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Old 07-24-2015, 03:03 PM
 
Location: Southeast Michigan
2,839 posts, read 1,687,979 times
Reputation: 4521

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Quote:
Originally Posted by Ted Bear View Post
You start somewhere. Ban the manufacture of new guns. Inventory and secure new production. Get 10 million guns off the street each year. Do something, rather than blat about it while we have our daily dose of gun deaths--which are so commonplace now that they don't even register on the horror scale---but rank high up on the stupid scale.
And in the majority of these gun deaths the perpetrators (and most of the victims) make up a tiny minority of the US population.

You want to solve the gun violence problem, get rid of the ghettos and ghetto mentality.

Then you'd see much of the problem go away.

The murder rates in Vermont and Iowa are lower than in Sweden. Why ?
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Old 07-24-2015, 03:05 PM
 
3,041 posts, read 1,816,779 times
Reputation: 3737
The White homicide rate in the US reflects modern no gun western europe. Whites own the majority of firearms in the US.

So much for blaming guns!
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Old 07-24-2015, 03:08 PM
 
5,897 posts, read 6,675,395 times
Reputation: 15202
Quote:
Originally Posted by Ummagumma View Post

How's banning drugs been working out so far ?
"Banning" things doesn't do anything. We don't need any more "soft" legislation. We need hard action.

As to the poster who asked abut his property rights, what about them? Have your gun, but keep it registered, and locked away in a secure central facility. Check it out, use it for recreation, check it in. Ditto ammunition. It is the best of all worlds.

There are certain things which simply are not warranted in individual hands....a nuclear armament, for extreme example. Does that prohibition 'violate' your property rights? No. It simply makes sense not to have it in public hands. The same goes for guns: they have no purpose in general circulation.
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Old 07-24-2015, 03:12 PM
 
3,041 posts, read 1,816,779 times
Reputation: 3737
Quote:
Originally Posted by Ted Bear View Post
"Banning" things doesn't do anything. We don't need any more "soft" legislation. We need hard action.

As to the poster who asked abut his property rights, what about them? Have your gun, but keep it registered, and locked away in a secure central facility. Check it out, use it for recreation, check it in. Ditto ammunition. It is the best of all worlds.

There are certain things which simply are not warranted in individual hands....a nuclear armament, for extreme example. Does that prohibition 'violate' your property rights? No. It simply makes sense not to have it in public hands. The same goes for guns: they have no purpose in general circulation.
Property I cannot posses? LMFAO


You want civil war 2? Go for it. It will go against that crusade for reducing violence tho.
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Old 07-24-2015, 03:15 PM
 
3,041 posts, read 1,816,779 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Ted Bear View Post
"Banning" things doesn't do anything. We don't need any more "soft" legislation. We need hard action.

As to the poster who asked abut his property rights, what about them? Have your gun, but keep it registered, and locked away in a secure central facility. Check it out, use it for recreation, check it in. Ditto ammunition. It is the best of all worlds.

There are certain things which simply are not warranted in individual hands....a nuclear armament, for extreme example. Does that prohibition 'violate' your property rights? No. It simply makes sense not to have it in public hands. The same goes for guns: they have no purpose in general circulation.
Why is it the people who own the most guns have a homicide rate reflecting gun free western Europe?

Stats wiz Nate Silver: For black Americans, US is about as dangerous as Rwanda

"As he explained to me on the latest episode of The Katie Halper Show, “If you’re a white person your chance of being murdered every year is 2.5 out of 10,000… If you’re a black person it’s 19.4, so almost eight times higher.”

To put this into context, Silver explained, the murder rate for white Americans is similar to the murder rate for people living in Finland, Chile or Israel. The murder rate for black Americans, on the other hand, is similar to the rate found “in developing countries that are war zones even, like Myanmar, or Rwanda, Mexico, Brazil, Nigeria, places that have vast disorder. "
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Old 07-24-2015, 03:16 PM
 
Location: DFW - Coppell / Las Colinas
31,790 posts, read 36,452,992 times
Reputation: 38196
Quote:
Originally Posted by dpm1 View Post
Property I cannot posses? LMFAO


You want civil war 2? Go for it. It will go against that crusade for reducing violence tho.
Just because he has no use for guns, he thinks we don't either.
My gun is a tool just like my car. Cars kill way more than guns yet we don't confiscate everyone's cars.

