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Old 01-09-2015, 03:52 PM
 
5,107 posts, read 6,105,947 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by mrwibble View Post
Bear in mind that going to college and/or university in Europe to get a degree is nowhere near as universal as it is in the US. for a state, students need to reach a lot higher standard than in the US to attend. There is also a strong technical/vocational school system in many European countries that make a bachelors degree unnecessary for many positions that would require one in the US. School leavers in many of the western European countries have an educational level in excess of their US equivalents. For example, the English A-level exams, which are taken at 18 prior to leaving secondary school, are considerd to be the equivalent completing the freshman year at a US university.
and adding that the state (in Germany anyway) sorts out the students at around 12 years old to put them on a college track or a vocational track. So you may want to go to college someday, but if the teachers decide you are better off being a tradesman then you don't go to college. period. you go to the vocational route. Believe german colleges are largely tuition free. But again, it was determined at an early age whether you would be on that track or not.

things could have changed since I lived there but that is the way it was. I always get a tickle out of it when someone compares US to Europe for social programs but it is such an apples and oranges comparison.
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Old 01-09-2015, 03:59 PM
 
Location: State of Transition
73,210 posts, read 64,754,952 times
Reputation: 69232
Quote:
Originally Posted by eddiehaskell View Post
So for those that actually have employable skills - how does this help? I find it hard to believe that someone with the brain power to obtain a well paying job would otherwise have their goals stifled by $3k in tuition.
You're not making sense. Most people don't want to wait tables all their lives. That's why they go to school.
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Old 01-09-2015, 04:35 PM
 
1,774 posts, read 1,742,020 times
Reputation: 2700
Quote:
Originally Posted by thatguydownsouth View Post
So what do you call it when a minority of people pay the politicians through campaign contributions to set policies in place which make the American people unable to afford said automobiles?
It's all communism to me. I don't think it's any coincidence that there are record numbers of CHINESE clogging up american colleges at the same time Chairman MAObama announces "Free Community College For Each And All, According To Their Needs." The rise in taxes necessary to fund this "re-education" effort will surely put automotive freedom out of reach of most true americans, forcing them to ride bicycles, just like their Agenda 21 communist chinese masters.
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Old 01-09-2015, 04:43 PM
 
48,519 posts, read 81,350,619 times
Reputation: 17985
Not going anywhere; just rethoric for state of the union. Keeps the faithful hoping is all.
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Old 01-09-2015, 05:02 PM
 
Location: Great State of Texas
86,093 posts, read 70,230,224 times
Reputation: 27525
Since I have no say so in the matter and it's my tax dollars then I'm going back to school for a 2 year degree.

Obama didn't limit it to HS graduates folks..he said EVERY American and wants people to continually improve their education.

So pass this sucker so I can go and get myself another degree
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Old 01-09-2015, 05:28 PM
 
Location: Rathdrum, ID
4,163 posts, read 3,921,840 times
Reputation: 7963
Quote:
Originally Posted by thatguydownsouth View Post
Obama to propose free community college

What do you guys think about this?...
I am not registered with any political party and I believe that history will judge Obama to be the absolute worst president this country has ever had to date. However, this is one idea worthy of careful and deliberate consideration. The youth of a country is its future and an educated populace will only cause a country to grow stronger. Depending on the details, this is one idea that I could support.



disclaimer: I teach at my local community college one night a week. I teach because I want to, not because I need to. My day, mortgage-paying job compensates me quite well and I don't need the extra income. When it stops being fun, then I will stop teaching. I've already given up one class that I really enjoyed because it wasn't "fun" anymore. Ultimately, I believe that I am helping my students become better, well educated adults; who are more prepared to enter the working world and better equipped to realize their dreams and become contributing members of society.
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Old 01-09-2015, 05:43 PM
 
38,701 posts, read 15,577,816 times
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US Department of Education will do to the community schools what they have done to the public schools.
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Old 01-09-2015, 05:54 PM
 
553 posts, read 339,703 times
Reputation: 120
Quote:
Originally Posted by thatguydownsouth View Post
Obama to propose free community college

What do you guys think about this? Personally my first reaction was, that's stupid. But the more I thought about it, the more Im ok with it. We dump billions of dollars into other nations in futile attempts to "democratize" them and it fails. We spent trillions on failed wars and international policing....and they fail. We literally GIVE money to some Nations.....

