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Old 06-30-2015, 07:43 AM
 
6,298 posts, read 3,550,035 times
Reputation: 7193

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Quote:
Originally Posted by MissTerri View Post
It passed. I don't think it will have that much of an impact in part due to the reasons you mention above.
My two cents on this. It will hurt the poor families who cannot afford to send their kids to private or to homeschool. Take Angelina Jolie who recently had chicken pox herself. The woman travels all around the world. Did she catch chicken pox from an unvaccinated little child in California? Most likely she brought it back from one of her shoots in a foreign country. Would this bill solve this problem? Absolutely not.

I read that she used to homeschool her 5 kids, but now sends them to public school. So if she is an anti-vaxxer (did not vaccinate HERSELF), then she will just pull them out of school, and hire tutors, or very expensive college educated Nanny to homeschool them. Obviously, she will not be keeping herself and her children OUT OF SOCIETY.

Moderator cut: off topic

This is just "feel good" legislation created by the media for the Disney Measles Panic. It will not stop people like an unvaccinated Jolie, and her kids, from going out into society and around the world if they are homeschooled.

Last edited by Marka; 07-05-2015 at 02:05 AM..

 
Old 06-30-2015, 08:15 AM
 
Location: Glasgow Scotland
15,254 posts, read 12,502,221 times
Reputation: 22080
This makes you think....so why if not dangerous was it taken out of vacccines for under six year olds , and why not for all children...

Is thimerosal in vaccines linked to autism?

Numerous studies have found no association between thimerosal exposure and autism. However, since 2001, no new vaccine licensed by FDA for use in children has contained thimerosal as a preservative and all vaccines routinely recommended by CDC for children younger than 6 years of age have been thimerosal-free, or contain only trace amounts of thimerosal, except for some formulations of influenza vaccine. Unfortunately, reductions in the numbers of children identified with autism have not been observed since that time indicating that the cause of autism is not related to a sinthimerosalgle exposure such as thimerosal. Thimerosal and 2014-2015 Seasonal Flu Vaccines | Seasonal Influenza (Flu) | CDC
 
Old 06-30-2015, 08:22 AM
 
Location: BC, Arizona
1,170 posts, read 791,314 times
Reputation: 2377
Vaccinations work. Period.

Homeschooled kids are a small portion of the population and many of them are vaccinated.

Abortion discussions are a distraction.

The data show's that in California it's the affluent starbucks sipping suburban families that have pockets of unvaccinated kids creating the risk that led to this legislation. We will see how strong their convictions are when little "Apple" has to be homeschooled in order for them to avoid vaccinations.

Parents with kids with compromised immune systems who are unable to get vaccinated will now be much safer at their public schools. Is it perfect? No. Is it a great stride in preventing the reemergence of entirely preventable childhood diseases?

Yes.
 
Old 06-30-2015, 08:26 AM
 
Location: Glasgow Scotland
15,254 posts, read 12,502,221 times
Reputation: 22080
This made me smile. not that its funny, its quite sad to try and make out formadehyde is safe because kids are exposed by other things other than in vaccines... pathetic.they forgot to say that undertakers use masks, goggles , gloves and overalls, with warning signs while using this toxic stuff...laughable if not so serious.
Formaldehyde. Formaldehyde is used to detoxify diphtheria and tetanus toxins or to inactivate a virus. The tiny amount which may be left in these vaccines is safe. Vaccines are not the only source of formaldehyde your baby is exposed to. Formaldehyde is also in products like paper towels, mascara and carpeting. Our bodies normally have formaldehyde in the blood stream and at levels higher than in vaccines. https://www.healthychildren.org/Engl...Questions.aspx http://www.thehealthyhomeeconomist.c...-is-just-fine/
 
Old 06-30-2015, 08:28 AM
 
6,622 posts, read 4,568,043 times
Reputation: 13256
"As California goes, so goes the Nation". In regards to requiring vaccinations, I certainly hope so.
 
Old 06-30-2015, 08:47 AM
 
6,298 posts, read 3,550,035 times
Reputation: 7193
Quote:
Originally Posted by ConeyGirl52 View Post
When was honey tried?

As I mentioned before, much eariler on this thread, when the flu vaccine first came out, images akin to scenes from "Gangs of New York" were used to sell it to the public. Bodies lining the street with candles so relatives could identify them because the streets had no lighting, and no one owned a flashlight apparently. Why? Wouldnt anyone concerned about the flu be getting vaccinated anyway? Did those antiquated imagines really send people rushing to get vaccinated for something like the flu - or did they do more to hurt that cause?

Could it not be foreseen that that would be viewed by anyone with two brain cells to rub together skeptically?

It seems odd that out of more than 48000 scientists in the country none can be found that arent working for manufacturers to study the effect of drugs and vaccines, or to sit on oversight panels.

