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Old 03-04-2015, 07:41 AM
 
419 posts, read 1,001,304 times
Reputation: 724

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Must have been one heck of a thorough background check on these two:

Auxiliary Police Officers Assault, Handcuff and Rob Deliveryman, NYPD Says - East Harlem - DNAinfo.com New York


Looks more like they counted how many chins they had and said "you're hired."
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Old 03-04-2015, 07:50 AM
 
Location: H-Tine, Texas
6,742 posts, read 3,876,712 times
Reputation: 8522
Quote:
Originally Posted by Gtownoe View Post
They're just stupid. That's all. They can't reason.




It's to the point now where I just cant stand the defenses put up by some people for some actions.





I can never in my life imagine harming an 80 year old woman, unarmed, who's simply trying to give cupcakes to her grandchildren. Never.


She could call me every name in the book and I still wouldn't harm her.








The bias has become dangerous.

Holy bleep, I'm glad y'all were able to understand that post. That's what I get for posting when I'm exhausted and ready for bed, LOL.

"Not all cops are bad" crowd.*

But yeah, agreed. Discretion is missing in the part of some cops and others, as someone hit the nail on the head with this, suffer from a Napoleon Complex.

Of course there are bad apples in every profession - crooks, shady people, hot heads, and whatnot, but none of those people in those professions have the right to carry a gun or taser in their line of work and the ability to have their actions with those weapons justified or defended because of a badge.

Big difference.

Last edited by ATG5; 03-04-2015 at 08:08 AM..
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Old 03-04-2015, 08:11 AM
 
Location: NW Nevada
13,340 posts, read 10,921,891 times
Reputation: 12291
Quote:
Originally Posted by wheelz View Post
Then why don't the cops take karate classes and leave their weapons at home?

What happens to you if the criminal you are trying to fight took karate for those 10 or 15 years?

Didn't Bruce Lee die from a gunshot?

A LOT of firefighters and EMS hate certain cops, you are dead wrong if you do not think so.
Brandon Lee..Bruce Lees son, died of a gunshot. What end the father is hotly debated, to this day. Just a tidbit, there. I wasn't going to respond to the martial arts bit, but you raise a couple good points. One of the, if not THE biggest factor in martial arts is discipline. Keeping ones head, remaining calm. Lol...a LOT of cops could use that. That way, many situations just won't turn physical.

When they wanted yl question my fkance' in the hospital ER, I got plumb mad dog bristled up. I ;;was showing teeth. Most cops, these day, would have just cuffed and stuffed me, and did what they want. These pair didn't. They talked to me, calmed me down, and assured me they wouldn't push her. I didn't want to leave her, but tbey convinced me they were the good guys. Most , couldn't have done that. The male cop stayed with me, kept me talking, and calmed me down. No easy feat. The female deputy talked to my fiance'. And...didn't further tramatize her. She empathized. And let her take things at her own pace. People skills. Cops don't have them anymore. The incident was pretty straightforward, so it didn't take long and we were back together.
People skills, compassion, empathy and a non threatening demeanor. That produces more cooperation than brandishing a Taser.
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Old 03-04-2015, 09:41 AM
 
Location: St Louis, MO
4,677 posts, read 4,598,660 times
Reputation: 2966
Quote:
Originally Posted by marigolds6 View Post
I will point to what you wrote here. Cops can, and want to protect you. Every single thing that you have written here has nothing to do with the police themselves and is solely the result of law and policy placed on them for outside by risk adverse and lawsuit wary politicians.
That will teach me to type on a phone. That's what the original post should have said.
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Old 03-04-2015, 09:49 AM
 
Location: St Louis, MO
4,677 posts, read 4,598,660 times
Reputation: 2966
Quote:
Originally Posted by wheelz View Post
Then why don't the cops take karate classes and leave their weapons at home?
It varies from state to state, but empty hand tactics to the head, torso, or genitals, are consider lethal force equivalent to a firearm in most continuum of force policies. Trained empty hand tactics (as well as the use of any striking weapon) to the head, torso, or genitals are always considered lethal force equivalent to a firearm according to the DoJ. You can read more here:
www.cops.usdoj.gov/pdf/Use-of-Force.pdf
It is also considered a violation of federal guidelines to use any empty hand tactics which were not taught by a department defensive tactics instructor. So, even if an officer took 10 years of karate, they could not use those tactics unless they took 10 years of karate from the department defensive tactics instructor.

