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Old 07-09-2015, 03:24 PM
 
5,660 posts, read 3,204,284 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by JerseyGirl415 View Post
^ My great-uncle, who died a few years ago, had polio as a child. He suffered lifelong effects of the disease. From then on, he always needed to walk with a cane, then as he got older, a walker. If he wasn't such a stubborn man, he'd probably had opted for a wheelchair in the later years. His feet were visibly deformed. He suffered his whole life. He'd wanted to join the service like both his brothers (other great-uncle and grandpa) but was unable to. I always felt so bad for him. I don't wish that on anyone.

And because of vaccines - we don't have to worry about anyone getting that anymore in this country.
Not only this country. The World. They may have declared Measles "eradicated" in the US, but it wasn't in the rest world. One person getting on a plane overseas can bring it back here.

Small pox vaccination and booster was required for international travel until the 70s. Maybe you need to petition Congress to do the same for Measles for international travelers?

 
Old 07-09-2015, 03:29 PM
 
Location: Amongst the AZ Cactus
7,074 posts, read 4,584,462 times
Reputation: 7672
Quote:
Originally Posted by JerseyGirl415 View Post
^ Seizure "caused by fever" in 1 in 3,000. So not even as a direct result of the vaccine. Lower the fever by taking Advil or Tylenol. That lowers your risk of seizing.

Next: Joint pain. In one out of four people. Well I'd sure as hell rather have joint pain for a few days than get measles. I had joint pain for weeks when I got Fifth Disease about seven years ago and it was the most minor part of the illness. A nuisance, but I can deal if it means I don't get measles, mumps, or rubella.

Last: "Temporary low platelet count, which can cause a bleeding disorder." In 1 of 30,000 people. Wow. You MAY get a low platelet count for a short time, which MAY cause a bleeding disorder... if you're unlucky number 30,000 out of 30,000, let's say. Or if you're unlucky number 19,046 out of 30,000. Okay.

All of those, even combined, are still better than measles.

My brother's girlfriend actually had mumps this spring. She was vaccinated. They don't know how she got it, but she got a very minor case that did not last very long. She was better in less than a week, and her neck didn't swell up too badly. Had she been unvaccinated, it's likely her infection would have been much worse.

My brother, who'd been kissing her, of course, when the disease was in its most contagious stages (before he knew it was mumps), didn't get it. Neither did I, and she was at my house a lot, eating with us, etc., before she knew it was mumps. We're both vaccinated.

Eit: Man you guys are posting so fast, my posts with little arrows don't even reflect the post they're intended to!
You might have been responding to my post and the CDC data I brought to the attention on this thread.

My intent wasn't to say getting measles was better/worse than a reaction to a vaccine. My simple point was that if one has a child who was one of the unlucky one's to get a moderate or severe reaction to a vaccine(blood disorders can be serious and may not be as black and white as your posts states), wouldn't it be prudent to at least question the idea of giving another vaccine if it has the same profile risk as stated on the CDC website as the previous vaccine? Let's make it more personal.....let's say we are talking about your hypothetical kid in this circumstance. Would you want the choice to make the decision to give or not give another vaccine to your kid without the gov saying "your kid needs it or won't be able to get into public school, regardless of the previous experience with the other vaccine"?
 
Old 07-09-2015, 03:41 PM
 
Location: Seattle, Washington
8,435 posts, read 8,394,235 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by JerseyGirl415 View Post
I'm not afraid of polio. I just said it's a bad illness, or it can be. Even if my great-uncle didn't have it, it'd still be a bad illness - because it is. I have not shared my story to influence anyone's perception. It is a known fact that polio causes paralysis and deformities. I don't have to convince anyone of anything.

Luckily, we don't have worry about polio - hence the fact that I'm not afraid of it, because it has been eradicated in this country thanks to vaccines.
"Most people who get infected with poliovirus (about 72 out of 100) will not have any visible symptoms."
Paralysis from polio would be in a minority accounting for 1 out of that same 100.

CDC Global Health - Polio - What Is Polio?

What was your reason behind posting about your great-uncle if not to relate your experience with this "bad illness?"
 
Old 07-09-2015, 04:21 PM
 
Location: Washington state
4,693 posts, read 2,310,557 times
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I decided to post the link Katjonjj so thoughtfully provided.


"Polio, or poliomyelitis, is a crippling and potentially deadly infectious disease. It is caused by the poliovirus. The virus spreads from person to person and can invade an infected person’s brain and spinal cord, causing paralysis (can’t move parts of the body).
Symptoms

Most people who get infected with poliovirus (about 72 out of 100) will not have any visible symptoms.

About 1 out of 4 people with poliovirus infection will have flu-like symptoms that may include—
  • Sore throat
  • Fever
  • Tiredness
  • Nausea
  • Headache
  • Stomach pain
These symptoms usually last 2 to 5 days then go away on their own.