But I guess someone could logically counter that with a statement like all scientists are heavily invested in Big Pharma, so it would be impossible. In fact, I seem to be somewhat invested in Big Pharma myself viewing the funds holdings in my retirement annuity. Why would I be against Big Pharma succeeding? I wouldnt be.

Doctors do make money off everything they do in this country. We are not very communist or socialist, and doctors do not become doctors without the money to do so here. I can be the most brilliant human God ever created,, but without the funds to back that brilliance, I will never be anything of note. Money controls every aspect of life in the US - how could doctors be exempt? Its not logical, unless they are imported from countries with a different system their own. Even someone seeking a PhD will be told someone other than yourself needs to support you while you pursue your Doctorate.

Im sure someone could counter that with scholarships, and blah blah blah, but life has a way throwing everyone curveballs too. There are not enough scholarships out there that would educate and support everyone with the potential.

Its interesting you point to genetics, or plain bad luck. Its that easy to brush off the effect on someones child? Would that be acceptable to Doctors when that 'plain bad luck' effected their own children? "Meh, sorry Doc - just plain bad luck that killed your child. You must come from a tired gene pool." Sounds rather callous to me.

Does being a scientist necessitate killing off compassion and the ability to reason in regard to human emmotion? Maybe it does. I dont know.

My point is Im looking at it from both sides of the coin - not just the side I would particularly prefer. In all honesty I dont actually have a preference.

We are also told that the world is overpopulated, and we need reduce our carbon footprint. How do we do that if we are not allowed to get sick or even at some point die?

You could counter with that not being the point for many reasons, but cant any parent also use the 'plain bad luck' and 'genetics' theory, the same way you do to support risking vaccination, to support their desire to have their child risk the infection?

I dont have any answers one way or the other, but I also dont look at healthcare at all-good, nor all-bad. Maybe its as you say, a matter of luck.

If science cant guarantee the vaccine will definately prevent the disease in question, or that no one will have a bad reaction to the vaccine itself - how can it be so matter-of-fact about vaccines must be used, and for every even mundane thing we can create one for? You can point to the theory of herd immunity, but you cant honestly say that theory has been undoubtably proven as fact either.

Vaccines are good. Im sure people with HepC, HIV/AIDS, Ebola, and a whole host of dieases that would or have had a serious life-threatening impact on society would gratefully welcome the development of vaccines for those dreadful conditions. The seriousness of the condition would definately out-weigh the risk of complication, their poor gene pool, or plain bad luck in regard to the vaccine.

Please learn from the marketing of the flu vaccine. Whether it was meant to be a scare tactic or not, that is definately the effect it produced - whether anyone wants accept that fact or not.

Whether we risk infection or not, we are all meant to eventually die one day. Its called the natural cycle of life. It appears to me, parents that do vaccinate dont even have any confidence in the power the vaccine to protect. If they did, they wouldnt display an irrational fear of children who have not been vaccinated. I was vaccinated, and my parents didnt grill any perspective class or play mates about whether or not they had been vaccinated. We simply ran off and studied or played. There was no irrational fear.

Science can voice its perspective all it wants, but that doesnt mean that perspective will always be met with unconditional acceptance.

In the end, its my body. I should have the right to put what I want in it - be it a good thing, or a bad thing. Its my life to either try to prolong, or simply throw away at will. To deny that to anyone does nothing to promote the cause of vaccination. In fact, denying that is probably what brings about conspiracy theories in the first place.
The Honey was/is tried with the FREE vaccinations under the ACA, Medicare, Medicaid. They probably thought that making vaccinations free would increase the number of people getting them. That certainly has not worked with Free Flu Shots, which are being given out everywhere. A few years ago one supermarket chain even tried "Free Turkey with your Free Flu Shot". CVS "Get your Free Flu Shot and get 10% discount on your purchase". "Give someone you love the gift of a Flu Shot". Whole LOT of Honey, but not many (45% adults), taking the bait. Probably the next step is coercion starting with children (easier targets) in the California legislation.
 
Old 06-30-2015, 08:54 AM
 
9,140 posts, read 9,222,378 times
Reputation: 28628
Quote:
Originally Posted by dizzybint View Post
This makes you think....so why if not dangerous was it taken out of vacccines for under six year olds , and why not for all children...

Is thimerosal in vaccines linked to autism?

Numerous studies have found no association between thimerosal exposure and autism. However, since 2001, no new vaccine licensed by FDA for use in children has contained thimerosal as a preservative and all vaccines routinely recommended by CDC for children younger than 6 years of age have been thimerosal-free, or contain only trace amounts of thimerosal, except for some formulations of influenza vaccine. Unfortunately, reductions in the numbers of children identified with autism have not been observed since that time indicating that the cause of autism is not related to a sinthimerosalgle exposure such as thimerosal. Thimerosal and 2014-2015 Seasonal Flu Vaccines | Seasonal Influenza (Flu) | CDC
It was taken out of vaccines because it was: (1) not essential; (2) its presence in vaccines lent itself to all kinds of imaginary stories; and (3) many pro-vaccination people made the mistake of thinking if they got rid of it they would eliminate many of the objections to vaccination.

