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Old 08-09-2015, 04:48 PM
 
8,547 posts, read 5,290,015 times
Reputation: 9120

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Quote:
Originally Posted by suzy_q2010 View Post
This is your typical response when you cannot rebut what someone says. You believe that every parent who says a vaccine harmed his child is proof that a vaccine harmed his child. HPV is not causing "chronic pain, paralysis, death, seizures, GBS".
I don't need to rebut it because I already presented plenty of information to the contrary. The risk of someone getting cancer from HPV is extremely low. There is absolutely no need or reason for the mandate. People can choose to get the vaccine. Mandating people to get the vaccination is way over the top. Overkill. Completely unnecessary. Many people have reported serious injurious from the HPV vaccine. Even if only half of their stories were true, it would still be a serious concern.

Quote:
Since Mississippi and West Virginia have not done "whatever they please on our children" and "taken choice away, permanently", I doubt that the Rhode Island mandate for HPV vaccine will do so either. Parents anywhere in the country can choose not to vaccinate their children. They just have to be prepared to deal with the consequences. From my point of view the consequence of catching HPV is far more serious than the consequence of not being able to attend school.
Just because MS and WV haven't done" whatever they want", yet does not mean that it's not coming. Mandating HPV is a huge step in that direction. If you haven't yet grasped the difference between the meaning of the word "choice" and "coercion" yet then there is no hope that you ever will. The consequences of catching HPV are not actually that serious. The vast majority of HPV clears up on it's own. HPV is common, cancer caused by HPV is not common. Most people who are infected with HPV won't develop a cancer related to HPV. Regular pap screenings are extremely effective in preventing cervical cancer. There is no way to justify a mandate for HPV. I suspect you'll even see backlash from those are very pro-vax over the addition of the HPV vaccine to the list of mandates.

 
Old 08-09-2015, 07:59 PM
 
Location: Washington state
4,726 posts, read 2,329,669 times
Reputation: 13838
Quote:
Originally Posted by MissTerri View Post
HPV is common, cervical cancer is not. It's fine for you to choose this vaccine for your children but to make it a mandate is overkill. I guess you're a fan of living in a nanny state and allowing government to have excessive control over people's everyday decisions in the name of public health?

MIssTerri, you haven't yet answered my question about whether or not mandatory quarantine for a confirmed MDR-TB patient is justified or not. And I think the reason for that is because you yourself wouldn't want to be exposed to someone who was walking around in public and spreading a difficult-to-treat disease, but if you said quarantine was justified for this person, you'd be advocating for public health the same way I am.

That's what it is, public health, not a nanny state. That's why it's call PUBLIC health. not private health.

You, along with Jo and Katjonjj and a few others, haven't gotten it yet. And that is, your rights to choose to not vaccinate END when they impose on my right to be healthy.

Believe it or not, it isn't all about you and yours. Maybe it's time you guys learned what the rest of us already learned in kindergarten, and that is: you SHARE this world with other people, like it or not. Just like we have a law not allowing a person to drive drunk because of the potential harm they may inflict on others, we now have a law that doesn't allow you to leave your children unvaccinated because of the potential harm that unvaccinated child may do to others.

And just like a drunk who chooses to drive, you can also choose not to vaccinate. But understand that your choices have consequences and if those consequences are that your children are not allowed in public school if you decide to not vaccinate, then accept those consequences and let that be the end of it.

I'm really saying all that in a very nice way. I spent a week in intensive care 18 months ago. Maybe I should put it like this: I spent ONLY a week in intensive care. Had I gotten sick with anything serious, like measles or chicken pox, that one week could easily have turned into three or four weeks. And you better believe, if I had gotten the measles or chicken pox from some kid or adult who was incubating any of these diseases because of not being vaccinated by his brain dead parents, I'd be using language a lot stronger than this.
 
Old 08-09-2015, 08:19 PM
 
Location: Georgia, USA
21,583 posts, read 26,243,884 times
Reputation: 26643
Quote:
Originally Posted by MissTerri View Post
I don't need to rebut it because I already presented plenty of information to the contrary.
The totality of the evidence you have presented is "parents believe vaccines injure their children".