A smaller proportion of people with poliovirus infection will develop other more serious symptoms that affect the brain and spinal cord:
  • Paresthesia (feeling of pins and needles in the legs)
  • Meningitis (infection of the covering of the spinal cord and/or brain) occurs in about 1 out of 25 people with poliovirus infection
  • Paralysis (can’t move parts of the body) or weakness in the arms, legs, or both, occurs in about 1 out of 200 people with poliovirus infection
Paralysis is the most severe symptom associated with polio because it can lead to permanent disability and death.

Between 2 and 10 out of 100 people who have paralysis from poliovirus infection die because the virus affects the muscles that help them breathe.

Even children who seem to fully recover can develop new muscle pain, weakness, or paralysis as adults, 15 to 40 years later. This is called post-polio syndrome.

Note that "poliomyelitis" (or "polio" for short) is defined as the paralytic disease. So only people with the paralytic infection are considered to have the disease."




Let's check out the first part I bolded.

Most people who get infected with poliovirus (about 72 out of 100) will not have any visible symptoms.


So how do you know if the person next to you has polio? You don't. So you could be sitting with your unvaccinated child next to someone who has polio and not even know it. Your unvaccinated child could be harboring polio and nobody else, including you, would know it.


Now, let's run those numbers. 2/100 = .02 and 1/200 = .005. So now we have 1/200 (.005) x the 74,500,000 kids in the US (let's say there's an epidemic and all the kids have polio - why not? You guys are all saying vaccines don't work) who not only have polio, but have been paralyzed from it. That number is 372,500 kids paralyzed. 2/100 (.02) is the percentage of that percentage who will die. That number is .02 x .005 x 74,500,000 = 7,450


That's 372,500 kids paralyzed (that's Katjonjj's minority) and 7,450 dead.

As for meningitis? Well, that ain't no walk in the park either. 1/25 will be .04 x 74,500,000. That will be 2,980,000 children with meningitis in the US.

You sure you want to play those odds with your kids?


And before you say polio isn't around anymore, yes, it is. And any international traveler can bring it back to the US. Before you get too complacent about this, try to remember that the epidemic of SARS in Toronto that killed 44, sickened about 400 others and quarantined 25,000, was started by ONE person ill with SARS when arriving in the city.

Last edited by rodentraiser; 07-09-2015 at 04:35 PM.. Reason: rechecking figures
 
Old 07-09-2015, 04:36 PM
 
Location: Seattle, Washington
8,435 posts, read 8,394,235 times
Reputation: 1690
Quote:
Originally Posted by rodentraiser View Post
...snip...


That's 372,500 kids paralyzed (that's Katjonjj's minority) and 7,450 dead. You sure you want to play those odds with your kids?


...snip...
Well made point. A person has just as much chance of being paralyzed from polio as does that person having an adverse reaction from the vaccine.

A small minority will experience adverse reactions from vaccines.

A small minority will experience paralysis from polio.
 
Old 07-09-2015, 04:37 PM
 
Location: Washington state
4,693 posts, read 2,310,557 times
Reputation: 13728
By the way, why hasn't anyone answered me asking whether or not you would vaccinate your child in the case that smallpox became a threat again?
 
Old 07-09-2015, 04:38 PM
 
Location: Washington state
4,693 posts, read 2,310,557 times
Reputation: 13728
Quote:
Originally Posted by katjonjj View Post
Well made point. A person has just as much chance of being paralyzed from polio as does that person having an adverse reaction from the vaccine.

A small minority will experience adverse reactions from vaccines.

A small minority will experience paralysis from polio.
Percentages and numbers?
 
Old 07-09-2015, 04:45 PM
 
Location: Seattle, Washington
8,435 posts, read 8,394,235 times
Reputation: 1690
Quote:
Originally Posted by rodentraiser View Post
Percentages and numbers?
You can look it up.
 
Old 07-09-2015, 04:59 PM
 
Location: Marquette, Mich
1,024 posts, read 385,810 times
Reputation: 2328
Quote:
Originally Posted by katjonjj View Post
Well made point. A person has just as much chance of being paralyzed from polio as does that person having an adverse reaction from the vaccine.

A small minority will experience adverse reactions from vaccines.

A small minority will experience paralysis from polio.
Adverse reactions from vaccines (as they are currently tracked) include the minor ones like low fever and swelling at the injection site. So you don't have an apples to apples comparison. It's apples to smallpox infested blankets.

So, in your comparison, a chance of paralysis is equal to an owie on my arm?
 
Old 07-09-2015, 05:10 PM
 
8,546 posts, read 5,273,203 times
Reputation: 9115
Quote:
It is simply no longer possible to believe much of the clinical research that is published, or to rely on the judgment of trusted physicians or authoritative medical guidelines. I take no pleasure in this conclusion, which I reached slowly and reluctantly over my two decades as an editor of the New England Journal of Medicine.”Dr. Marcia Angell, a physician and longtime editor-in-chief of the New England Medical Journal (NEMJ) (source)
Pfizer Vice President Blows The Whistle & Tells The Truth About The Pharmaceutical Industry | Collective-Evolution
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