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Old 07-08-2015, 11:05 AM
 
Location: At the corner of happy and free
6,471 posts, read 6,668,763 times
Reputation: 16345

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Quote:
Originally Posted by katjonjj View Post
Actually I worked as a lab tech in Microbiology both in college and later in the medical field. Strep in all it's forms (from causing meningitis to strep throat) is still a member of the genus Streptococcus and family Streptococcaceae. Antibiotic resistant strep is simply different because it is resistant to antibiotics.

Streptococcus | bacterium genus | Britannica.com
My career was in medical laboratories, so I'm far from ignorant on the topic. Yes, of course, a mutated strep is still a strep, but it is simply not true that just because a person's immune system can fight off one form they can fight off all.

I do agree that it's good to avoid antibiotics and give one's immune system a chance to fight an infection. But antibiotics have saved countless lives.

 
Old 07-08-2015, 11:09 AM
 
8,009 posts, read 10,417,066 times
Reputation: 15032
Quote:
Originally Posted by katjonjj View Post
Actually there's far more evidence to suggest that a myriad of factors causes the brain to regress as in ASD. However, there is always a trigger which is most likely environmental.

Though I don't think it is just vaccines that can act as a trigger, this study showed it does seem causal.

"Autism spectrum disorders (ASD) are serious multisystem developmental disorders and an urgent global public health concern. Dysfunctional immunity and impaired brain function are core deficits in ASD. Aluminum (Al), the most commonly used vaccine adjuvant, is a demonstrated neurotoxin and a strong immune stimulator."

"Our results show that: (i) children from countries with the highest ASD prevalence appear to have the highest exposure to Al from vaccines; (ii) the increase in exposure to Al adjuvants significantly correlates with the increase in ASD prevalence in the United States observed over the last two decades (Pearson r=0.92, p<0.0001); and (iii) a significant correlation exists between the amounts of Al administered to preschool children and the current prevalence of ASD in seven Western countries, particularly at 3-4 months of age (Pearson r=0.89-0.94, p=0.0018-0.0248). The application of the Hill's criteria to these data indicates that the correlation between Al in vaccines and ASD may be causal. Because children represent a fraction of the population most at risk for complications following exposure to Al, a more rigorous evaluation of Al adjuvant safety seems warranted."
Do aluminum vaccine adjuvants contribute to the rising prevalence of autism? - PubMed - NCBI

They also found an imbalance in copper/zinc ratios in ASD children so there are likely many causes which is why some parents don't want to play russian roulette with vaccines, just like they want their child to have proper nutrition. I respect their choices and their right to make those choices.
Although I agree that there is an environmental trigger for autism, I think vaccines aren't it. They have been studied extensively and no link has been found. Those countries that report a higher prevalence of ASD also have more exposure to BPA, plastics, food additives, GMOs, pesticides, are more likely to be formula fed, etc. All of these chemical exposures became prevalent about the same time ASD became more prevalent. You can't just say, well, it's the vaccines, because there are a tons of other things it could be as well. It's time to start researching some of these other things. Anti-vaxxers like to point out all these other countries that don't vaccinate and have lower rates of autism, but they also don't have exposure to a lot of things western countries do. They also don't have the increase in allergies that western countries do, which I think is also related.
 
Old 07-08-2015, 11:12 AM
 
Location: The analog world
17,077 posts, read 13,354,470 times
Reputation: 22904
Quote:
Originally Posted by kayanne View Post
My career was in medical laboratories, so I'm far from ignorant on the topic. Yes, of course, a mutated strep is still a strep, but it is simply not true that just because a person's immune system can fight off one form they can fight off all.

I do agree that it's good to avoid antibiotics and give one's immune system a chance to fight an infection. But antibiotics have saved countless lives.
I don't mess around with a verified bacterial infection, and I always request a culture to ensure the right antibiotic has been prescribed. Then, I take every pill exactly as prescribed. A big part of the problem is that some people do not do this. They take two pills, feel better, and then stick the remainder of the scrip in the medicine cabinet.
 
Old 07-08-2015, 12:12 PM
 
Location: Marquette, Mich
1,316 posts, read 747,009 times
Reputation: 2823
Hey, so I'm one of those lucky individuals that had a terrible, life-threatening reaction to a vaccine. It was 45+ years ago, and a reaction to the pertussis vaccination. It was fast and terrible, but I recovered. And guess what. I got ALL my other vaccinations on schedule. I have vaccinated my children. And, after some hefty research by my doctor, we decided to try again, as the vaccination is different than it was 45+ years ago. I had no reaction whatsoever. So, I think I have a LITTLE more credibility worrying about reactions to vaccines--and I still know the right thing to do.

Oh, and I had the WORST case of chicken pox anyone's ever seen. If I can spare my children the horror I went through (not to mention secondary infections, scarring on my eyes & mucous membranes, and the scars left on my skin), I will. These are serious things, people. Anyone who says "just the chicken pox" should have to live through one day of what I suffered. Now, my fear is shingles. And I am terrified of it because of the severity of my chicken pox--I am counting days until I can get the vaccine for that.
 
Old 07-08-2015, 12:23 PM
 
Location: Seattle, Washington
8,435 posts, read 10,521,971 times
Reputation: 1739
Quote:
Originally Posted by mm57553 View Post
Although I agree that there is an environmental trigger for autism, I think vaccines aren't it. They have been studied extensively and no link has been found. Those countries that report a higher prevalence of ASD also have more exposure to BPA, plastics, food additives, GMOs, pesticides, are more likely to be formula fed, etc. All of these chemical exposures became prevalent about the same time ASD became more prevalent. You can't just say, well, it's the vaccines, because there are a tons of other things it could be as well. It's time to start researching some of these other things. Anti-vaxxers like to point out all these other countries that don't vaccinate and have lower rates of autism, but they also don't have exposure to a lot of things western countries do. They also don't have the increase in allergies that western countries do, which I think is also related.
The problem is that vaccines haven't been extensively studied properly, IMO. Using the ingredients of the vaccine without the bacteria/virus as a placebo for safety testing is not right while it may be fine in establishing efficacy. For safety testing, what if it is one of the other ingredients that is actually dangerous? Of course the results of the placebo vs vaccine would have the same side effects.