We all see how well #3 worked out. We have people here still insisting mercury is still in childhood vaccines, fourteen years after it was removed.

I personally remember thinking at the time that unless thimerosal could be shown to have some negative effect it would be better to leave it in vaccines. I know something about the way paranoid minds work. A paranoid person assumes the very worst and imagines many of the things in the world occur because of conspiracies. Changing the composition of a vaccine or removing chemicals from a product is a "red flag" for this kind of mind. A paranoid mind will assume that the changes were made because there was a problem. A paranoid mind will generally believe that not only was there a problem, but there is a huge "cover up" and thousands of people are probably sick and dying because of it. You can pull out research data until you are blue in the face to demonstrate otherwise. A paranoid mind does not function according to any sort of logic or science.

That, my friends, is how this whole nonsense about thimerosal was blown into something that nobody could have imagined.
 
Old 06-30-2015, 08:57 AM
 
Location: BC, Arizona
1,170 posts, read 791,314 times
Reputation: 2377
Quote:
Originally Posted by dizzybint View Post
Our bodies normally have formaldehyde in the blood stream and at levels higher than in vaccines. https://www.healthychildren.org/Engl...Questions.aspx http://www.thehealthyhomeeconomist.c...-is-just-fine/
You quote a home economics blogger to refute the American Academy of Pediatrics?

Gotta go with the professionals who prevent illness and treat sick kids for a living on this one.

Doctors who treat kids > home economics blogger

The continued reference to ingredients NOT found in current vaccines and/or that have been UNEQUIVOCALLY proven to be safe and recommended is a distraction.

Any parents reading this, don't be fooled by the "bobbing and weaving" of the anti-vaxx crowd ANY vaccine is far far far safer than the illnesses it prevents.
 
Old 06-30-2015, 09:20 AM
 
6,298 posts, read 3,550,035 times
Reputation: 7193
Quote:
Originally Posted by markg91359 View Post
It was taken out of vaccines because it was: (1) not essential; (2) its presence in vaccines lent itself to all kinds of imaginary stories; and (3) many pro-vaccination people made the mistake of thinking if they got rid of it they would eliminate many of the objections to vaccination.

We all see how well #3 worked out. We have people here still insisting mercury is still in childhood vaccines, fourteen years after it was removed.

I personally remember thinking at the time that unless thimerosal could be shown to have some negative effect it would be better to leave it in vaccines. I know something about the way paranoid minds work. A paranoid person assumes the very worst and imagines many of the things in the world occur because of conspiracies. Changing the composition of a vaccine or removing chemicals from a product is a "red flag" for this kind of mind. A paranoid mind will assume that the changes were made because there was a problem. A paranoid mind will generally believe that not only was there a problem, but there is a huge "cover up" and thousands of people are probably sick and dying because of it. You can pull out research data until you are blue in the face to demonstrate otherwise. A paranoid mind does not function according to any sort of logic or science.

That, my friends, is how this whole nonsense about thimerosal was blown into something that nobody could have imagined.
It says on the Adult Flu Shot consent form contains Thimerosal: "Do not take if you are allergic to Cleaning Products". Like Bleach, Chlorine (pools/public water systems), Fluoride in water, Anti-bacterial soaps/cleansers? Hives from head to toe, including my eyelids. Paranoid? What would YOU think of being next to someone out in public looking like that? They have some contagious disease I am going to catch! Wear a SIGN saying you cannot catch this from me? I will tell that it was no fun going out in South Florida with heat indexes of 100 degrees trying to totally cover myself up so to not SCARE people. I drew the line at wearing mittens in Florida.

Oh, I am just being paranoid. These hives are all in my MIND.
 
Old 06-30-2015, 09:27 AM
 
9,140 posts, read 9,222,378 times
Reputation: 28628
Quote:
Originally Posted by Jo48 View Post
It says on the Adult Flu Shot consent form contains Thimerosal: "Do not take if you are allergic to Cleaning Products". Like Bleach, Chlorine (pools/public water systems), Fluoride in water, Anti-bacterial soaps/cleansers? Hives from head to toe, including my eyelids. Paranoid? What would YOU think of being next to someone out in public looking like that? They have some contagious disease I am going to catch! Wear a SIGN saying you cannot catch this from me? I will tell that it was no fun going out in South Florida with heat indexes of 100 degrees trying to totally cover myself up so to not SCARE people. I drew the line at wearing mittens in Florida.

Oh, I am just being paranoid. These hives are all in my MIND.
Its been said several times here that the flu vaccine is not a childhood vaccine.

Thimerosal is present in the multi-dose flu vaccine. but nowhere else.

How many times does this have to be repeated?
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