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Old 01-03-2015, 12:17 AM
 
Location: Chicago
607 posts, read 590,887 times
Reputation: 832

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Quote:
Originally Posted by ohhwanderlust View Post
WTF.

NO.

NEVER EVER EVER EVER EVER NO NO NO NONONONONONONO


I got it while in Southeast Asia, and put it this way... the pain was so horrific and relentless that I had to be stopped from attempting suicide. This is not an exaggeration. I was praying to die.

And now that I've had it, I'm at risk for the really deadly strain if I get it again.
Aren't you immune to viruses after you live thru the infection, ala Ebola?

Then again, they mutate as well, and there are so many strains....

I have never heard of someone being in more danger from a viral after being exposed, but, then
again, I am not a microbiologist.....

It is so amazing and frightening to consider we have colonies of "friendlies" in our guts, at the same time we have invaders, who fight wars with each other, not unlike any other war humans themselves fight..

I'm sorry, ohh wander, that you had such pain, but more power to you that you had the courage to live thru the same. It must have took a steel will. I truly think that after experiencing that, everything in life is "small stuff".....the one redeeming thing about living thru hell itself..

Glad you are still here with us, and stay away from SE Asia..

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Old 01-03-2015, 12:24 AM
 
Location: Chicago
607 posts, read 590,887 times
Reputation: 832
Quote:
Originally Posted by Gerania View Post
Why don't you give us a link to something?
Gerania, I saw this in a Wall Street Journal article in the back of the paper...after that, I notice you
don't hear much about it anymore.....there is a link in the header of the post to the article, but I believe you need a subscription to access it....

Here is another link to what is going on with this..

It runs on the left of the page(the story)....

NanoViricides Inc. (NNVC): ANOTHER BIG ALARM WITH EBOLA, DENGUE BECOMES
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Old 01-03-2015, 12:35 AM
 
Location: Chicago
607 posts, read 590,887 times
Reputation: 832
Quote:
Originally Posted by Unsettomati View Post
Allow me to rain on the hysteria-parade by injecting some facts into the nonsense.

First, the fatality rate of dengue fever is not 1% - annually, 22,000 people out of ~50m infected die. (or, roughly 1 in 2300 who contract the disease). This is a small fraction of 1%. Second, those deaths are concentrated among individuals with weakened immune systems (children, the elderly, etc.). And here's a hint - those volunterrs who may (yes, may) be infected in this trial that may (yes, may) occur will all be healthy adults.

Second, it's nothing like the Black Plague, which was a bacterial infection killing about 50% of those infected. That some victims of the Black Plague may have also had dengue fever is a red herring which is no more relevant than the fact that some Black Plague victims also undoubtedly had broken arms.

Third, the "there is no cure!" alarmism is misleading. There are no specific drugs used to treat the disease. However, symptoms are treated, and over 99% of those infected make complete recoveries. There "is no cure!" for the cold either, so stop flogging that horse for effect.

Fourth, this is nothing new. Dengue fever testing of this nature has been conducted on several hundred individuals over the years. Total deaths in those trials? Zero.

http://www.wsj.com/articles/dengue-fever-researchers-in-military-weigh-infecting-volunteers-1415908102
I would not call this hysteria...just wondering where they find volunteers to infect healthy people with Dengue fever....put it another way, unsettomati, if the rate of death per volunteers over the years(around 400 have done so), is zero, would you feel comfortable being injected with the same? Just saying, that's all.

I would imagine most healthy people are very careful per what they eat, ingest, breathe, etc., more than the average person. I am trying hard to imagine the wherewithal and mindset of a healthy person willing to volunteer for something like this.

Yes, there have been zero fatalities, but many subjects have had very painful experiences with the symtoms, like the relatives of some of the people who have posted(one said he had this himself and it was all he could do to avoid killing himself, per the pain)....so, you can also say, what healthy person would be willing to subject himself/herself to a fair chance of experiencing some quite awful pain, not to mention no guarantees that this, while not killing them, will not cause health problems down the line?

Again, though no one has died yet from volunteering to be injected with Dengue, I am sure many have had health problems, same as the posts you mention on here of people who have had it. Not dying is not much of a positive, put it that way.

Put another way, who of you would feel comfortable being injected with a live Dengue Fever virus?

I would imagine zero....

Also, isn't this contagious? With all the hullaballoo about keeping Ebola patients, and even those just exposed to the same, isolated and quarantined, what chance do these volunteers have of infecting and spreading this to friends and family? I cannot imagine their families being thrilled about their loved ones getting injected with this, not just for the subjects sake, but also for the fear of catching this as well....
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Old 01-03-2015, 12:44 AM
 
Location: Chicago
607 posts, read 590,887 times
Reputation: 832
Quote:
Originally Posted by Larry Caldwell View Post
Are you sure this isn't part of vaccine trials?

Dengue vaccine tested on Indian adults, found safe - The Times of India

When you join the military they vaccinate you for everything from tetanus to yellow fever. At this point they are probably trying to infect vaccinated volunteers to evaluate how effective their vaccination program is. A successful trial would mean no one comes down with the disease.
Larry, they don't inject you with a LIVE virus!

Dead viruses, same as the flu shots.....this deal is a live one......if what they injected those soldiers with were live viruses, many would die, or become so sick they could not function for weeks...

No..it's the live virus here per Dengue, in other words, all those INJECTED will become INFECTED(with apologies to the rhyming Jesse Jackson Sr.)

I suppose, though this is a Military Research center(Walter Reed), that scientists will inject themselves, but who knows?.....
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Old 01-03-2015, 12:48 AM
 
Location: Chicago
607 posts, read 590,887 times
Reputation: 832
The beautiful thing, is that the military has a great record of maintaining absolute safety when experimenting, going back as far as the mid 1940's.....I'm sure everything will be just fine..

