Please register to participate in our discussions with 2 million other members - it's free and quick! Some forums can only be seen by registered members. After you create your account, you'll be able to customize options and access all our 15,000 new posts/day with fewer ads.
I'm going omit the usual statistics, citations to medical journal articles, and publications from the CDC. Nope, this is just me opining.
You have been tolerated for a long time despite the absence of any real evidence that would validate your position in some way. Too long, in the opinion of some of us. What finally brought the situation to a head in California was the measles epidemic that struck Disneyland and spread through a number of states. This is the sort of thing that should have ended fifty years ago, but it didn't because you refused to accept what both the vast majority of this country and the best scientific minds in this country know is fact.
Its been explained to you all many times over that mass vaccination is needed to create herd immunity. We need to have vaccination rates of 90% to 95% for several reasons: some immune compromised people cannot be vaccinated; the vaccines are not 100% effective in people who are given them; and some people who want vaccinations (the poor) have logistical problems getting them. That is why this is more than individual rights question.
Many of you seem unable to digest this relatively simple truth, but it is that, the truth.
Things aren't going to get easier for you. After the law is passed in California, it will likely be passed in other states as well. You are going to be in an increasingly less tenable situation. The courts aren't going to protect you either. These vaccination questions were settled a century ago and the courts haven't changed the way they view them.
Most people who reside within a community accept the fact that certain responsibilities go along with that. Immunizing your kids is right up there with paying taxes and obeying laws. Those who refuse to play by the most elementary rules in the community are going to suffer consequences from refusing to do so.
It would be smart to accept the reality and get your kids vaccinated. If you don't, the train is going to leave the station without you. You probably aren't going to like where you are left. This is not a threat. Its simply a prophesy.
I do not have young children. I am a Senior. If you ever DARE try to force ANY medical intervention on me, you will have to strap me down screaming and fighting with all my strength. I will also call the MEDIA to broadcast "Granny" being "throw off the cliff".
.
I am OLD. I have no "consequences". Try it. Again, I DARE you. You pick on little children, and their parents, who cannot fight back. Bully. Come after we adults, and I guarantee you that you WILL have a fight on your hands. We women have said for decades, our bodies, OUR CHOICE. Well, that applies to medical treatments, AND vaccinations. I don't care about what your science says. I care about my FREEDOM to choose.
Freedom to own your own body. If you lose that to government, like the NAZIS, you have no freedom.
Vaccines prevent the spread of disease to other people. That's why insurance covers it and society wants it.
The fact that vaccines protect you as an individual is merely a nice side effect. But nobody cares if you get these diseases as an individual. Unfortunately, if you get these diseases as an individual, you can spread them to society, which is what we don't actually want.
The Star Ledger reported on feb 11, 2009 of a pertussis outbreak in 21 FULLY vaccinated children in Hunterdon County. In Canada a laboratory confirmed pertussis outbreak occurred among pre school children in Toronto where 90 % were up to date with pertussis vaccination.
A 4 month investigation by The Watchdog Institute to determine how many fully vaccinated children were fully vaccinated. It aired in a documentary in Dec 2010. The revealing research showed that in the nine california counties most affected 44-83% of those who caught pertussis were indeed FULLY vaccinated.
In Ohio and Texas (2 states having a record number of pertussis cases) 75 and 67.5% were also FULLY vaccinated.
24 of the 35 medical experts from "Global Pertussis Initiative" (who recommends vaccine policy to governments) receive funding from Sanofi-Aventis and GlaxoSmithKline vaccine makers.
Guess it won't be long before ANOTHER DPT shot is added to our children's schedule.
Presumably these kids will eventually be part of the community. If they are not vaccinated they could be potential carriers of some plague or another that would place the entire community at risk. This communal risk is far more important than the desire of any individual to personally unvaccinated or to not have their children vaccinated.
I do not think this law goes far enough. It only forbids the children from attending public school if they refuse vaccination. I believe the law should force vaccination unless they is a proven medical reason for allowing the person to not be vaccinated. For example a severe life threatening shock reaction to the vaccine would be a sufficient to deny vaccination. Religious prohibitions would not. Personal fears or desires would not.
There are some situations where the government acting to protect the entire population can use force to implement its policy. Vaccination is one of them.
How do religions feel about vaccination? The major religions have no proscription against vaccination. Even Christian Scientists may vaccinate. Some Dutch Reform churches have in the past declined to vaccinate, but that is not universal and appears to be changing.
The bottom line is that very few Americans have true religious objections to vaccination. Many who claim "religious" exemptions just wish to hide in the herd and let other families take the (tiny) risk associated with vaccination. Anti-vax websites offer instructions on how to lie to get religious exemptions.
Preschool and day care workers in California will need to be immunized against common contagious diseases such as measles and whooping cough, according to a new proposed law that passed a Senate floor vote last week. SB 792, by state Sen. Tony Mendoza (D-Artesia), is designed to protect young children in day care centers, Mendoza said. Some of the required vaccinations prevent illnesses that some children are too young to be immunized against, such as the flu.
"Children below [age] five are too young to be fully vaccinated," Mendoza said. "Having the adults around them be vaccinated creates a community of immunity."
State Sen. John Moorlach (R-Orange) stood in opposition to the bill.
"Just providing notification to the parents of the children that an employee or a volunteer has not had their vaccinations would be more advisable," Moorlach said. "There should be some kind of notification as opposed to a mandatory vaccination."