These guidelines and policies are, once again, crafted by risk adverse politicians who fear lawsuits.
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Old 03-04-2015, 09:54 AM
 
Location: St Louis, MO
4,677 posts, read 4,598,660 times
Reputation: 2966
Quote:
Originally Posted by wheelz View Post
Must have been one heck of a thorough background check on these two:

Auxiliary Police Officers Assault, Handcuff and Rob Deliveryman, NYPD Says - East Harlem - DNAinfo.com New York

Looks more like they counted how many chins they had and said "you're hired."
Auxiliary police are not police officers. They are a cost cutting measure to use unpaid volunteers to replace some of the duties of more expensive paid police officers, and it is a stupid stupid idea imposed from above by politicians who wanted to save money and reduce liability. The NYC program has allowed NYC to replace over 500 officers with unpaid volunteers.
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Old 03-04-2015, 09:55 AM
 
Location: Scottsdale, AZ
5,602 posts, read 3,479,442 times
Reputation: 7803
Quote:
Originally Posted by 11thHour View Post
One of these days the cops will get their acts together and quit behaving so badly. Then people won't hate them. Then cop-hating threads will fade away. But until such day, these threads will persist thanks to cops' own actions. They have no one to blame but themselves.
Cops? You mean the FEW that behave badly? How about all the rest who are perfectly nice?
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Old 03-04-2015, 09:58 AM
 
419 posts, read 1,001,304 times
Reputation: 724
Quote:
Originally Posted by marigolds6 View Post
Auxiliary police are not police officers. They are a cost cutting measure to use unpaid volunteers to replace some of the duties of more expensive paid police officers, and it is a stupid stupid idea imposed from above by politicians who wanted to save money and reduce liability. The NYC program has allowed NYC to replace over 500 officers with unpaid volunteers.
"The departments with which they are associated and the chief of police in charge often delineate their specific duties.

Although many auxiliary police officer positions are voluntary, some departments provide salaries for auxiliary law enforcement work. Auxiliary police officers usually must be at least 18 or 21 years of age. Most employers prefer professionals who have the minimum of a high school diploma. Additional job requirements include having a clean background, passing drug tests, and being either a permanent resident or a U.S. citizen."
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Old 03-04-2015, 10:05 AM
 
419 posts, read 1,001,304 times
Reputation: 724
Quote:
Originally Posted by BIG CATS View Post
Cops? You mean the FEW that behave badly? How about all the rest who are perfectly nice?

No one here is saying all cops are bad.

I ride dirt bikes off road, most all the riding areas in my area have been completely shut down because of a few riders behaving badly, what about all the riders who are perfectly nice? A stupid analogy, correct? Well then what about all the nice people that were living in Hiroshima?
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Old 03-04-2015, 10:40 AM
 
Location: NW Nevada
13,340 posts, read 10,921,891 times
Reputation: 12291
Quote:
Originally Posted by marigolds6 View Post
It varies from state to state, but empty hand tactics to the head, torso, or genitals, are consider lethal force equivalent to a firearm in most continuum of force policies. Trained empty hand tactics (as well as the use of any striking weapon) to the head, torso, or genitals are always considered lethal force equivalent to a firearm according to the DoJ. You can read more here:
www.cops.usdoj.gov/pdf/Use-of-Force.pdf
It is also considered a violation of federal guidelines to use any empty hand tactics which were not taught by a department defensive tactics instructor. So, even if an officer took 10 years of karate, they could not use those tactics unless they took 10 years of karate from the department defensive tactics instructor.

These guidelines and policies are, once again, crafted by risk adverse politicians who fear lawsuits.
These "guidelines" must be interesting reading. The exemptions, alone, must use up a lot of ink. Cops, these days, are walking juggernauts. They have an array of weapons, at their disposal, that makes a Roman Gladiator look tame. By the standards you cite, all but two are considered lethal, if deployed. Loaded "sap gloves", spring loaded batons, the PR 24 or standard nightstick, kubaton, knives, steel toed boots, joint armor, and, last but not least, a sidearm, shotgun and carbine.

Non lethal are the ubiquitous Taser, and OC spray. , The rest of the list, are, decidedly, lethal, if employed with zeal, which, they often are. One need not even be intending to kill with such weapons, but it happens. I punch to the chest with sap gloves, can stop a healthy, in shape, persons heart. This equipment is a crap shoot, and is not nessecary to ensure officer safety. Most of IG is quite illegal for civilians to even possess, let alone carry around with intent. Hmm, why is that? Because its DANGEROUS stuff. Even in "trained" hands.

If the powers that be are so concerned with potential liability, why allow this "equipment" (read..weapons) to be so widely deployed? Very simply, liability is almost a zero concern. A cop will, with RARE exception, always be exonerated in deployment of force, even if it results in the death of a citizen, in a situation where lethal force is not even justified. Liability concerns? That's laughable. They control the courts. No worries there.

That weapons are, actually, a hindrance to personal defense, is also laughable. If that's so, why do cops carry so many? If it were not for a weapon, my lady would not have survived her attacker, and would have been , brutally, raped before being killed. Yet, the legality of her weapon was one of the first things investigated. Good for me..not for thee?

With these two, particular, deputies, I don't think , even if it had been" illegal" somehow, it would have made their report as such. The ends justified the means, in this situation. But, point made. Cops are armed and armored, modern, berserkers. I just can't see ANY fear of liability being at work, here. Damn seldom , with a cop get BBQd for wrongful death. It may get to court, but is, usually, just an inconvenience to the powers that be.
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