If we're going to waste money like that then fine, lets at least use a "little bit" to better ourselves....
With such a high debt of trillions no congressman even democrats would vote on this bill. Even republicans are making cuts to the army!!

Same thing with universal health care no congressman or even democrats would support it with today debt problem.

I would not lose sleep over it. It will not happen.
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Old 01-09-2015, 05:58 PM
 
Location: Charlotte, NC
4,588 posts, read 6,143,300 times
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I don't think people are necessarily opposed to helping others attend community colleges. I DO think people are opposed to the idea because they know it will turn out to be something totally different than promised. Government has a bad habit of working that way. Government-backed loans are partly responsible for the rise in tuition costs because the schools know they'll get paid. I just don't see how this will be any different in the long run without cutting the political garbage out and having people run the program who actually know what they're doing.

If the idea was to cover the costs of a trade school, I'd be 100% behind it. To pay for someone to take classes towards an art degree or something in little demand, I certainly have a problem there. I think a large problem is that politicians will build such a program to where it pays for useless degrees, for lack of a better word. How do you tell little Johnny "No" when it's his dream to stop waiting tables and curate an underwear museum? A little out there, but I think the point is made.

Then, what of the massive increase in graduates with 2-year degrees? The term "degree inflation" comes to mind, meaning your degree is worth less. Now a 4-year degree doesn't mean as much and now you need a Master's where you used to only need a 4-year. It's a possible scenario, but I wouldn't use it to discredit the idea just yet.

Yes, we need to educate out children so we can be competitive in the world market, but we have to find a way to control labor costs. If the labor costs aren't controlled, you have essentially made college little more than another reason the American job will be outsourced. Let's face it, lots of us think we are worth a lot more money than we really are. And there are probably several people out there who will happily take our job for less money because it is better than anything they have.

I would be in favor of such a program if it actually led to jobs, not just degrees. A degree can help you get a job, but that degree doesn't pay the bills. That is why I would be in favor of technical or vocational training instead of just a broad college degree in whatever the course may be, unless the course was for an actual in-demand field. Nursing was an okay example, but nursing jobs are getting harder to come by lately based on what I have seen.

Train someone for HVAC repair, plumbing, electrical work, roofing. Those are not glamorous jobs by any means, but most of the people I know who are good at those jobs rake in a nice amount of money every year. In some cases much better than sitting in a bank building or being a graphic designer. Heck, my plumber probably rakes in well into the 6-figure range. We pay him damn near half of it (property management).
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Old 01-09-2015, 05:58 PM
 
19,237 posts, read 11,238,439 times
Reputation: 8388
Quote:
Originally Posted by rzzzz View Post
It's all communism to me. I don't think it's any coincidence that there are record numbers of CHINESE clogging up american colleges at the same time Chairman MAObama announces "Free Community College For Each And All, According To Their Needs." The rise in taxes necessary to fund this "re-education" effort will surely put automotive freedom out of reach of most true americans, forcing them to ride bicycles, just like their Agenda 21 communist chinese masters.

What?? your FREE CAPITALISM is allowing the foreign people to buy our land and ports they own our weaponry and specialty parts- they rising and we failing- 1/2 of our kids on drugs - 40% never graduate college and least 25 do not graduate high school while others over seas are excelling in the sciences etc. educate OUR kids!
QUOTE: Federal Reserve Bank of New York data showed that Americans collectively owe $1.1 trillion in student loan debt. By comparison, we owe $8.2 trillion in mortgage debt and $659 billion in credit card debt.

go watch the IVORY TOWER and see reality
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