But Mendoza said notification might come too late.
"These kids are too young to be vaccinated," Mendoza said. "They need the people around them to protect them."
Day care workers can get an exemption with a letter from a medical provider -- or in the case of influenza, just a written declaration declining the flu vaccine.
The legislation is one of three vaccination bills in the Legislature this session, along with SB 277 -- by Sen. Richard Pan (D-Sacramento) -- which would remove the personal exemption for schoolchildren's immunizations, and AB 1117 -- by Assembly member Cristina Garcia (D-Bell Gardens) -- which would push the state to increase vaccination rates among younger children.
The Mendoza bill passed the Senate on a 34-3 vote and now heads to the Assembly.
Presumably these kids will eventually be part of the community. If they are not vaccinated they could be potential carriers of some plague or another that would place the entire community at risk. This communal risk is far more important than the desire of any individual to personally unvaccinated or to not have their children vaccinated.
I do not think this law goes far enough. It only forbids the children from attending public school if they refuse vaccination. I believe the law should force vaccination unless they is a proven medical reason for allowing the person to not be vaccinated. For example a severe life threatening shock reaction to the vaccine would be a sufficient to deny vaccination. Religious prohibitions would not. Personal fears or desires would not.
There are some situations where the government acting to protect the entire population can use force to implement its policy. Vaccination is one of them.
Do you approve of armed government patrols knocking on citizens doors and forcing them to be vaccinated? My own case as an adult. I have never had a Tdap, let alone what the CDC recommends. Should I be locked up and forced to get that as adult? What you are describing is a POLICE STATE. The American public would fight that. All because of that Measles outbreak? Do you really fear sickness that much to give up our liberties are Americans? Study the Third Reich. Maybe that will open up your eyes on what you are calling for.
I will not comply with what you are advocating. Throw Granny in a concentration camp, but first you will have to know what every single man, woman, and child, has received what, or what not, vaccinations. I suppose HIPPA goes out the window too with that Police State
The Star Ledger reported on feb 11, 2009 of a pertussis outbreak in 21 FULLY vaccinated children in Hunterdon County. In Canada a laboratory confirmed pertussis outbreak occurred among pre school children in Toronto where 90 % were up to date with pertussis vaccination.
A 4 month investigation by The Watchdog Institute to determine how many fully vaccinated children were fully vaccinated. It aired in a documentary in Dec 2010. The revealing research showed that in the nine california counties most affected 44-83% of those who caught pertussis were indeed FULLY vaccinated.
In Ohio and Texas (2 states having a record number of pertussis cases) 75 and 67.5% were also FULLY vaccinated.
24 of the 35 medical experts from "Global Pertussis Initiative" (who recommends vaccine policy to governments) receive funding from Sanofi-Aventis and GlaxoSmithKline vaccine makers.
Guess it won't be long before ANOTHER DPT shot is added to our children's schedule.
Yes, some vaccinated children get pertussis.
Yes, the pertussis vaccine is less effective than some others, including the measles vaccine.
However, the risk of getting whooping cough is 23 times higher for children who are not vaccinated compared to those who are.
In any outbreak, the absolute number of cases who have been vaccinated may exceed the absolute number of cases who were not vaccinated. That is because most people are vaccinated. There are lots more of them. What your numbers are leaving out is how many vaccinated persons do not get whooping cough.
"Myth #4:Most people who get sick during outbreaks are vaccinated.
Most people who get sick during outbreaks are not vaccinated when you consider the percentage of vaccinated and unvaccinated in the outbreak.
Although the absolute number of cases in some outbreaks might include many people who have been partially or completely vaccinated, that is simply because so many more people have received all of their vaccines as compared to those who have skipped one or more vaccines. It is much more important to look at the attack rate in vaccinated and unvaccinated people in an outbreak.
Consider a school of 1000 kids and 44 of them get mumps during an outbreak, 29 are vaccinated and 15 aren't. If 95% of the people in the school are vaccinated, then even though it seems like far more vaccinated than unvaccinated kids got mumps, since there were far fewer unvaccinated kids in the school (50 unvaccinated kids vs 950 vaccinated kids), the attack rate is far higher among those who didn't get a vaccine. In fact, in this example, those were not vaccinated had a 10 times higher chance of developing mumps than those who were vaccinated, even though more vaccinated kids got sick (remember that only 35 unvaccinated kids didn't get mumps, while 921 vaccinated were protected and didn't get the mumps) and their vaccine was about 90% effective at keeping them from catching mumps.
You clearly have to research the numbers on these outbreaks a little before believing that most of the people are vaccinated."
Anti-vax sites like the ones you cited are being deliberately misleading and dishonest when they try to use those numbers to discredit vaccines.
Please register to post and access all features of our very popular forum. It is free and quick. Over $68,000 in prizes has already been given out to active posters on our forum. Additional giveaways are planned.
Detailed information about all U.S. cities, counties, and zip codes on our site: City-data.com.
Please register to participate in our discussions with 2 million other members - it's free and quick! Some forums can only be seen by registered members. After you create your account, you'll be able to customize options and access all our 15,000 new posts/day with fewer ads.
Ah, well, I'll just hand you a sponge soaked in vinegar to heal your gaping chest wound, since that seemed to help Jesus out so well.