"Historically, the non-clinical safety assessment for preventive vaccines has often not included toxicity studies in animal models. This is because vaccines have not been viewed as inherently toxic, and vaccines are generally administered in limited dosages over months or even years." FDA Workshop Discussion 2002 pages 11-12

The discussion goes on to say that more ingredients are being used in newer vaccines and more vaccines are added to the schedule. Also that some of these vaccines are for diseases that a person is likely never to encounter. (My paraphrase)

Why don't they study injecting those ingredients more intensively. Some of those ingredients are known toxins in larger amounts but have never been studied for safety as injections let alone as a cocktail or as would be delivered if on the vaccine schedule.

I think that the person who says "vaccines are highly safe and effective" have never really investigated vaccines. They are deemed safe because they are "have not been viewed as inherently toxic."
 
Old 07-08-2015, 12:27 PM
 
Location: Marquette, Mich
1,316 posts, read 747,009 times
Reputation: 2823
Quote:
Originally Posted by katjonjj View Post
T

Also that some of these vaccines are for diseases that a person is likely never to encounter. (My paraphrase)
Because the population is vaccinated, perhaps? How do you think diseases, especially highly contagious diseases, are eradicated?
 
Old 07-08-2015, 12:51 PM
 
Location: colorado springs, CO
9,512 posts, read 6,092,135 times
Reputation: 28836
From the law office of Morgan & Verkamp, Ohio:

FOR IMMEDIATE RELEASE-AUGUST 27,2014:

STATEMENT OF WILLIAM W. THOMPSON, Ph.D., REGARDING THE 2004 ARTICLE EXAMINING THE POSSIBILITY OF A RELATIONSHIP BETWEEN MMR VACCINE AND AUTISM[SIZE=4]
“My name is William Thompson. I am a Senior Scientist with the Centers for Disease Control and Prevention, where I have worked since 1998.

I regret that my coauthors and I omitted statistically significant information in our 2004 article published in the journal Pediatrics.

The omitted data suggested that African American males who received the MMR vaccine before age 36 months were at increased risk for autism.

Decisions were made regarding which findings to report after the data were collected, and I believe that the final study protocol was not followed.”[/SIZE]
[SIZE=2][SIZE=2]http://www.morganverkamp.com/august-27-2014-press-release-statement-of-william-w-thompson-ph-d-regarding-the-2004-article-examining-the-possibility-of-a-relationship-between-mmr-vaccine-and-autism/[/SIZE][/SIZE][SIZE=2][SIZE=2][/SIZE][/SIZE]
 
Old 07-08-2015, 12:54 PM
 
Location: BC, Arizona
1,170 posts, read 1,022,658 times
Reputation: 2378
Quote:
Originally Posted by katjonjj View Post
The problem is that vaccines haven't been extensively studied properly, IMO.
...

I think that the person who says "vaccines are highly safe and effective" have never really investigated vaccines. They are deemed safe because they are "have not been viewed as inherently toxic."
WRONG. Your statements are completely manufactured to support an agenda. Vaccines have been extensively studied, you just don't like the science.

The risk of severe adverse reaction of any kind (read slowly if that makes it easier...) is less than 1 in a million, less than the odds of the vaccinated child becoming a Billionaire.

Anti-vax/anti-science advocates just keep "really really hoping" that somewhere there is data to support their Jenny McCarthy fueled suspicions.

Just because a vitamin salesperson somewhere told you to read the "study" on their blog (usually based on the completely debunked fraudulent work of Wakefield who lost his medical license over the fraud), doesn't mean there hasn't been robust, peer reviewed studies showing NO link to autism.

Parents, vaccinate your children - keep them safe from life threatening serious illnesses (and prevent the spread to those around them who are too young/old or immune compromised to themselves be vaccinated).

 
Old 07-08-2015, 01:07 PM
 
Location: Dallas,Texas
1,379 posts, read 1,760,312 times
Reputation: 1482
Quote:
Originally Posted by J24 View Post
100000% for. Putting other children at risk simply because you can't do research and are trying to be hip is the most ridiculous thing I've ever heard of. Parents who refuse to get their kids vaccinated because they think they know better than medical professionals and HISTORY are idiots.
Complete and utter idiots. The benefits of vaccination far, far outweigh any negative things that may result from vaccinations. Vaccinations have done so much to rid or greatly reduce the effects of horrible viruses on this planet that can cause so much pain and death. This is one case where the overall safety of a given population override your stupidity in not understanding the huge benefits of vaccination. I also think parents who refuse to give their children vaccinations and then later when that child may contract a virus that vaccine could have prevented, should be charged with child abuse. I hate to see children suffer because of the idiotic, unintelligent, irresponsible behavior of their parents.

Benefits vs. Risks | Immunize for Good
 
Old 07-08-2015, 02:06 PM
 
Location: Foot of the Rockies
90,297 posts, read 120,694,120 times
Reputation: 35920
Quote:
Originally Posted by MissTerri View Post
She did treat the strep. She treated it with herbs, many of which are antiviral (garlic is one example) rather then with antibiotics.
That is very dangerous. You and she should look up scarlet fever, rheumatic fever, and glomerulonehritis, all complications of untreated strep. Antivirals will do nothing for bacteria.
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