It's the same old argument and Mr Bear will never understand.
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Old 07-24-2015, 03:25 PM
 
15,062 posts, read 19,636,914 times
Reputation: 12219
Quote:
Originally Posted by Robin Tailor View Post
Gun control that Obama is talking about probably won't solve the problem now.
We live in bleak and unstable times when people are loosing the ground and confidence in the future more often... Who is to blame?
Look everybody!!!
We found a way to blame Obama
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Old 07-24-2015, 03:27 PM
 
Location: Southeast Michigan
2,839 posts, read 1,687,979 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Ted Bear View Post
"Banning" things doesn't do anything. We don't need any more "soft" legislation. We need hard action.
Here are the murder rates for some very gun friendly US states. The numbers are murders per 100K people.

New Hampshire 1.0

Vermont 1.1

Iowa 1.2

Idaho 1.3

And here are the murder rates by country:

Norway 2.2

Finland 1.6

Belgium 1.6

Russia 9.2

(Sweden had 2.0 in another source but here's listed at a much lower rate so I didn't include it).

Please, do explain why NH and VT have half the murder rate of Norway ?

Quote:
Originally Posted by Ted Bear View Post
As to the poster who asked abut his property rights, what about them? Have your gun, but keep it registered, and locked away in a secure central facility. Check it out, use it for recreation, check it in. Ditto ammunition. It is the best of all worlds.

There are certain things which simply are not warranted in individual hands....a nuclear armament, for extreme example. Does that prohibition 'violate' your property rights? No. It simply makes sense not to have it in public hands. The same goes for guns: they have no purpose in general circulation.
One of the purposes of legal guns in general circulation is to counter the effect of illegal guns. If you're accosted by some dope head with an illegal gun, the police will gladly come after the fact to collect your body and take witness' statements, but only being armed gives you at least a chance to survive the ordeal.

When all of the US has the murder rate of NH, I may change my views on this.
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Old 07-24-2015, 03:30 PM
 
Location: Secure Bunker
5,464 posts, read 2,489,360 times
Reputation: 5242
Quote:
Originally Posted by NJGOAT View Post
I posted this in the theater shooting thread, but it belongs here...

***
I am pro gun control, not because I think it will stop these kinds of shootings, it most likely won't. I am pro gun control because I think it will help stop the thousands of other gun deaths that occur. Deaths at the hands of criminals who attain their guns through blackmarket channels, almost all of which universally started out as legally purchased firearms. I think there are some very clear steps we can take...

1. All firearms owners/purchasers need to be licensed. This involves taking a test, demonstrating knowledge of basic safety and control, background checks and mental health screenings. It needs to be renewed every so often and that renewal can be streamlined. Think like a drivers license. There would be different levels of license for different types of firearms. This license would be valid in all 50 states.

2. Every individual firearm is registered to its owner in a national database. If you want to sell or purchase a gun private party, the registration needs to be transferred to the new owner. This transfer can be done at a police station or through a firearms dealer. Gun owners are responsible for their firearms at all times and can be charged with accessory if one of their guns is used in a crime if it can be proven that they committed some form of negligence.

3. There would be limits on the types of firearms allowed for private ownership as well as limits on things like magazine size. However, these regulations would be universal to all 50 states and all 50 states would allow concealed carry, assuming the persons license contained the CCW provision and they had been properly trained.

There you go, common sense gun control.
None of that is going to prevent criminals from killing people with guns. You want to greatly reduce gun deaths? Take 2 steps:

1) If a criminal commits a crime using a gun he gets life, no parole. First time, every time. If he gets caught in simple illegal possession of a gun he gets 10 years, no parole. Make all prisons hard labor that pay for themselves (as 90% of them did prior to `1940).

2) Teach firearms safety in public and private schools. Remove the mystery, encourage safety through actual handling of firearms.

Regsitration databases, etc... that's all admin garbage. Won't prevent a single physical crime.
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Old 07-24-2015, 03:34 PM
 
Location: Southeast Michigan
2,839 posts, read 1,687,979 times
Reputation: 4521
Quote:
Originally Posted by Tyster View Post
None of that is going to prevent criminals from killing people with guns. You want to greatly reduce gun deaths? Take 2 steps:

1) If a criminal commits a crime using a gun he gets life, no parole. First time, every time. If he gets caught in simple illegal possession of a gun he gets 10 years, no parole. Make all prisons hard labor that pay for themselves (as 90% of them did prior to `1940).

2) Teach firearms safety in public and private schools. Remove the mystery, encourage safety through actual handling of firearms.

Regsitration databases, etc... that's all admin garbage. Won't prevent a single physical crime.
Absolutely correct on both points.
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