
He would be a controlling man if he were strong enough. As it is, I do what I want anyways. I do not let him thwart me. But his insecurity costs him a lot of my respect. I even offer to introduce him so that, as his friends have become our friends, so can mine. He doesn't want to meet them. He refuses to entertain the notion.
He has learned to cope with me going off on my own without too much of a hissy fit involved anymore...but it is always clear that he's not happy about it. He tries to turn it into this concern over my safety...but the reality is, I've never needed him to make me feel safe, and that fact hurts him. He wants to be all I need...and I don't really need him at all.
Honestly it's sad, it's sad for him, sad for me. Sometimes I think that neither of us is truly right or wrong, we are just horribly, horribly incompatible. He needs someone who will be happy with him as the center of her universe, and I don't need anyone at all.
Just as young people have really unrealistic expectations of what having a baby will do to their lives, they have very unrealistic notions of what it will be like to tie themselves to another person until death, presumably many decades.
When a young couple (straight or gay) is in love, often for the first time in their lives, and they only see the romantic side of that experience. The euphoria, the sexual desire, the imaginary future of their bliss. Why wouldn't they wish to seal that with promises of lifetime commitment and a contract? The young have often never faced many serious life problems before: poverty, illness, children with serious problems, jobs they hate, family disagreements, etc. Those are just things that happen to other people and, in the off chance they occur, surely they can be overcome by the force of their love.
They simply don't believe that their great passion will ever dissipate and their partner might become someone they wonder if they ever knew. They don't imagine that their partner will stray from their vows. Denial is human nature. And our culture doesn't do much to infuse any reality into the romance that leads to marriage. From childhood people read fairy tales, watch Hollywood movies, and are fed a steady diet of TV shows that indicate that love can conquer all. Omnia vincit amor — even the Romans believed it.
When the reality hits, they feel betrayed and they can't overcome their anger. They don't wish to invest any more of their future with the person they think "tricked" them. Not to mention, society gives people pretty easy outs today in terms of dissolving marriages. It's not like the old days where marriages represented the joining of families and/or wealth, infidelity had to be proven, or there was tremendous social stigma to being divorced.
There's also quite a bit of truth to the notion that woman fall in love thinking they can fix any shortcomings their beloved might have and men think the woman they fall in love with will never change mentally, spiritually, or physically. So both parties are in for a rude awakening. One many don't have the life skills to address.
I did not read the 8+ pages of replies but my initial response is that a good number of the Gen-X and Gen-Y population have not seen healthy relationships growing up. When two broken people come together, the likelihood of positive results are low. Expectations of spouses may not be articulated well or even reasonable.
I don't condone any person staying in an unhealthy relationship; at the same time, perhaps we give up on one another too easy.
I did not read the 8+ pages of replies but my initial response is that a good number of the Gen-X and Gen-Y population have not seen healthy relationships growing up. When two broken people come together, the likelihood of positive results are low. Expectations of spouses may not be articulated well or even reasonable.
I don't condone any person staying in an unhealthy relationship; at the same time, perhaps we give up on one another too easy.
How many kids from any generation saw healthy relationships growing up?
Low divorce rates do not mean happy marriages.
Dysfunctional relationships are not a modern invention, and there is a body of research showing that growing up with happily divorced parents is better than growing up with unhappily married ones.
I definitely agree with your final point, though.
Many teenagers today are self centered because they assume all their social media services resolves around them and they have to be the center of it all.
Someone like that will never be able to have a healthy relationship because of their narcissist behavior. What's bad is a lot of teenagers today behave that way.
I think it is economics...this was from the UK....
Keep in mind that the Euro zone has a higher level of under 30 unemployment than even the US..
And Greece has almost the majority of 20 somethings unemployed, which is insane, at 49%...Portugal 43%.....
It's all economics, the main cause of divorces in that age group, as well as bankrupcies in all age groups...
Per countries such as Greece, where half of the 20 somethings are literally not working, obviously marriage
not helping anyone..the poor can't help the poor.....
There, also, are few 20 something men doing very well, with marketable skills, in the UK and the areas I mentioned..
In that case, sadly, better for most 20 somethings to just stay single and hook up at most....marriage a meaningless
comcept for those who can barely support themselves alone..
banjomike: My marriage has lasted thus far because of the kids.