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Old 01-03-2015, 12:52 AM
 
Location: Chicago
607 posts, read 590,887 times
Reputation: 832
Quote:
Originally Posted by todd00 View Post
Children are more likely to die from it. It's pretty common in the Philippines. I know an adult that had it (she was very sick but got better) and also know of a 2 year old that died from it. We can put a man on the moon, travel space and many other amazing things but can't permanently kill off the damn mosquito.
All the more reason to hate the little buggers.....other than bees and wasps(well, ants too), is there any life form more obnoxious and unwanted than mosquitos in the summer?.....

Not to mention they are the main conduit for Dengue...wonder what else you can catch from these things?
I bet you can get something if they just got finished biting a squirrel or something..

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Old 01-03-2015, 01:52 AM
 
Location: Myrtle Creek, Oregon
11,107 posts, read 11,518,073 times
Reputation: 17289
Quote:
Originally Posted by scottkuzminski View Post
Larry, they don't inject you with a LIVE virus!

Dead viruses, same as the flu shots.....this deal is a live one......if what they injected those soldiers with were live viruses, many would die, or become so sick they could not function for weeks...

No..it's the live virus here per Dengue, in other words, all those INJECTED will become INFECTED(with apologies to the rhyming Jesse Jackson Sr.)

I suppose, though this is a Military Research center(Walter Reed), that scientists will inject themselves, but who knows?.....
The dengue viruses under development are live virus vaccines. I can't get to the WSJ story to see what it actually said, but very typically the news is reported by people who are not smart enough to understand it. I found a reference to Walter Reed and the military tests:

Quote:
Halstead and colleagues discovered DENVs were attenuated following passage in primary dog kidney (PDK) cell culture [30]. Mahidol University and Sanofi Pasteur attempted to codevelop live attenuated virus dengue vaccine candidates using PDK cell passage; the Walter Reed Army Institute of Research and GlaxoSmithKline Biologicals also used PDK passage to attenuate vaccine virus strain candidates [3140]. The US National Institutes of Allergy and Infectious Diseases attenuate DENV strains by targeted mutagenesis; the resulting attenuated DENV strains may constitute stand-alone vaccine candidates or serve as chimeric backbones [4145]. The US Naval Medical Research Center has completed a phase 1 trial testing a DENV-1 pre-Membrane/Envelope DNA vaccine; explorations of different vector and/or adjuvant combinations continue [4650]. Hawaii Biotech/Merck & Company is completing a phase 1 trial testing a DENV-1 recombinant Envelope protein candidate [5153]. Sanofi Pasteur is in advanced clinical development (phase 3) of a chimeric-Yellow fever-dengue (CYD) vaccine candidate using a construct created at the St. Louis University Health Sciences Center and Acambis Inc. [5459]. The CYD candidate is the first candidate to enter clinical endpoint trials.
The source is the Oxford Journal of Infectious Disease, which is a much more reliable source than the WSJ.

http://jid.oxfordjournals.org/content/203/3/299.full

Clinical trials of vaccines involve vaccinating volunteers and then exposing them to the virus to determine how effective it is.

The first thing that made me suspicious was the source of the article. The WSJ has a long track record of yellow journalism, purposely slanting and sensationalizing the news to boost circulation. Before you get too excited about this story, look for corroboration from more reliable publications.
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Old 01-03-2015, 02:20 AM
 
Location: NWA/SWMO
2,749 posts, read 2,624,511 times
Reputation: 2659
Quote:
Originally Posted by Woof View Post
It doesn't pay well to be a research guinea pig. Some studies will provide maybe a coupla hundred bucks at the end, plus if they're lucky room (plastic mattresses and a roommate) and board (hospital food). The volunteers seem to be mostly starving grad students and homeless people. There are usually plenty of volunteers if it has been well-advertised.
I'm aware, which is why I haven't looked into it beyond this thread. Just saying. ...if it were $1-2m usd....sign me up!!!
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Old 01-03-2015, 02:26 AM
 
Location: Chicago
607 posts, read 590,887 times
Reputation: 832
Sad if WSJ is that slanted, as it has the highest circulation of any paper in the US..

Of course, Murdoch owns it.....I was not pleased at the time that happened..

He cut down the unique stories on the front cover from 3 to 1 immediately(the ones with that lithograph picture look)...

The Op-Eds are obviously slanted, though I do realize nothing is pure info, especially nowadays...

That being said, I do greatly enjoy WSJ, though I realize it is not holy writ.......they do have a ton of reporters in the field, ala the NYT and Wash Post, though obviously bias will raise its head..

This story was buried in the back, so was not sensationalized, let alone even on the front page....

The human interest aspect in the story obviously was just who in their right mind would volunteer for this, especially while Ebola is so recent(and still not exactly done with).....

It never mentioned anyone was forced to do this, or in an unknowing way.....

I can only imagine what goes on behind closed doors, though......
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Old 01-03-2015, 03:43 AM
 
Location: where you sip the tea of the breasts of the spinsters of Utica
8,305 posts, read 11,835,454 times
Reputation: 8038
Vaccines are sometimes developed using an attenuated, vastly weakened virus - other time using a dead one or part of one. The researchers vaccinate animals and test them against the natural, deadly strain, test for antibody production, and to see if they get the disease and keel over, or get any sort of side effects.

If it passes muster, they then inject the weakened or dead vaccine strain into a few human volunteers. They don't test the people against a natural deadly strain as they did with animals ..... now they just look for development of the right antibodies, and again for side effects.

Then I think they may test it with a limited release into the general population if it's something new (not well known like influenza vaccines) ...... after that if all is well they ramp up production for full release where needed.

If I remember correctly.
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