Quote:
The risk of someone getting cancer from HPV is extremely low. There is absolutely no need or reason for the mandate. People can choose to get the vaccine. Mandating people to get the vaccination is way over the top. Overkill. Completely unnecessary. Many people have reported serious injurious from the HPV vaccine. Even if only half of their stories were true, it would still be a serious concern.
People can still choose not to get the vaccine.

Reports of injuries are not evidence confirming that vaccines caused those injuries. The reports are investigated and so far no serious injuries due to HPV vaccine have been confirmed. None. Worldwide.

Quote:
Just because MS and WV haven't done" whatever they want", yet does not mean that it's not coming. Mandating HPV is a huge step in that direction. If you haven't yet grasped the difference between the meaning of the word "choice" and "coercion" yet then there is no hope that you ever will.
If you can be "coerced" into vaccinating solely in order for your child to go to school, you really did not think that vaccine was going to hurt your child.

Quote:
The consequences of catching HPV are not actually that serious. The vast majority of HPV clears up on it's own. HPV is common, cancer caused by HPV is not common. Most people who are infected with HPV won't develop a cancer related to HPV. Regular pap screenings are extremely effective in preventing cervical cancer. There is no way to justify a mandate for HPV. I suspect you'll even see backlash from those are very pro-vax over the addition of the HPV vaccine to the list of mandates.
Yes, the potential risks of catching HPV are serious. There is no way to tell which person will catch a high risk strain that does not go away and progresses to cancer.

It is peculiar to me that you keep saying Pap smears prevent cervical cancer. What they do is hopefully catch the process in an early stage (though even some women who have regular smears will have their cancers missed) when it can be cured. They do not prevent infection with HPV, which is necessary for most cervical cancers to develop. Cervical cancer accounts for only about half of HPV associated cancers. You consistently ignore that fact every time you mention Pap smears. Please tell me how Pap smears of the cervix will help prevent throat cancer.

You also completely ignore the fact that finding and treating cervical pre-cancer is painful, stressful and expensive. Treating warts that do not go away on their own is painful and stressful. There is no good way to identify the precursors of throat cancer. Anal Pap smears have not been validated as an approach to early diagnosis of anal cancer. Using saliva to look for HPV in the throat is under investigation, but how many people who have oral sex are going to admit it to their dentist or doctor and get screened if it looks like the test will prove useful? The other thing is that even if a person is known to have HPV in the oral cavity there will be no easy way to look for a potential precancer.

Why on earth is preventing HPV not so much better than having repeated tests to find out whether you have it and whether the virus is up to no good if you do?

The main problem with the HPV vaccine for some parents is their denial that their children will become sexually active. For them, the mandate can perhaps help overcome that.

I suspect the backlash we'll see is from people who come down with HPV associated cancers because their parents did not protect them with the vaccine.
 
Old 08-09-2015, 08:50 PM
 
8,547 posts, read 5,290,015 times
Reputation: 9120
Hundreds of teenage girls in Colombia struck by mystery illness - National | Globalnews.ca
Officials were just baffled by the mysterious illness that hit 200+ girls in Bogota Columbia last years. Their symptoms included fainting, headaches, numbness in the hands and feet, etc. All of the girls shared one thing in common which was they had all been recently vaccinated with the HPV vaccine. Despite this common denominator, officials declared it a case of "mass hysteria" just days into the "investigation". Case closed.

Denmark, Japan, France, Spain and Columbia are all reviewing efficacy and risks of HPV vaccine after numerous reports of serious adverse reactions from families of those afflicted. Finally!

Informal poll from the Providence Journal shows that 65% of respondents do not agree with the HPV mandate.
Exeter representative asks RI Health Dept. to stop HPV vaccination requirement for middle schoolers - News - providencejournal.com - Providence, RI

Some personal stories of girls injured by the HPV vaccine: Gardasil Injured - Hormones Matter

Compensation for serious injuries and deaths from the HPV vaccine. http://www.judicialwatch.org/press-r...-compensating/

http://www.eutimes.net/2015/06/thous...y-hpv-vaccine/

Quote:
Thousands upon thousands of girls in the United Kingdom have suffered adverse reactions as a result of receiving HPV vaccinations, with more than 2,500 of those enduring “serious” debilitating illnesses, a UK government agency reports.
A recent Freedom of Information request seeking the number of people injured by vaccines in the UK revealed the human papillomavirus vaccine was responsible for over 8,200 injuries in the past 10 years, a startling figure which directly contradicts health authorities reassurances.
Denmark Documentary about young women injured by the HPV vaccine:
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=GO2i-r39hok&feature=youtu.be

One girl sharing her story https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=VzEgeCw-EAw

There are tons of more personal stories online. Easy to find for anyone who is interested.