I got together with my husband when I was 18 and he was 29. I was the more mature one. I continued to be that way...I got more mature, he pretty much stayed the same. Only perhaps he made some better decisions with my guidance than he did with his prior 2 wives. I got pregnant at 19 and again 2.5 years later. We remained unmarried but faithfully committed for 10 years before we finally got hitched. We were getting large tax incentives for not being technically married. But when he went back into the military...well, the more important thing to me was that he WANTED very badly for us to be wed. It wasn't a big thing to me, because we were solid, not going anywhere, why throw away the tax refund for a piece of paper? But I as it was a very meaningful thing to him, I wasn't letting him go off to Iraq without it. So we did the courthouse thing. Well, in practical terms, there are many benefits to being a married soldier. He was allowed housing off post (not in barracks) and we got more money and security in case he died "over there." The main reason he went back in (aside from him really wanting to because he thought it was meaningful) was that he could not hang in civilian jobs. He'd do the job really well, but without the strict discipline of the military rank structure, he'd run his mouth and make everyone mad and get fired. So he went back in hoping to get his 20 and retire...but he didn't make it that long.
Now he's out. He's a disabled vet, his back is messed up. I'm 35 and he's 47 and our kids are teenagers. I'm struggling to retain my stubborn patience with him and with us. He is self-medicating, and not working, and not doing an adequate job of keeping our household in order either. I have to work overtime to keep us afloat financially, and do some of the housework, and all of the grocery (and Christmas) shopping, which I hate by the way (shopping) and I have to maintain our budget and he wants to be able to take his naps and play his games and host large groups of his friends every single weekend. Meanwhile, I have many friends all over the country...my idea of happiness isn't sitting in my basement all the time, it's getting OUT and meeting people and doing things. But that is costly. And when I bring up the fact that our budget is tight and we all need to cut back, he says I'm going to have to make some sacrifices...but he still expects everything he wants to fall into his lap. Really, we spend a roughly equivalent amount of money...he spends small but frequent, I spend frugally except when I want to travel. But who is expected to cut back? I am. He's been unemployed for a year and it has become clear that he expects to never have to work again. Retired at age 46 on account of a sore back, which while I'm sure it hurts, doesn't stop him from doing things he WANTS to do. Fact is, he doesn't like me having my own friends. He is jealous when I give anyone but him or his friends my attention. He is terrified that I'll cheat even though I never have. For me though it's a point of stubbornness...if/when I walk, I want him to know it wasn't because a competing male came along and moved this piece off the board. It was because I have feet and legs and a mind of my own.
I've kept it going through some really hard times before. Because our kids are (in my belief) better off with two parents, even if one of them sometimes provides an example of what not to do. At this point, they are 15 and 13, and they'll be adults before long. Sometimes I think I'll stay with my guy for the rest of his life but more often I think I'll leave once the kids are grown. I can definitely make any kind of sacrifices for them...but I don't feel that I should sacrifice the rest of my life for him. The hard part is that he is so, so dependent that I'm not sure he can get by without me. He's really like an oversized child. I have no idea how he's going to get by with me gone.
Thing is...when we first met, I didn't really want a permanent relationship. I assumed it would be just another boyfriend who would eventually leave. He, on the other hand, clung for dear life and wouldn't let go. The accidental conception of our first son (protection failed) is what has kept me with him. He fell in love with me...I didn't fall in love with him.
If I ever do leave him, I will be very sure not to ever let a man develop serious feelings for me ever again. I'll be done. DONE.
So yeah there are as many different reasons and stories as there are people, I'd imagine.
That's quite a story.....
I'm saddened that you are stuck in this, however, if I can add anything without knowing anything at all about both of you, I would say that no one forced this marriage on you, even with the first child.
Having a child together as a reason for marriage is a bad idea for any age, older adults as well.....that is a bound to fail thing, unless you can find a solid basis in common and grow in love over the years. Sounds like both of you have grown, but apart, not together......not good..
I would say that you are seeing this as a safety issue, as you fear, though you did not say it, leaving this, irregardless of the children. Perhaps initially, you tied the knot as you saw this as something you would get kudos for from friends and family. You mentioned boyfriends leaving near the end, hence again the safety issue of attaching, regardless of the fact that you were not "in love" with him, in the beginning.
At this point, you can only blame yourself, so many years into this, for staying, and being unable to pull the trigger, children or not. You have to be true to yourself. If you feel this is a prison, then take the key to the cell and leave. Life is too short.....
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