Last edited by MissTerri; 08-09-2015 at 09:08 PM..
 
Old 08-09-2015, 09:16 PM
 
8,547 posts, read 5,290,015 times
Reputation: 9120
Quote:
Originally Posted by rodentraiser View Post
MIssTerri, you haven't yet answered my question about whether or not mandatory quarantine for a confirmed MDR-TB patient is justified or not. And I think the reason for that is because you yourself wouldn't want to be exposed to someone who was walking around in public and spreading a difficult-to-treat disease, but if you said quarantine was justified for this person, you'd be advocating for public health the same way I am.
You do realize that unvaccinated children are barred from attending school in the case of an outbreak of a VPD for which they are not vaccinated for, right? I'm totally ok with that as it seems reasonable and is not invasive in the way that vaccine mandates are. I consider that to be very similar to a quarantine for an individual with a confirmed case of MDR-TB.
 
Old 08-09-2015, 09:59 PM
 
Location: BC, Arizona
1,170 posts, read 750,892 times
Reputation: 2377
Quote:
Originally Posted by MissTerri View Post

There are tons of more personal stories online. Easy to find for anyone who is interested.
There are lots of stories in libraries too

Facts > stories

Science > opinions
 
Old 08-09-2015, 10:22 PM
 
Location: Earth
4,506 posts, read 5,272,451 times
Reputation: 4933
Science=theory=opinions
 
Old 08-09-2015, 10:39 PM
 
Location: BC, Arizona
1,170 posts, read 750,892 times
Reputation: 2377
Quote:
Originally Posted by Cyborgt800 View Post
Science=theory=opinions
Aren't you actually missing "research" "proof" "data" "studies" "peer reviews" oh, and maybe a medical professional or a thousand? With cool labs and stuff?

See the definition of opinion above - a belief unsupported by fact.
 
Old 08-09-2015, 10:41 PM
 
Location: Earth
4,506 posts, read 5,272,451 times
Reputation: 4933
It's all "fact" until some new information comes along and they have to change everything! How often does that happen? A LOT!
 
Old 08-10-2015, 12:35 AM
 
Location: Georgia, USA
21,583 posts, read 26,243,884 times
Reputation: 26643
Quote:
Originally Posted by MissTerri View Post
Officials were just baffled by the mysterious illness that hit 200+ girls in Bogota Columbia last years. Their symptoms included fainting, headaches, numbness in the hands and feet, etc. All of the girls shared one thing in common which was they had all been recently vaccinated with the HPV vaccine. Despite this common denominator, officials declared it a case of "mass hysteria" just days into the "investigation". Case closed.
You forgot to quote this part:

"None of their symptoms were life-threatening and all have since been released, he said."

Hyperventilation-Topic Overview

Hyperventilation:

"Hyperventilation is breathing that is deeper and more rapid than normal. It causes a decrease in the amount of a gas in the blood (called carbon dioxide, or CO2). This decrease may make you feel lightheaded, have a rapid heartbeat, and be short of breath. It also can lead to numbness or tingling in your hands or feet, anxiety, fainting, and sore chest muscles.

Give me 200 unvaccinated nine to twelve year old girls and I can replicate the situation in Colombia.

Quote:
Denmark, Japan, France, Spain and Columbia are all reviewing efficacy and risks of HPV vaccine after numerous reports of serious adverse reactions from families of those afflicted. Finally!
The US reviews reports of adverse effects, too. Your point?

Quote:
Informal poll from the Providence Journal shows that 65% of respondents do not agree with the HPV mandate.
If enough disagree the HPV mandate may be removed. Victory for the misinformed parents; potentially life altering for some who would have been vaccinated with a mandate and will not without it.


Quote:
There are tons of more personal stories online. Easy to find for anyone who is interested.
Where is the evidence that the conditions in the 'personal stories' were caused by a vaccine?
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